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Forums - Sony Discussion - The PS2 is doomed (2000)

___O_o______ on 13 January 2008
Avinash_Tyagi said:
CrazzyMan said:
those 15% are the same guys who buy things like MGS, FF, DMC, etc. so basically you've got maybe 20% of the PS2's fanbase buying a PS3, if you consider some overlap, and that is at most.

I wonder, how will you PROVE that? =)))))

Wasn't one game, that is what you are making the mistke, it isn't one game that sells a system, largest library wins, always, its the tons of shovelware and casual games that win

So, all those over 40 games won`t be released on PS3, or WHAT is your POINT? They will be released on Wii? =))
I see already Star ocean on wii, also Tekken on wii, also Kingdom hearts on wii. =)))

OK. How many of these games:
Virtua Fighter
Soul calibur
Wild arms
Front Mission
Z.O.E
Resident Evil
Silent Hill
Dino Crysis
Devil May cry
Kingdom Hearts
Medal Of Honor
Ridge Racer
Tales of ...
Disgaea
Valkyrie profile
Persona
Grand Theft Auto
Burnout
Crash Bandicoot
Onimusha
Ace Combat
Ratchet and Clank
Xenosaga
Guitar Hero
Metal slug
Armored Core
Star ocean
Spyro
Breath of fire
Chrono ...
Grandia

will be released on wii?
won`t be released on PS3?
also you have facts, that only 20 mln. of gamers care about THESE games and 100 mln. DON`T care? =) Can you prove that? =)


And those games appeal to who, RPG gamers, fighter gamers, etc. hardcore games, with the exception of a couple I see no casual games, you see my point the PS3 appeals to one niche only


   This "one niche" you're talking about appealed to over 100 million people last generation. 



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HappySqurriel on 13 January 2008
CrazzyMan said:
Yes but more games aren't coming out, just those hardcore games, Wii has the casual games this gen, hence why your argument fails

LOL. So HOW many casual games from 3rd PARTIES did over 1 mln. on Wii?
5 games from 15? So how situation differs from GC? =))
What new games not from Nintendo you expect to break 1 mln. in 2008?

GC had 38 games and only 15 games not from nintendo. =]
And those games appeal to who, RPG gamers, fighter gamers, etc. hardcore games, with the exception of a couple I see no casual games, you see my point the PS3 appeals to one niche only

But, can you PROVE, that these games were buying same 20% of PS2 user base?

CrazzyMan for months you've been making long meaningless lists of games that have (so far) failed to spur PS3 sales, sell particularly well, or (in many cases) even be good games ...

The facts are that games like Gran Turismo, Final Fantasy and Metal Gear Solid had a high percentage of their owners who owned all (or at least many) of these games; this is not (particularly) surprising to anyone. Of those who only owned one game, they (probably) tended to be very casual (in the classic definition) and choose these games because they were a high profile game ON A SYSTEM THEY OWNED.

The number of people who will buy a PS3 for any (or all) of these games, that have not currently bought a PS3 (or will not buy one in the near future) is small.



brute on 13 January 2008
Avinash_Tyagi said:

 Most people didn't care about gaming, why do you think Nintendo is trying to do with the Wii, what did Reggie say in E3 2006?  Do you know people who never read books or watch TV or go to the movies?  How about video games?

 

Most games never appeal to the full userbase of any console, even packins


well wii sports seems to be appealing to most of the wii owners,and no i dont know anyof the people that dont do any entertainment



tag:"reviews only matter for the real hardcore gamer"

Avinash_Tyagi on 13 January 2008
___O_o______ said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
CrazzyMan said:
those 15% are the same guys who buy things like MGS, FF, DMC, etc. so basically you've got maybe 20% of the PS2's fanbase buying a PS3, if you consider some overlap, and that is at most.

I wonder, how will you PROVE that? =)))))

Wasn't one game, that is what you are making the mistke, it isn't one game that sells a system, largest library wins, always, its the tons of shovelware and casual games that win

So, all those over 40 games won`t be released on PS3, or WHAT is your POINT? They will be released on Wii? =))
I see already Star ocean on wii, also Tekken on wii, also Kingdom hearts on wii. =)))

OK. How many of these games:
Virtua Fighter
Soul calibur
Wild arms
Front Mission
Z.O.E
Resident Evil
Silent Hill
Dino Crysis
Devil May cry
Kingdom Hearts
Medal Of Honor
Ridge Racer
Tales of ...
Disgaea
Valkyrie profile
Persona
Grand Theft Auto
Burnout
Crash Bandicoot
Onimusha
Ace Combat
Ratchet and Clank
Xenosaga
Guitar Hero
Metal slug
Armored Core
Star ocean
Spyro
Breath of fire
Chrono ...
Grandia

will be released on wii?
won`t be released on PS3?
also you have facts, that only 20 mln. of gamers care about THESE games and 100 mln. DON`T care? =) Can you prove that? =)


And those games appeal to who, RPG gamers, fighter gamers, etc. hardcore games, with the exception of a couple I see no casual games, you see my point the PS3 appeals to one niche only


   This "one niche" you're talking about appealed to over 100 million people last generation. 


 Wrong, the PS2 appealed to 100 million +, PS3 will not

 

PS2 had a large and varied library PS3 will not

 

PS3 is not the PS2 



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

Avinash_Tyagi on 13 January 2008
brute said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:

 Most people didn't care about gaming, why do you think Nintendo is trying to do with the Wii, what did Reggie say in E3 2006?  Do you know people who never read books or watch TV or go to the movies?  How about video games?

 

Most games never appeal to the full userbase of any console, even packins


well wii sports seems to be appealing to most of the wii owners,and no i dont know anyof the people that dont do any entertainment


 Not any entertainment, I was referring to the difference between gaming compared to mass medias, a lot of people don't game but they do those other things.

 

Wii sports is appealing to a lot of casuals, and people new to gaming, like my parents, but I also know of a lot of people who aren't interested in the game, they prefer stuff like mario and zelda



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

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brute on 13 January 2008
HappySqurriel said:
CrazzyMan said:
Yes but more games aren't coming out, just those hardcore games, Wii has the casual games this gen, hence why your argument fails

LOL. So HOW many casual games from 3rd PARTIES did over 1 mln. on Wii?
5 games from 15? So how situation differs from GC? =))
What new games not from Nintendo you expect to break 1 mln. in 2008?

GC had 38 games and only 15 games not from nintendo. =]
And those games appeal to who, RPG gamers, fighter gamers, etc. hardcore games, with the exception of a couple I see no casual games, you see my point the PS3 appeals to one niche only

But, can you PROVE, that these games were buying same 20% of PS2 user base?

CrazzyMan for months you've been making long meaningless lists of games that have (so far) failed to spur PS3 sales, sell particularly well, or (in many cases) even be good games ...

The facts are that games like Gran Turismo, Final Fantasy and Metal Gear Solid had a high percentage of their owners who owned all (or at least many) of these games; this is not (particularly) surprising to anyone. Of those who only owned one game, they (probably) tended to be very casual (in the classic definition) and choose these games because they were a high profile game ON A SYSTEM THEY OWNED.

The number of people who will buy a PS3 for any (or all) of these games, that have not currently bought a PS3 (or will not buy one in the near future) is small.


while you are mostly correct,i think they will sell a little more then you expect i think GT will sell to a certain crowd different fomr the others so will FF sell to a certain crowd different from the others,and i think MGS4 will be the smallest system seller though will be bought alot from the people that already own the console though the biggest system seller last gen is now on 2 consoles so we shall see who it will help more



tag:"reviews only matter for the real hardcore gamer"

Avinash_Tyagi on 13 January 2008
brute said:
HappySqurriel said:
CrazzyMan said:
Yes but more games aren't coming out, just those hardcore games, Wii has the casual games this gen, hence why your argument fails

LOL. So HOW many casual games from 3rd PARTIES did over 1 mln. on Wii?
5 games from 15? So how situation differs from GC? =))
What new games not from Nintendo you expect to break 1 mln. in 2008?

GC had 38 games and only 15 games not from nintendo. =]
And those games appeal to who, RPG gamers, fighter gamers, etc. hardcore games, with the exception of a couple I see no casual games, you see my point the PS3 appeals to one niche only

But, can you PROVE, that these games were buying same 20% of PS2 user base?

CrazzyMan for months you've been making long meaningless lists of games that have (so far) failed to spur PS3 sales, sell particularly well, or (in many cases) even be good games ...

The facts are that games like Gran Turismo, Final Fantasy and Metal Gear Solid had a high percentage of their owners who owned all (or at least many) of these games; this is not (particularly) surprising to anyone. Of those who only owned one game, they (probably) tended to be very casual (in the classic definition) and choose these games because they were a high profile game ON A SYSTEM THEY OWNED.

The number of people who will buy a PS3 for any (or all) of these games, that have not currently bought a PS3 (or will not buy one in the near future) is small.


while you are mostly correct,i think they will sell a little more then you expect i think GT will sell to a certain crowd different fomr the others so will FF sell to a certain crowd different from the others,and i think MGS4 will be the smallest system seller though will be bought alot from the people that already own the console though the biggest system seller last gen is now on 2 consoles so we shall see who it will help more


 Which is why i said 20% instead of 15%, isnce all of those games are under 15%



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

brute on 13 January 2008
Avinash_Tyagi said:
brute said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:

 Most people didn't care about gaming, why do you think Nintendo is trying to do with the Wii, what did Reggie say in E3 2006?  Do you know people who never read books or watch TV or go to the movies?  How about video games?

 

Most games never appeal to the full userbase of any console, even packins


well wii sports seems to be appealing to most of the wii owners,and no i dont know anyof the people that dont do any entertainment


 Not any entertainment, I was referring to the difference between gaming compared to mass medias, a lot of people don't game but they do those other things.

 

Wii sports is appealing to a lot of casuals, and people new to gaming, like my parents, but I also know of a lot of people who aren't interested in the game, they prefer stuff like mario and zelda


ofcourse wii sports is not the only game that sells wii though im saying its the only game that has ever appealed this much to a consoles userbase,japan proves this more then 50% of wii owners own wii sports



tag:"reviews only matter for the real hardcore gamer"

___O_o______ on 13 January 2008

Have you been to the future Avinash??? cause from what it seems like, you haven't. You're using "will" in your sentences.

You're predictions /= fact

"the ps2 had a large and varied library. Ps3 will not."

JUST WOW. WOW. You think sony's not doing anything about this???? They trying to break that barrier, and at the end of this year, we will know if they are succesful at breaking this barrier. Home, Singstar, Little Big planet, stardust, aqua, etc. and a whole SLEW of previous ps1 games will be released this year. And then there's the PSN games that will also be released. It's VERY ignorant to say the ps3 will not have a large and varied library, unless you're from the future or something, and have seen its line-up.



Avinash_Tyagi on 13 January 2008
brute said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
brute said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:

 Most people didn't care about gaming, why do you think Nintendo is trying to do with the Wii, what did Reggie say in E3 2006?  Do you know people who never read books or watch TV or go to the movies?  How about video games?

 

Most games never appeal to the full userbase of any console, even packins


well wii sports seems to be appealing to most of the wii owners,and no i dont know anyof the people that dont do any entertainment


 Not any entertainment, I was referring to the difference between gaming compared to mass medias, a lot of people don't game but they do those other things.

 

Wii sports is appealing to a lot of casuals, and people new to gaming, like my parents, but I also know of a lot of people who aren't interested in the game, they prefer stuff like mario and zelda


ofcourse wii sports is not the only game that sells wii though im saying its the only game that has ever appealed this much to a consoles userbase,japan proves this more then 50% of wii owners own wii sports


 Yeah but even then its not the full userbase, , 50% + is awesome, but we have yet to find a 100% attach rate game



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)