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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - The problem with modern video games summed up in one review

Khuutra said:


There is nothing disrespectful about pointing out your exaggeration.

You use your slingshot to lower a ladder in the Great Deku Tree. Navi flies up to and calls yoru attention to it, even allowing you to Z-target it (as I remember).

Before going to Zora's Domain, Navi tells you you should talk to Saria. Ask Saria what's up and she'll tell you that the last spiritual stone is held by King Zora in Zora's Domain.

There are no cases I can think of where the game doesn't nudge you in the right direction.

I found you telling me that I was exaggerating quite insulting, I am not exaggerating anything, just telling the truth.

I knew you did it in the Great Deku Tree, but I swear I remember you doing it at the entrance of another temple in the same area.

And also, one of my main beefs was that I couldn't find Saria, and when I did find Saria, i didn't know where Zora's Domain was. Was there anything that pointed me in the direction of Zora's Domain? 

Either way, there were many times where I had no idea where to go next, I am not exaggerating anything, I have no need to, and you have no basis of for accusing me of exaggerating.



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brendude13 said:
Khuutra said:


There is nothing disrespectful about pointing out your exaggeration.

You use your slingshot to lower a ladder in the Great Deku Tree. Navi flies up to and calls yoru attention to it, even allowing you to Z-target it (as I remember).

Before going to Zora's Domain, Navi tells you you should talk to Saria. Ask Saria what's up and she'll tell you that the last spiritual stone is held by King Zora in Zora's Domain.

There are no cases I can think of where the game doesn't nudge you in the right direction.

I found you telling me that I was exaggerating quite insulting, I am not exaggerating anything, just telling the truth.

I knew you did it in the Great Deku Tree, but I swear I remember you doing it at the entrance of another temple in the same area.

And also, one of my main beefs was that I couldn't find Saria, and when I did find Saria, i didn't know where Zora's Domain was. Was there anything that pointed me in the direction of Zora's Domain? 

Either way, there were many times where I had no idea where to go next, I am not exaggerating anything, I have no need to, and you have no basis of for accusing me of exaggerating.


The map screen showed you where all the major entrances and exits on Hyrule Field were, and the owl explains how to use it a few times. You passed it several times on your equipment screen, I'm sure, or referenced it in the couple of dungeons you did beat.

I can say you're exaggerating - if only through misremembering - because what you're saying isn't true. The game never leaves you without hints of where to go.



Khuutra said:
brendude13 said:
Khuutra said:


There is nothing disrespectful about pointing out your exaggeration.

You use your slingshot to lower a ladder in the Great Deku Tree. Navi flies up to and calls yoru attention to it, even allowing you to Z-target it (as I remember).

Before going to Zora's Domain, Navi tells you you should talk to Saria. Ask Saria what's up and she'll tell you that the last spiritual stone is held by King Zora in Zora's Domain.

There are no cases I can think of where the game doesn't nudge you in the right direction.

I found you telling me that I was exaggerating quite insulting, I am not exaggerating anything, just telling the truth.

I knew you did it in the Great Deku Tree, but I swear I remember you doing it at the entrance of another temple in the same area.

And also, one of my main beefs was that I couldn't find Saria, and when I did find Saria, i didn't know where Zora's Domain was. Was there anything that pointed me in the direction of Zora's Domain? 

Either way, there were many times where I had no idea where to go next, I am not exaggerating anything, I have no need to, and you have no basis of for accusing me of exaggerating.


The map screen showed you where all the major entrances and exits on Hyrule Field were, and the owl explains how to use it a few times. You passed it several times on your equipment screen, I'm sure, or referenced it in the couple of dungeons you did beat.

I can say you're exaggerating - if only through misremembering - because what you're saying isn't true. The game never leaves you without hints of where to go.

Wasn't Zora's domain not linked directly to Hyrule field though, wasn't it linked to a river which then led you to Zora's domain?

And I would have preferred it if you told me I was misremembering, but in the end, I am used to games like this and I have completed games like Resident Evil at a very young age, yet multiple times I was confused at where I needed to go next in Ocarina of Time.

What about the part of the game where you grow up and go onto Hyrule Field, I believe after you meet Sheikh no hints are dropped as to where you go next.



leatherhat said:

 This is the problem with modern games. No mystery. No Adventure. No discovery. Its pathetic, every game now a days has waypoints and other nonsense to drag you through the game. It pisses me off. There's never any easter  eggs or sidequests or things to find. Its just mission/cutscene/ waypoint to the next mission etc. All but a few games follow this formula- and those exceptions are far and away the best games of the gen. 

And here is a mainstream reviewer complaining about a game that has these elements (with plenty of hand holding via Saria and Navi). Casual to the max, and everything wrong with modern game design. 



So true just picked up AC:Brotherhood and though I forgave the previous ones pretty liniar tedious game mechanics for the awsome story and other goodies, this one is just garbage. AC is essentially Hitman in the classic days. Lets look at hitman you are thrown into a scenario and the way you imagine you accomplish the mission is an actual possibility in the story. In AC:B the first 30 min is me wandering on a linear path behind some pixalted "doesn't seem like 720p" chick, then Im thrown into a world where most of the areas are restricted until I complete the story line which invovles me killing people in two fashions: Jump from above/ charge at them. Or in between kill some guards. Whenever theres is a puzzle in the game it just tells you what to do with your Eagle vision or golden highlights. Where is the fun in that? I don't understand how sites could give it 9-10... at most its 8.5 Another example of de-evolution GOW 3. Its a great game (Didnt want it to end) but I remeber Gow 1 -2 being filled with a plethora of unique puzzle( Ie remember having to lure the minotaur onto the platform freeze him and roll to the destination in the allocated time, that shit was hard for my then 10ish self). Im tired of these games( not GOW 3) oriented as on open world multi path experiences then just giving you one option and calling it art cuz you can sorta roam from path A to B with shity camera and conrols. Thats why I wait in anticipation for adventure games that are all about the fun with some intrigue questing rather than claiming puzzle (Cant wait for TES 5) because honestly we want this industry to grow but in the words of Lupe Fiasco they want to "Dumb in down".

 

I miss games that make you feel like its your game instead of an interactive movie.



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Bagenome:You can't shoot things on a blog, and babies can't read, so I don't think it would suit either one's target audience."

 

d21lewis said:
Honestly, do JRPG makers even realize how hard it is to save the world? That shit is impossible!

 

 

 

brendude13 said:
Khuutra said:


The map screen showed you where all the major entrances and exits on Hyrule Field were, and the owl explains how to use it a few times. You passed it several times on your equipment screen, I'm sure, or referenced it in the couple of dungeons you did beat.

I can say you're exaggerating - if only through misremembering - because what you're saying isn't true. The game never leaves you without hints of where to go.

Wasn't Zora's domain not linked directly to Hyrule field though, wasn't it linked to a river which then led you to Zora's domain?

And I would have preferred it if you told me I was misremembering, but in the end, I am used to games like this and I have completed games like Resident Evil at a very young age, yet multiple times I was confused at where I needed to go next in Ocarina of Time.

What about the part of the game where you grow up and go onto Hyrule Field, I believe after you meet Sheikh no hints are dropped as to where you go next.


I will phrase it that way in the future, then.

Zora's Domain was at the source of Zora's River, whichh is mentioned a few times by NPCs. The owl meets you at the entrance to Zora's River and explains it again.

This part is fuzzier to me - Navi suggests you talk to Saria, Saria says shit has gotten bad at the Meadow where she hangs out. Go meet her and  Sheik will teach you a song and direct you to Kakariko Village - particularly to meet Dampe, the gravekeeper. Sheik might direct you to go there when you talk to him at the Temple of Time, but I forget.



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Khuutra said:
brendude13 said:
Khuutra said:


The map screen showed you where all the major entrances and exits on Hyrule Field were, and the owl explains how to use it a few times. You passed it several times on your equipment screen, I'm sure, or referenced it in the couple of dungeons you did beat.

I can say you're exaggerating - if only through misremembering - because what you're saying isn't true. The game never leaves you without hints of where to go.

Wasn't Zora's domain not linked directly to Hyrule field though, wasn't it linked to a river which then led you to Zora's domain?

And I would have preferred it if you told me I was misremembering, but in the end, I am used to games like this and I have completed games like Resident Evil at a very young age, yet multiple times I was confused at where I needed to go next in Ocarina of Time.

What about the part of the game where you grow up and go onto Hyrule Field, I believe after you meet Sheikh no hints are dropped as to where you go next.


I will phrase it that way in the future, then.

Zora's Domain was at the source of Zora's River, whichh is mentioned a few times by NPCs. The owl meets you at the entrance to Zora's River and explains it again.

This part is fuzzier to me - Navi suggests you talk to Saria, Saria says shit has gotten bad at the Meadow where she hangs out. Go meet her and  Sheik will teach you a song and direct you to Kakariko Village - particularly to meet Dampe, the gravekeeper. Sheik might direct you to go there when you talk to him at the Temple of Time, but I forget.

Ahh ok, don't think I am hating the game, it just irritated me sometimes because I frequently got lost.



People get stuck in different places, and have trouble with different things.

Dropping hints too soon is just as annoying as giving useless cryptic hints or telling you the same thing you already know over and over again. There should be a hint system that you control and gives you more help the more you ask for it, without having to go to google or you tube.

It would be nice if the game warns you after a while when you're going at it wrong. Zack and Wiki really pissed me off that way. I was determined to find the solution. After over an hour of trying everything I could think without any progress I finally buckled and bough a hint. The hint was, something that was done in the past prevents any progress in the future. I 'broke' the puzzle right at the start apparently and it just let me blunder on forever with 0 chance of success.

Adaptable difficulty should be standard in games nowadays. Start out with easy, medium, hard and give the option to dial the difficulty up or down anytime you want in the game. Letting you skip sections or making you watch a play through (nsmb/dkcr) is just insulting. Also offer the ability to instant replay sections when you want it without having to start at the beginning of a chapter. LA Noire's tendency to just keep going made me loose interest in the game at the halfway point.

Save anywhere should be available if you want it. Not just because life can't always wait for you to get to a save point, but also when you're stuck, tired and want to try it again the next day, it's annoying to loose all progress up to that point. Pixel junk shooter 2, why don't you save my progress up to the last room....

Multiple saves and auto saves before the point of no return are also a must. The Witcher 2 had plenty of auto saves but not always at very good points and only one quick save slot. I explored the whole area around Flotsam and stumbled of a quest involving wraiths. I had no idea how difficult they would be but curiosity won over and I decided to take a peak. I quick saved before I opened the first chests, then got into a fight and died at my low level. Tried it again a few times, no go, too low level, not even doable on easy. Turned out my quick save was after a minor drop which Geralt could not climb back up. Last auto save was in Flotsam 1.5 hrs back before I started exploring, grrr. Further it usually auto saves before the cut scene for a boss battle, but too late to change strategy, drink potions or anything. Bad design.

Making games piss easy lineair corridors with glowing arrows and specific instructions after 10 seconds of idle time is not the solution to what can make games frustrating. It is the easier solution unfortunately. Crafting a well thought out help system and meaning full adaptable difficulty take a lot more work.



brendude13 said:
Khuutra said:
brendude13 said:
Khuutra said:


The map screen showed you where all the major entrances and exits on Hyrule Field were, and the owl explains how to use it a few times. You passed it several times on your equipment screen, I'm sure, or referenced it in the couple of dungeons you did beat.

I can say you're exaggerating - if only through misremembering - because what you're saying isn't true. The game never leaves you without hints of where to go.

Wasn't Zora's domain not linked directly to Hyrule field though, wasn't it linked to a river which then led you to Zora's domain?

And I would have preferred it if you told me I was misremembering, but in the end, I am used to games like this and I have completed games like Resident Evil at a very young age, yet multiple times I was confused at where I needed to go next in Ocarina of Time.

What about the part of the game where you grow up and go onto Hyrule Field, I believe after you meet Sheikh no hints are dropped as to where you go next.


I will phrase it that way in the future, then.

Zora's Domain was at the source of Zora's River, whichh is mentioned a few times by NPCs. The owl meets you at the entrance to Zora's River and explains it again.

This part is fuzzier to me - Navi suggests you talk to Saria, Saria says shit has gotten bad at the Meadow where she hangs out. Go meet her and  Sheik will teach you a song and direct you to Kakariko Village - particularly to meet Dampe, the gravekeeper. Sheik might direct you to go there when you talk to him at the Temple of Time, but I forget.

Ahh ok, don't think I am hating the game, it just irritated me sometimes because I frequently got lost.


Did you use your map? I'm sure there was something indicating where to go next.



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An essay to describe this is way too much. Only 2 words are needed.

Dumbed down.



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brendude13 said:

Ahh ok, don't think I am hating the game, it just irritated me sometimes because I frequently got lost.


I remember last time I played I actually felt a little bit pulled from dungeon to dungeon, like they were always telling me to go somewhere. Of course I didn't have to, but the point is that was always some (most times various) hint about where the next temple was. Actually, most of these were more like instructions than hints.

In the temples it's a differnt story, but it seems pretty strange to get lost between them. I'm not saying you're lying or anything, but it does sound weirdas the informationg is there and is clear just about every time. But it happens, sometimes we fail to notice things others find obvious.