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Forums - Gaming Discussion - PS3 Hacker Raised All the Legal Funds Needed to Beat Sony in a Weekend

mibuokami said:

There is so much argument here and I still do not know what Sony is sueing him for? Surely the actual topic of litigation will render 90% of the argument in this thread as irrelevant?

Can anyone supply me with a link that detail this case? or at least summerise the charges being laid?


basically for fucking up PSN and enabling piracy on a mass scale and voilating the terms of the contract to which they signed and agreed before using the system.

if he wins, ps3 is over, piracy will proliferate, developers will close down, people will lose their jobs, ps3 gamers will have to switch to XBL and pay extra for an online connection they already have.

id rather save all that and hang 1 guy if i was the judge....maybe that would stop hackers in the future who go about ruining technology and digital media so they can enjoy their own homebrew shovelware crap.



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Here are the 8 claims he's being sued on, copied from engadget (comments are theirs as well).

  • Violating §1201 of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, which forbids bypassing access control measures;
  • Violating the federal Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, which forbids accessing computers without authorization;
  • Guilty of contributory copyright infringement for encouraging and helping others to crack PS3s as well;
  • Violating the California Computer Crime Law, which is the state computer fraud act (think of this as a backup fraud claim);
  • Violating the PlayStation Network's Terms of Service (which feels meaningless, really);
  • Interfering with Sony's relationships with other PSN customers (also meaningless);
  • Trespassing on Sony's ownership right to the PS3 (this one feels weak) and;
  • Misappropriating Sony's intellectual property (another weak argument, but there in case the copyright argument fails).



alekth said:

Here are the 8 claims he's being sued on, copied from engadget (comments are theirs as well).

  • Violating §1201 of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, which forbids bypassing access control measures;
  • Violating the federal Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, which forbids accessing computers without authorization;
  • Guilty of contributory copyright infringement for encouraging and helping others to crack PS3s as well;
  • Violating the California Computer Crime Law, which is the state computer fraud act (think of this as a backup fraud claim);
  • Violating the PlayStation Network's Terms of Service (which feels meaningless, really);
  • Interfering with Sony's relationships with other PSN customers (also meaningless);
  • Trespassing on Sony's ownership right to the PS3 (this one feels weak) and;
  • Misappropriating Sony's intellectual property (another weak argument, but there in case the copyright argument fails).

Yeah, a lot of these are crap. While I'm not an expert on the legal field, I can say how I see each one, in the same bullet order:

  • Technically, he is guilty of this. However, I've heard quite a few people say that this really doesn't have much in the ways of teeth. And I do know there was a move to try to strike down this law also.
  • Hrm... nope. The only computer he accessed was his own. And by ownership rights, you are free to do what you wish with your own machine.
  • Hrm... this one is possible to make stick, but it'll be tough. I know that Geohot has pushed time and time again that it was for homebrew, and not piracy. Sony's lawyers will have to spin this around legally, which won't be easy. Personally, I think they'd have an easier time pushing for something like "Unauthorized distribution of proprietary security keys." Given our legal system on "security"...
  • I'm not familiar with this law, so I can't comment much; I'll default back to bulletpoint 2.
  • Recourse on a violation of TOS for a free item is only to restrict access to it. No monetary loss can be claimed.
  • This is illegal? I've spoken with customers of several other stores, which would technically "interfere" with their relation with the store, but nobody's done anything. The worst I was ever asked to do was to leave the store.
  • Last I heard, he never tried to claim that the PS3 was not Sony's. And through right of sale, once I buy it, I own the physical product. (Software may be licensed, but that's a different can of worms not related to this.)
  • This one should be relatively easy to stick. Distribution of the key and custom firmware with some Sony code could be connected to 'misappropriation'.

So all in all, I only see 2 of these sticking. There will be some sort of fee charged, but I don't see it being insane, nor do I see jail time. The worst it will do for him is go on his record.

Oh, and not to this post, but to others in this thread- please trim the quote trees down. There is no reason for there to be 8 pages of old quotes.



-dunno001

-On a quest for the truly perfect game; I don't think it exists...

Spankey said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
irstupid said:
 

is he redistributing free software?

no he is not, you have to have a ps3 to use this code.  so you already bought the software.  thsi code just lets you mod the software, which you bought


Exactamundo couldn't have said it better myself.

again, i'm not so sure. They have not bought the software, only a copy of it.

here's an analogy (hooray! another!) someone goes to a bookshop and buys a copy of Stephen King's The Shining.

All well and good, but then he rewrites the first paragraph, accurately translates the rest of the book to Klingon then publishes it on the Internet as his own work and gives instructions on how he did it all without getting the go-ahead from Mr. King.

The owner here owns the pages, the ink used and the cover of the book, but does not own the content (the actual  words, story and ideas). sure, if he wants to take out a pen and scribble in what he thinks is a better line or blank out some profanity, go for it. But whether he can go and publish his modified book in a way that makes the bookstore think it's actually been modified by SK himself (and tells others how to fool the bookstore so they can do similar things)  is a matter for the courts to decide.

This analogy is a bit flawed for the following reasons though:

a) Stephen King would probably have a good laugh about it

b) a book does not play games or access the PSN

no that is not a good analogy at all.

a better and more accurate one is if 100 people all BUY the stephen king book.  Then one person invents the typewriter and whiteout.  He then gives the other 99 people a typewriter and whiteout so they can whiteout words and sentences in the book and put in their own words.  thus changing the book they already bought



fps_d0minat0r said:
mibuokami said:

There is so much argument here and I still do not know what Sony is sueing him for? Surely the actual topic of litigation will render 90% of the argument in this thread as irrelevant?

Can anyone supply me with a link that detail this case? or at least summerise the charges being laid?


basically for fucking up PSN

This. Fucking up PSN is the sole prerogative of Sony. How dare you, Mr. GeoHot!



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hmmm.....I woudn't give that guy a penny, in my opinion, to the people the donate just wasted their money(but then who am I to tell people how to spend their money)

many analogies being thrown around in here, and since I'm no law expert(the only close is me watching law & orde SVU, and that doesn't even come close to this) so I won't knock on your opnions/analogies

the only thing that pisses me off is that he hacks the PS3, which is would've been ok if he  kept it to himself, but then posted it all over the net thinking nothing bad would happen, I mean their must be some action taken for this.(imo)

it always gets on my nerves when someone hacks a system, making the company having to lock/remove features then people get mad at *insert company/corporation here* when I think  all the anger should be pointed at the hackers. I know that their are noble hackers(maybe?) who want to improve their gaming expirience or community, but like everything in this world there is always another side, not every hacker have the noble ideals as people claimed in these threads. I bought my PS3 for gaming purposes, anything else that was added in was just a plus.

I hope Sony wins so we don't have to deal with these pople like who are ruining the gaming community.(imo)



alekth said:

Here are the 8 claims he's being sued on, copied from engadget (comments are theirs as well).

  • Violating §1201 of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, which forbids bypassing access control measures;
  • Violating the federal Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, which forbids accessing computers without authorization;
  • Guilty of contributory copyright infringement for encouraging and helping others to crack PS3s as well;
  • Violating the California Computer Crime Law, which is the state computer fraud act (think of this as a backup fraud claim);
  • Violating the PlayStation Network's Terms of Service (which feels meaningless, really);
  • Interfering with Sony's relationships with other PSN customers (also meaningless);
  • Trespassing on Sony's ownership right to the PS3 (this one feels weak) and;
  • Misappropriating Sony's intellectual property (another weak argument, but there in case the copyright argument fails).

... and here it is people. What I've detailed over and over again in this thread. This bullet point is what it all summarizes down to. This is the precedent we cannot have set in the courts.

I don't want to go into another longer post, that will just get ignored as no one really can disagree with it, but all I have to say is NO SONY, I OWN MY PS3!



alekth said:

Here are the 8 claims he's being sued on, copied from engadget (comments are theirs as well).

  • Violating §1201 of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, which forbids bypassing access control measures;
  • Violating the federal Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, which forbids accessing computers without authorization;
  • Guilty of contributory copyright infringement for encouraging and helping others to crack PS3s as well;
  • Violating the California Computer Crime Law, which is the state computer fraud act (think of this as a backup fraud claim);
  • Violating the PlayStation Network's Terms of Service (which feels meaningless, really);
  • Interfering with Sony's relationships with other PSN customers (also meaningless);
  • Trespassing on Sony's ownership right to the PS3 (this one feels weak) and;
  • Misappropriating Sony's intellectual property (another weak argument, but there in case the copyright argument fails).

 


After looking at the content of his jailbbreak I would think 3 and 8 can easily stick...



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Ail said:
alekth said:

Here are the 8 claims he's being sued on, copied from engadget (comments are theirs as well).

  • Violating §1201 of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, which forbids bypassing access control measures;
  • Violating the federal Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, which forbids accessing computers without authorization;
  • Guilty of contributory copyright infringement for encouraging and helping others to crack PS3s as well;
  • Violating the California Computer Crime Law, which is the state computer fraud act (think of this as a backup fraud claim);
  • Violating the PlayStation Network's Terms of Service (which feels meaningless, really);
  • Interfering with Sony's relationships with other PSN customers (also meaningless);
  • Trespassing on Sony's ownership right to the PS3 (this one feels weak) and;
  • Misappropriating Sony's intellectual property (another weak argument, but there in case the copyright argument fails).

 


After looking at the content of his jailbbreak I would think 3 and 8 can easily stick...


However, they cannot stand on their own. The require proof of breaking actual laws. 3 and 8 are simply supporting measures to add insult to injury.



Glad to see that he raised enough money to fight the case so far. Definitely not a good situation if [insert Company name] wins this case to limit consumer rights. In this case Sony is the company, but I'd be against any company that tried to limit my rights as a consumer.




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Me since the games were revealed, the fanboys since E3."

Skeeuk: "playstation 3 is the ultimate in gaming acceleration"