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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Smash Brothers: What am I getting myself into?

I'm brand new to this series, and I was wondering what I'm getting myself into. I owned the games before; however, I didn't have anyone to play them with. Now, there's online, so I have a reason to play this game. What I was wondering is how deep is the gameplay? I'll be honest. When I had the Gamecube game, I didn't give it much of a chance. I wrote it off without much thought, and I might of missed out on a kick ass game because of that. The reason I didn't like it was because of the button mashing and the fact that there was energy bar. Instead, there was that 100% thing. I did not like that at all. Here are some general questions:

 

Auto-Gaurd: If you guys have ever played a King of Fighters game, you will know what I'm talking about. Kyo Kusanagi, the Ryu of the series, had this. In a few of his moves, when you peformed them, there would a spark if you were to get hit when doing the move. It looks like you did some kind of just defence or a parry. What happens is you take the hit and continue with your attack, both uneffected and undamaged. Does this game have that?

 

Priority: This is something I shouldn't have to explaine, as I'm sure everyone on this site knows what this term means. If not, I'll explain. Rember in Street Fighters Ken, Ryu and Akuma had an attack called "Shoryuken"? This attack worked great as an anti-air move. Furthermore, it could cancle out pretty much everthing someone tried to hit you with. For instense, if someone were to try and punch you, you could use the Shoryuken. What would happen, you ask? Your Shoryuken would serve as a counter attack, per se. Your move would have priority over there's, and it will hit him as if he never even attacked.

 

I have more questions about this series, trust me. 



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This is not a button mashing game. If you play with people who know what they're doing, button mashing will get you KO'd in no time.

Try watching some YouTube videos of tournaments (I know they're out there).

As for the % meter, it's exactly like an energy bar, except that there isn't an "end" where you automatically lose. You can be at 150% (one good hit could send you flying) yet still manage to pound on your opponents and come out with a win. There's always a glimmer of hope if you can avoid the hard hits...and flying items....and explosions....and environmental hazzards...and assist trophies....



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What you are talking about are no flinch frames in games I suppose. In melee and brawl there is a technique called Direction Influence, DI for short. It essentially gives you limited control over how your character moves when hit. By holding towards the ground, when you are hit, you ground your character. Characters can perform an attack, hold down, and even if they are hit, will still complete their attack. There are many variables to this, such as the strength of the opponents attack, how heavy the character you are using, and how much percentage of damage you have. The lightest of characters will flinch from all but the weakest attacks at perfect health, and vice versa with bigger characters. I think all characters stop having any flinch frames after 40% damage or something like that. Yoshi has permanent no flinch frames in the air passively on his second jump.

Shoryuken from SF had so much priority because the move had invincibility frames. Frames where you could not get hit while performing. There are definitely those moves in smash, but the game is very fast and dynamic and the timing for a counterattack is much stricter than street fighter.



The gameplay is extremely deep in the existing series, attacks can be quantified by priority, penetration, damage, speed, power, and knockback.

Priority - you already know this one
Penetration - is sort of like priority only it has to do with the timing of the attack and how far into their attack they can be before your attack can no longer interrupt.
Power - Similar to penetration but the physical strength of the attack.

Penetration, power, and priority make up the building blocks of how they determine which counters effect which other attacks and at what timings.

Damage - this is pretty much the amount of % damage it does to the player but keep in mind that the more times you use a move consecutively the less and less effective it becomes here.
Speed - how long the move actually takes to execute from the time the game recieves user input to the time the move is complete
Knockback - This is basically how far the attack throws the opponent, this is extremely important in Smash.

Thats how it works to my knowledge, but be aware I am far from an expert and this is only how it was explained to me. Even if this isn't the exact details of how it works this should at least give you a fair idea of the depth of the game at the level you are talking about.

Also keep in mind that there are a ridiculous number of dodge types in S. Smash Bros. Melee. Some of them aren't in the instruction book and even people who play on a regular basis don't know. A great example of that would be z-dodging ...but again actual experienced players could tell you more.



To Each Man, Responsibility

Random Person B, that's exactly the type of post I was looking for! Here's a question for you: Are there moves simular to the DP motion moves in Street Fighters in terms of invisible frames, priority and no start up?



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Technically, your percentage bar has a limit (999%) but it's not like anyone ever gets there without setting the health to start there.

Yes, it's a VERY deep game--play like a button masher and you'll get your ass handed to you by anyone with the faintest idea of what they're doing.



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You keep asking for anti-air and invicibility-frame moves, but Smash isn't really that kind of game. There are lots of variables, lots of positions a character can be in, and one move really isn't ever going to save you.

It's best to get a grip on a number of moves and learn how to use them in succession, rather than focus on one particular attack move.



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yeah, really, the reason why I love this game is that you develop actual fighting styles when you fight in this thing. You never know when you're going to win or lose for certain, because it's possible to get a good opportunity and KO someone at only 30%, but then turn around and have them last to 250% on their next life becasue they're being tenacious.

there's also the fact that different boards give different advantages too. it's not just flat left right boards, but you have entire arenas that you'll have to navigate, allowing you to jump away from attacks and pick multiple paths through which to try to engage your opponent.

There are certain characters who have really good abilities. My personal favorite is Marth. He doesn't have any long range attacks, but his melee attacks have a long reach. On top of that, his attacks are the most powerful at the very outer edge of his reach, which ensure that you can basically dart in and out of combat, placing blows that don't give your opponent a chance to hit you back properly.
He also has good recovery time after being hit, and after executing a move, and he also has a counter attack, that you can activate it to automatically block your opponent's attack and then launch an immediate attack back at them, which is incredibly useful for breaking out of and reversing someone who is pummeling you at a constant rate.
However it's also a matter of personal style, as some people prefer kirby for his flight, Link for his wide variety of skills, or Ganondorf for his insane power.

What you also have to understand is that many characters had their moves altered or nerfed when they went from the N64 version to Melee (Kirby got slowed down a HUGE amount) and I expect much the same to happen in the transition to Brawl.

there's a great deal of strategy to this game, and a lot of it isn't something you can pick up consciously. I know i have a very distinct strategy when I play the game, but I honestly can't put words to it due to the sheer subtlety that the game has.



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there are no complicated control inputs. You will never have to do that z motion or quarter circles. Controls will always be direction, button, button + direction, or button + direction at same time. This may sound basic, but its a lot more complex in practice. There are moves with 1 frame start up, moves with high priority, anti air.

Despite having these things, the questions you are asking doesn't describe the game very well. All that stuff is helpful, but there a lot variables in this game. What might be a normally reliable anti air move might be completely worthless in one situation. The game is dynamic, in traditional 2d fighters if you do an attack, the attack will do the same thing everytime, regardless of how much health you or your opponent have. In smash its complete chaos at times. Honestly, the best way to get to know this game is to just play it. The experience is rather unique when it comes to 2D fighters. Some of the stuff I mentioned wont even come up with most players.

 this game is closer to power stone than street fighter.



Melee has loads of advanced techniques that are really hard to grasp. This video covers them pretty well.

(no, it's not a rickroll this time ^^ )