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Forums - Politics - Jesus vs Mohammed?

 

Jesus vs Mohammed?

Jesus 136 39.19%
 
Mohammed 158 45.53%
 
Equal 53 15.27%
 
Total:347

Both are great. Both are prophets of Islam. It is duty of every Muslim to respect both of them without any discrimination and to say "Peace be upon him" after their names.



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They both had an awesome impact on the World. To deny them, call them names or even irrelevant as koweni puts it is laughable. They are very relevant to 3.7 billion Christians and Muslims, which is more than half the World's population last I checked.

OP - as a muslim myself (by name at least), I was raised to love and respect all prophets. My background knowledge with prophet Mohamed is a lot deeper though. I know more about his than Jesus'... due to that bias, I have to say Mohamed (PBUH).  Though I admit, Jesus had the greater impact on people. That's just stupid to deny.

as a side rant --

I wish people could learn to stop flaming, offending other people's gods, beliefs and disbeliefs. It always has to come down to one side claiming superiority over the other with petty insults and attacks on beliefs.

Just respect people's opinions and beliefs ... don't go out of your way to offend people. That is all.



I am the black sheep     "of course I'm crazy, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong."-Robert Anton Wilson

osamanobama said:

well one raped, pillaged, sacked, and murdered.
the other loved, healed, and taught forgiveness.


LMAO, HAHAHHAAAAAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAAA

 

This one did it for me. Im a christian anyway and I go for Jesus. 



Yay!!!

Muhammad had slaves, muhammad had sex with a 9 year old girl when he was 53 years old, muhammad was a warlord.

Jesus gave his life for others and thats the greatest thing you can do...

Heres a good comparison with sources of both the Bible and the quran:
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Pages/Jesus-Muhammad.htm

Read it, than judge.



Fedor Emelianenko - Greatest Fighter and most humble man to ever walk the earth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVVrNOQtlzY

Marks said:
Cirio said:
Marks said:

I'm probably going to sound ignorant saying this, but didn't Muhummad say things like it was okay to harm/kill non-Muslims and encouraged violence against them? 

I obviously haven't read the qu'ran myself but I think it has verses that say things along those lines. 

Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not trying to be offensive, I actually would like to learn something. 

Muhammad never encouraged violence against anyone, and he never said it was okay to harm or kill any human. I believe I know what verse you're referring to from the Quran because it has been used out of context by the media a lot, so it's actually good that you're questioning about it. Firstly, you should know that the Quran isn't the words of Muhammad, but it is the word of God (that is, in Islamic belief).

God (in general) said that Muslims should first pray for the idol-worshippers and hope that they become believers in God. Muslims should then try to turn them into believers, but if they refuse then it is fine and they should leave them alone. If the non-believers attack the Muslims (like they savagely used to during that era), then it is okay for a Muslim to strike his sword against the non-believer to protect his beliefs.

That's a very general explanation of it, but people like to single out the verse of "striking the non-believers" out of context and blow it out of proportion mainly as an act of phobia against Islam. But when you read that verse in context of the paragraph it's in, then it makes sense.


Cool, thanks for clearing that up. I had my suspicions that those verses you talked about were being brought up out of context. Always good to learn a bit more!


Google the word tagyya, muslims are allowed to lie when its good for the spread of their religion, NEVER believe what a muslim says to you.

Please, buy the quran and read it for yourself.

Just two examples of  what muhammad really said:

"Fight everyone in the way of Allah and kill those who disbelieve in Allah" (Ibn ishaq 992)

"I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there  is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad  is the messenger of Allah" (Muslim 1:33)

There are more many more quotes like that, both from the quran and the hadiths (the word of allah and the word of muhammad respectively)

 

 

Its no contradiction that 80% of religious people who are persecuted because of their beliefs ae christians and most of them who are oppressed are the ones in islamic countries.



Fedor Emelianenko - Greatest Fighter and most humble man to ever walk the earth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVVrNOQtlzY

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wanderer said:
i'm muslim and i'm very offended by this thread


tell me one thing you are not offended by ;)



Fedor Emelianenko - Greatest Fighter and most humble man to ever walk the earth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVVrNOQtlzY

If this thread was a game in the DB, I would -without a shame- delete it >_>



ProdigyBam said:
Marks said:
Cirio said:
Marks said:

I'm probably going to sound ignorant saying this, but didn't Muhummad say things like it was okay to harm/kill non-Muslims and encouraged violence against them? 

I obviously haven't read the qu'ran myself but I think it has verses that say things along those lines. 

Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not trying to be offensive, I actually would like to learn something. 

Muhammad never encouraged violence against anyone, and he never said it was okay to harm or kill any human. I believe I know what verse you're referring to from the Quran because it has been used out of context by the media a lot, so it's actually good that you're questioning about it. Firstly, you should know that the Quran isn't the words of Muhammad, but it is the word of God (that is, in Islamic belief).

God (in general) said that Muslims should first pray for the idol-worshippers and hope that they become believers in God. Muslims should then try to turn them into believers, but if they refuse then it is fine and they should leave them alone. If the non-believers attack the Muslims (like they savagely used to during that era), then it is okay for a Muslim to strike his sword against the non-believer to protect his beliefs.

That's a very general explanation of it, but people like to single out the verse of "striking the non-believers" out of context and blow it out of proportion mainly as an act of phobia against Islam. But when you read that verse in context of the paragraph it's in, then it makes sense.


Cool, thanks for clearing that up. I had my suspicions that those verses you talked about were being brought up out of context. Always good to learn a bit more!


Google the word tagyya, muslims are allowed to lie when its good for the spread of their religion, NEVER believe what a muslim says to you.

Please, buy the quran and read it for yourself.

Just two examples of  what muhammad really said:

"Fight everyone in the way of Allah and kill those who disbelieve in Allah" (Ibn ishaq 992)

"I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there  is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad  is the messenger of Allah" (Muslim 1:33)

There are more many more quotes like that, both from the quran and the hadiths (the word of allah and the word of muhammad respectively)

 

That's pretty extreme. This thread is about explaining why you believe one prophet is better than the other, not generalize and spread hate about muslims. I believe mods gave a clear warning about this type of posting early in the thread.

All that aside. I think you mean taqiyya. which literally means to conceal. Basically, a muslim was permitted to deny or even renounce their belief if it meant their or their family's lives were at risk. This is a rather old practice, and was more common among shias who were small in number back in the day.

You posted: "Fight everyone in the way of Allah and kill those who disbelieve in Allah"

This is a common/frequent verse taken out of context.  This is only during war -muslims are under physical attack. You know, when people are trying to kill you.

Here's the full context “Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.” [Al-Qur’an 2:190-191]

I really hate to have religious debates on the forums ... sigh. But the following verse is also out of context.

You posted: "I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there  is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad  is the messenger of Allah"

This is only in an islamic state, not in an act of war. Basically, in an Islamic state, non muslims residing in that land (christians, jews, etc) were offered submission to islam, if they refused, they had to pay a tax called the jizya. They could live there as long as they payed the jizya, and they were protected. If they wanted to live and not pay the jizya, they were unfortunately imprisoned. Not the women and children though, they were forgiven as were poor people.

Here's the full verse you took out of context.

"I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, perform the Prayer, and pay Zakah. If they do that, their blood and property are guaranteed protection on my behalf except when justified by law, and their affairs rest with Allah."



I am the black sheep     "of course I'm crazy, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong."-Robert Anton Wilson

Shinobi-san said:
IIIIITHE1IIIII said:
Cirio said:
IIIIITHE1IIIII said:
Cirio said:
lordmandeep said:

Many people find the child marriage "questionable" because they don't know anything about it and it's intentions. This marriage was actually more benefitial for Aisha because she went from a regular girl to practically a Queen for the rest of her life. If people actually knew what the marriage was for and its intentions, they would stop using it as a constant attack on Islam.


How do you know that she wanted to be married with a much older man? How do you know that she ended up happy? And if she didn't: Do you really think that they'd even consider to write about it in that Koran? And do you think that she'd dare to say "no" to this marriage?

 

Stop blaming the time difference. Some things never change. She could've been a slave as far as we know.

Okay I'm understanding your position. Hopefully I can explain this to you so I can clear some of your confusion.

Aisha was happy with her marriage to Muhammad. She was actually extremely cocky and proud. Her marriage to Muhammad allowed her to do whatever she wanted because she was practically a Queen (like I said). She was also one of the first female leaders in Arabia, so this further boosted her cockiness. Aisha didn't write anything about herself in the Quran because the Quran is the word of God. The Haddith has stories written by Muhammad and Aisha in it and it was their own personal collection that others had no influence over. Aisha herself wrote most of the stories and she herself claimed everything I'm saying.

During the time of their marriage, Muhammad had become the most powerful individual in Arabia. EVERY woman wanted to marry him, so based on common sense, do you think Aisha would reject? Also you're mixing modern standards with standards of that era. During then, it wasn't the girl who chose who she got married to. It was her father who picked her husband (this was true in other non-muslim cultures too). Aisha was just lucky enough for the man to be Muhammad.

Finally, one of the first intentions of Islam (before prayers, before worship) was to abolish slavery and give equal rights to all individuals. This is because slavery was extremely common during that time. So no, Aisha was not a slave.

If you have any more questions/concerns, let me know. I'll be away from the computer for a bit so I might not reply until later.

[Firstly, I'm glad that you keep this discussion at a civilized level.]

 


That was 500 years ago, you should never trust information that's that old. Especially when considering that the source to all this has heavily skewed the info (or made all this up as far as we know) to match with the "perfect religion". An objective source would help out a lot here, but as for now, we're stuck.

1500 years ago.

Also if you read up on the life of Aisha (from historians or whomever you feel more confortable trusting ;) )...you will see that she definately was not a slave and became one of the most prominent female figures in Islam.

At the end of the day even historians only have so much to go on...even Roman scholars would have skewed events etc. Theres always going to be some degree of doubt when dealing with history from so long ago. But given all the information that we do have we can come up with the most likely way things went down etc. Whether or not you choose to believe in that is your own thing ofcourse.


Which further proves my point.

 

Again: How anyone can defend this heavily obsolete belief is beyond me. I can understand if you defend its believers as obviously not all of them follow each word of the Koran, but the actual Koran should be burned given all barbarous and inhuman content it contains. (I'd say the same about the Bible btw.)



Its interesting to see how a Jesus vs Muhammad thread has devolved into a an attack on Muhammad. All I will say on this is that it was the norm for the time (as many have already mentioned) and that in fact Aisha was a very powerful woman in Islam who was actively involved in the politics,made speeches and fought in battles.

With regards to the original thread topic, as a muslim Muhammad has had a much greater influence on me though they both clearly had a huge effect on future generations.



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