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Forums - Gaming Discussion - If you want one of the big 3 to go the way of Sega, or want your preferred company to monopolize...

Thechalkblock on 18 September 2011

if anything i wish some other companies had the ability to create their own console so that there would be an even bigger variety of games and even more competition.



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blkfish92 on 18 September 2011

Without competition there's no need for good games since your the only source, that's Sparta.



           

blkfish92 on 18 September 2011
RolStoppable said:
blkfish92 said:
Without competition there's no need for good games since your the only source, that's Sparta.

This only holds true for goods that are essential for living. Then low quality isn't an issue, because people need to buy regardless.

It doesn't work this way with video games. Low quality inevitably leads to low sales and thus a lack of profitability. This means even a monopoly would be forced to step up their game or they go out of business.


Ah, you mean like if they get no sales due to lack of quality they'll die easily, and the gaming business would be done.



           

Netyaroze on 18 September 2011

The industry wouldnt profit from it but I would. Consoles are cool and all but its annoying to have so many in the house over the years it accumulates. I would love to have just one console manufacturer. Sony for Hardware only MS for the Software part OS/Online etc and Nintendo as a game developer. Backwards compatible to PS1/2/3 Wii/GC Xbox/Xbox360 also with Nintendos Virtual Console for N64/SNES/NES Bluray and compatible to all Bluetooth Hardware of all current gen consoles. I would GLADLY spend 600/700 at Launch.

Sure its pure fantasy but I as consumer profit if one or two of the 3 drops out. As that means less systems. Hardware should be unified that saves costs in Software development which then could be used to improve the games. Also since such a console would sell 200-300 Million units the cost for the hardware would fall like a rock.



oniyide on 18 September 2011
Immortal said:
oniyide said:

i agree with the first paragraph, but where are the examples of MS and Sony hurting the industry?

2nd bolded, interesting, i didnt know the Sony thing was that far back. And your right about philips that sucked, but i still dont understand why they just didnt go it ALONE. Sega CD and 3do did and failed, but they arent Ninty i would have imagined that Ninty would have done better. But even when they did, it wasnt all that. Hell they even made statements saying that cartridges were still the best way to go, which IMHO means they were never fully commited to the CD format in th first place

3rd bolded anyone who knows my posting histroy knows i love the GC, better than Wii i have no hate for mini discs, but they COULD not hold as much information as a DVD, which lead to some games having to have levels cut from them. So your paying the same price for the game as PS2 Xbox and you are getting less content.(not always the case) you tell me how this was better for us

It was in my very first statement. The premature Bluray thing. It hurt the industry in as many ways as possible. I don't even need examples, though. It's common sense. Companies only see what's good for them and that goes for Nintendo, too. Sony and MS have other priorities. Nintendo doesn't.

The reason they didn't during N64 was likely because, until then, they'd been trying with Sony and Philips. If they tried on their own just after that, it would be rushed and end up as bad or worse than the Sega CD. And, after being forced by these circumstances not to go the CD route, do you think Nintendo would praise its competition for having CDs? Hell no. They had to try and convince everyone else that CDs were worthless so that the PS1 scenario wouldn't happen (which it did).

For your third point, I refer you to RolStoppable's post.

As for your other points, Wii's online may be "weak sauce", but I've already explained why Nintendo didn't bother. Blame the competition here, :P. And, for GBA's competition, sure, there were some companies who tried, but, since they didn't affect Nintendo's decisions in the least, they're irrelevant. By the end of the generation, it was more of a monopoly than almost any situation in gaming has ever been.

I think the Bluray hurt SONY more than the gaming industry. 360 and PCs still using DVDs, now if SOny was the only one out their, holy crap, then we would be in deep doodoo and i agree that MS and Sony have other priorities. Gaming is just one of Sonys many arms and for MS its just a side hustle.

As for the CD part, IMHO it would have made them look better by saying CDs was a good thing and not trying to down it, especially since they still tried to add a disc drive later and didnt work.  Kinda like how Sony crapped on motion control and then added some sixaxis crap at the last minues and gave us a souped up wiimote later. They both look foolish.

We are gonna have to agree to disagree, Ninty had a whole year to look at LIVE and see how that was going and learn from them. But even simple crap was messed up, friend codes, crap DL limit, tying game purchases to a console and not an account?? Come on, that last one is just common sense, you dont have to be an uber online guy to know that sucks. I think they relied to much on VC personally and even that got WORSE over time, cant blame competition for that, thats the one thing they had that the others could not replicate. GBA point taken



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KungKras on 18 September 2011

I want another Sega vs Nintendo battle.
No other console player leaving is too big a sacrifice to make that happen.
16-bit era simply is so ridiculously interresting when compared to how bland the console scene is today.



I LOVE ICELAND!

Roma on 18 September 2011
o_O.Q said:
Immortal said:
oniyide said:

what makes you think the other 2 will do so intentionally? Anyone can do unintentional harm to the industry, it will still be harm. PS was going to be an add-on. Sega already did that with the Sega CD, a while ago. How come Sega did not seem to have any issues?? or Atari or whoever made 3DO? Why did they stick with catridges all the way up to GC?? Nintendo, the video game producer couldnt get the CDs right?? Im not buying it. Still doesnt explain why they use minidisc for GC that put them at a disadvantage against PS Xbox

Online. I could see how that could be possible, but again this is NInty, I expected them to try harder, they could have had a better online and still do their motion or whatever, not say "screw it". Plus they could have updated through the years just like MS and Sony did. And their flippant attitude toward online doesnt help their case.

Its because of competition that the Wii was even made. YOu think Ninty would have even tried anything like Wii if they were not getting their asses kicked. They could not defeat MS and Sony in the hardware race so they decided to go a completly different route, OR maybe they would have made it anyway (like Sony made that eyetoy), im leaning more toward the former, but since we dont have access to an alternate universe, we could just assume

I believe I mentioned this in my original post. It's called adding Bluray to the PS3. A $600, heavily lossmaking, hell-to-develop-for console is pretty much a murder attempt at the industry.

And, for your second statement, you should realize that there's only so much we can prevent. Companies will do what they want. It may or may not harm the industry. You don't know until you try. The thing is, with MS and Sony, we know there are some times that they will intentionally try to kill the industry because it's still good for them. On top of that, they'll still make the normal mistakes that Nintendo makes. Meaning that, in all likelihood, a higher proprtion of decisions that harm the industry occurs with them in important video game-related positions.

As far as your accusation against Nintendo goes, you've got to be joking. Nintendo's research on the Playstation goes back as far as 1986 according to Wikipedia. If you haven't noticed, Nintendo has a history of waiting to get things right for their successful consoles (GBC came way after colour was common, for example) with the VB as the only real exception. They were going to do it with the SNES-CD. It didn't work. Playstation happened and destroyed their monopoly. They tried it with Philips. CDi happened, making Nintendo franchises a joke. They tried twice, even with horrible reprecussions the first time. Even with the limitless CD-based failures preceding it (I thank you for mentioning Sega CD and 3DO here). They were trying too hard, almost.

And your hate for mini-DVDs is completely unjustified. They weren't particularly inferior to normal ones, not enough to make GC less powerful than the PS2, at least. They were just avoiding unnecessary DVD licensing issues, or something to that effect, which is not shocking considering the whole drama with PS eating them alive. These were in fact better in some ways. Harder to pirate, apparently.

As for Wii's online, nobody was ever going to buy Wii for its online. Ever. It was doomed to be technically worse from the start. Anything else would have driven Nintendo bankrupt. Think from Nintendo's perspective here. Why the hell should I bother to work on online at all? If I don't, people say, "Wii has worse online than others". If I do, people say, "Wii has worse online than others". The reason they haven't bothered afterwards is because it won't help. Those who want the best online experience will necessarily go to the competition because Nintendo can't possibly better them at this point.

Now, while the last part is true, you should realize that the Wii was a random, unexpected move. The bad publicity it got before/near launch is evidence of that. Nintendo did it, but it was clearly an abnormal result of competition. An exception to the rule, almost. Plus, in this alternate, Nintendo-dominating universe, think of what the Wii would be like. I mean, as RolStoppable said, the GBA is a fantastic example to go by. A console with good specs, Wii-plus online, better control, all of Wii's non-motion-oriented fun games and likely a "Wii add-on" somewhere down the line, starting with some ~$299 as its launch price. By the end of its life, it would pretty much be better than the Wii. That doesn't look bad to me at all.

 

By the way, any of the non-opinion information I posted comes from Wikipedia. If I'm factually wrong, I am not to blame, :P.

 "It's called adding Bluray to the PS3"

isn't nintendo adding it to the wii u?

Why would Nintendo add blue ray? That’s like helping them against themselves :P

 

They have another DVD type

 

OT: I think it is good with competition or ells the prices would be too high



    R.I.P Mr Iwata :'(

oniyide on 18 September 2011
RolStoppable said:
oniyide said:

 

As for the CD part, IMHO it would have made them look better by saying CDs was a good thing and not trying to down it, especially since they still tried to add a disc drive later and didnt work.  Kinda like how Sony crapped on motion control and then added some sixaxis crap at the last minues and gave us a souped up wiimote later. They both look foolish.

 

The 64DD didn't use regular optical media and was announced in November 2005, several months before the Nintendo 64 launched. Eventually it was released in the same form it was announced to be, so this isn't comparable with Sony's Sixaxis and Move at all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_64DD


fair enough on Move, but sixaxis was announced prior to PS3's release



o_O.Q on 19 September 2011
Roma said:
o_O.Q said:
Immortal said:
oniyide said:

what makes you think the other 2 will do so intentionally? Anyone can do unintentional harm to the industry, it will still be harm. PS was going to be an add-on. Sega already did that with the Sega CD, a while ago. How come Sega did not seem to have any issues?? or Atari or whoever made 3DO? Why did they stick with catridges all the way up to GC?? Nintendo, the video game producer couldnt get the CDs right?? Im not buying it. Still doesnt explain why they use minidisc for GC that put them at a disadvantage against PS Xbox

Online. I could see how that could be possible, but again this is NInty, I expected them to try harder, they could have had a better online and still do their motion or whatever, not say "screw it". Plus they could have updated through the years just like MS and Sony did. And their flippant attitude toward online doesnt help their case.

Its because of competition that the Wii was even made. YOu think Ninty would have even tried anything like Wii if they were not getting their asses kicked. They could not defeat MS and Sony in the hardware race so they decided to go a completly different route, OR maybe they would have made it anyway (like Sony made that eyetoy), im leaning more toward the former, but since we dont have access to an alternate universe, we could just assume

I believe I mentioned this in my original post. It's called adding Bluray to the PS3. A $600, heavily lossmaking, hell-to-develop-for console is pretty much a murder attempt at the industry.

And, for your second statement, you should realize that there's only so much we can prevent. Companies will do what they want. It may or may not harm the industry. You don't know until you try. The thing is, with MS and Sony, we know there are some times that they will intentionally try to kill the industry because it's still good for them. On top of that, they'll still make the normal mistakes that Nintendo makes. Meaning that, in all likelihood, a higher proprtion of decisions that harm the industry occurs with them in important video game-related positions.

As far as your accusation against Nintendo goes, you've got to be joking. Nintendo's research on the Playstation goes back as far as 1986 according to Wikipedia. If you haven't noticed, Nintendo has a history of waiting to get things right for their successful consoles (GBC came way after colour was common, for example) with the VB as the only real exception. They were going to do it with the SNES-CD. It didn't work. Playstation happened and destroyed their monopoly. They tried it with Philips. CDi happened, making Nintendo franchises a joke. They tried twice, even with horrible reprecussions the first time. Even with the limitless CD-based failures preceding it (I thank you for mentioning Sega CD and 3DO here). They were trying too hard, almost.

And your hate for mini-DVDs is completely unjustified. They weren't particularly inferior to normal ones, not enough to make GC less powerful than the PS2, at least. They were just avoiding unnecessary DVD licensing issues, or something to that effect, which is not shocking considering the whole drama with PS eating them alive. These were in fact better in some ways. Harder to pirate, apparently.

As for Wii's online, nobody was ever going to buy Wii for its online. Ever. It was doomed to be technically worse from the start. Anything else would have driven Nintendo bankrupt. Think from Nintendo's perspective here. Why the hell should I bother to work on online at all? If I don't, people say, "Wii has worse online than others". If I do, people say, "Wii has worse online than others". The reason they haven't bothered afterwards is because it won't help. Those who want the best online experience will necessarily go to the competition because Nintendo can't possibly better them at this point.

Now, while the last part is true, you should realize that the Wii was a random, unexpected move. The bad publicity it got before/near launch is evidence of that. Nintendo did it, but it was clearly an abnormal result of competition. An exception to the rule, almost. Plus, in this alternate, Nintendo-dominating universe, think of what the Wii would be like. I mean, as RolStoppable said, the GBA is a fantastic example to go by. A console with good specs, Wii-plus online, better control, all of Wii's non-motion-oriented fun games and likely a "Wii add-on" somewhere down the line, starting with some ~$299 as its launch price. By the end of its life, it would pretty much be better than the Wii. That doesn't look bad to me at all.

 

By the way, any of the non-opinion information I posted comes from Wikipedia. If I'm factually wrong, I am not to blame, :P.

 "It's called adding Bluray to the PS3"

isn't nintendo adding it to the wii u?

Why would Nintendo add blue ray? That’s like helping them against themselves :P

 

They have another DVD type

 

OT: I think it is good with competition or ells the prices would be too high

as far as i know bluray discs max out at 9 gigs.... nintendo's new console apparently uses discs with 25 gigs of space... this leads me to believe they are at least using something derived from bluray discs



Roma on 19 September 2011
o_O.Q said:
Roma said:
o_O.Q said:
Immortal said:
oniyide said:

what makes you think the other 2 will do so intentionally? Anyone can do unintentional harm to the industry, it will still be harm. PS was going to be an add-on. Sega already did that with the Sega CD, a while ago. How come Sega did not seem to have any issues?? or Atari or whoever made 3DO? Why did they stick with catridges all the way up to GC?? Nintendo, the video game producer couldnt get the CDs right?? Im not buying it. Still doesnt explain why they use minidisc for GC that put them at a disadvantage against PS Xbox

Online. I could see how that could be possible, but again this is NInty, I expected them to try harder, they could have had a better online and still do their motion or whatever, not say "screw it". Plus they could have updated through the years just like MS and Sony did. And their flippant attitude toward online doesnt help their case.

Its because of competition that the Wii was even made. YOu think Ninty would have even tried anything like Wii if they were not getting their asses kicked. They could not defeat MS and Sony in the hardware race so they decided to go a completly different route, OR maybe they would have made it anyway (like Sony made that eyetoy), im leaning more toward the former, but since we dont have access to an alternate universe, we could just assume

I believe I mentioned this in my original post. It's called adding Bluray to the PS3. A $600, heavily lossmaking, hell-to-develop-for console is pretty much a murder attempt at the industry.

And, for your second statement, you should realize that there's only so much we can prevent. Companies will do what they want. It may or may not harm the industry. You don't know until you try. The thing is, with MS and Sony, we know there are some times that they will intentionally try to kill the industry because it's still good for them. On top of that, they'll still make the normal mistakes that Nintendo makes. Meaning that, in all likelihood, a higher proprtion of decisions that harm the industry occurs with them in important video game-related positions.

As far as your accusation against Nintendo goes, you've got to be joking. Nintendo's research on the Playstation goes back as far as 1986 according to Wikipedia. If you haven't noticed, Nintendo has a history of waiting to get things right for their successful consoles (GBC came way after colour was common, for example) with the VB as the only real exception. They were going to do it with the SNES-CD. It didn't work. Playstation happened and destroyed their monopoly. They tried it with Philips. CDi happened, making Nintendo franchises a joke. They tried twice, even with horrible reprecussions the first time. Even with the limitless CD-based failures preceding it (I thank you for mentioning Sega CD and 3DO here). They were trying too hard, almost.

And your hate for mini-DVDs is completely unjustified. They weren't particularly inferior to normal ones, not enough to make GC less powerful than the PS2, at least. They were just avoiding unnecessary DVD licensing issues, or something to that effect, which is not shocking considering the whole drama with PS eating them alive. These were in fact better in some ways. Harder to pirate, apparently.

As for Wii's online, nobody was ever going to buy Wii for its online. Ever. It was doomed to be technically worse from the start. Anything else would have driven Nintendo bankrupt. Think from Nintendo's perspective here. Why the hell should I bother to work on online at all? If I don't, people say, "Wii has worse online than others". If I do, people say, "Wii has worse online than others". The reason they haven't bothered afterwards is because it won't help. Those who want the best online experience will necessarily go to the competition because Nintendo can't possibly better them at this point.

Now, while the last part is true, you should realize that the Wii was a random, unexpected move. The bad publicity it got before/near launch is evidence of that. Nintendo did it, but it was clearly an abnormal result of competition. An exception to the rule, almost. Plus, in this alternate, Nintendo-dominating universe, think of what the Wii would be like. I mean, as RolStoppable said, the GBA is a fantastic example to go by. A console with good specs, Wii-plus online, better control, all of Wii's non-motion-oriented fun games and likely a "Wii add-on" somewhere down the line, starting with some ~$299 as its launch price. By the end of its life, it would pretty much be better than the Wii. That doesn't look bad to me at all.

 

By the way, any of the non-opinion information I posted comes from Wikipedia. If I'm factually wrong, I am not to blame, :P.

 "It's called adding Bluray to the PS3"

isn't nintendo adding it to the wii u?

Why would Nintendo add blue ray? That’s like helping them against themselves :P

 

They have another DVD type

 

OT: I think it is good with competition or ells the prices would be too high

as far as i know bluray discs max out at 9 gigs.... nintendo's new console apparently uses discs with 25 gigs of space... this leads me to believe they are at least using something derived from bluray discs

source

"Last week, Nintendo presented its new Wii U gaming console at the Electronics Entertainment Expo (E3 Expo). Beyond the innovative possibilities of Wii U’s new controller, the system will not use standard DVDs or Blu-rays; however, the games will still be released on optical media.

This news should not come as a surprise since Nintendo has always opted to use their own special optical media. Nintendo was the last major gaming company to change over from cartridges to optical media and has been using their special type ever since."



    R.I.P Mr Iwata :'(