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Forums - Gaming - Buying used/Renting games = Piracy

Ok, I'm surprised no one noticed... I wanted to see how far I could take this without people noticing it but I guess no one will xD. There's a little hint in the very beginning of the thread that I thought some people would easily notice but I guess I was wrong.

I know I use ":P" all the time... but don't you think it's a little bit weird for me to use it at the very beginning of the thread? I was going to put it at the end of it after a big blank space but I thought it would go unnoticed and putting it at the beginning would be a better idea... I was wrong xD.

Let me tell you all... I GOT YOU! xD

Next time you see one of my threads starting with a ":P" or ending with a ":P" (a ":P" alone at the end, not next to a sentence) don't take me seriously because I'm not being serious, lol xD

Next time I'll probably try to make it easier to notice by bolding letters or using capital letters or something like that since nobody notices the ":P" >_> and it's not really that funny when I'm the only one who knows what I did :S

Anyways, I declare this thread to be a total failure because no one noticed :P If I make another one of these, I'll do it in a few months so everyone forgets what I said and I get them by surprise, MWAHAHA xD.

binary solo said:

Stupid logic is stupid.

First, renting and buy/selling used games is LEGAL. Piracy is not. Hence in this context renting/buying used =/= piracy

Second, renting and buying used requires...the legal purchase of a new game through legal channels. Piracy often occurs with a leaked, and hence not legally purchased new, game. Hence in this context renting/buying used =/= piracy.

Third, game rental stores/chains enter into a legal contract with the game distributor, the game distributor has entered into a legal contract with the game developer. One must assume (unless the developer's lawyers are wholly incompetent) that part of the legal contract between developers and distributors is the ability to make the game available through rental outlets, and that this involved fair compensation for rental copies sold. Equally the distributor's contract with rental companies involves a negotiated fair compensation for game rental. Either the rental company pays much more than the normal retail price for a game, and thus owns the game with a legal right to rent it, or the game is leased to the retnal company with a portion rental income going to the distributor and hence feeding back in one way or another to the developer. Hence in this context renting =/= piracy.

Fourth, video games are goods, not services, throughout history once somone has purchased a good it is theirs to use and dispose of as they please, provided how they use it and dispose of it are legal. It's been a fundamental part of the whole economic system since trading in goods began. There is no sound rationale for videogames (computer software in general) to operate outside this mode of economic practice. Patent laws prevent me from copying a "hardware" good and selling it without legal recourse to the patnet owner, copyright laws prevent the same for "software" goods. But a single good legally purchased, but no longer of use or value to the owner SHOULD be on-sold if it is still perfectly functional . To do otherwise would be wasteful. Hence in this context buying used =/= piracy.

Fifth, ever since literacy among the masses became widespread (at least in some countries) public libraries with the [essentially] free lending of books have been a mainstay of continuously advancing cultures. Drawing a parallell to videogames suggests that lending libraries, rather than being preserved, should be banned and burnt to the ground. Yeah, I can see that happening. There are also libraries around the place that have gaming consoles, and allow library members to play games in the library, and this is all legal and above board. Hence in this context renting/lending =/= piracy.

Six, there's only one context in which there is a slight and highly tenuous connection between second-hand trading and piracy: that's retailers buying games off the consumer and re-selling for a profit. But even that has a lot of historical precedent  (including ridiculously high mark-ups compared to the trade-in value) with other goods, including "software" goods like books. Hence even in the most maligned and reviled segment of the used game market buying used =/= piracy.

Thus there is no logic or rational which allows one to rationally demonstrate that the legal activities of used game trading and renting are in any way equivalent, or even in the same ballpark of deplorability, to piracy.


I feel kind of bad for making you write such a long post for nothing xD but at least I learned a few stuff from it!

 

Happy new year for those already in 2011 :P



A banner stolen from some site xD

Release Final Fantasy Versus XIII nowwwwwwwwww!!! lol :P

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What are you, gaming industry or what? At least I'm a customer and act like one. Besides, I can't afford to buy too many new games, especially if things ever get digital-only.



Renting isn't piracy. Rental copies have a premium price.



Zkuq said:

What are you, gaming industry or what? At least I'm a customer and act like one. Besides, I can't afford to buy too many new games, especially if things ever get digital-only.


Lol, read the post above you xD



A banner stolen from some site xD

Release Final Fantasy Versus XIII nowwwwwwwwww!!! lol :P

Jdevil3 said:
Zkuq said:

What are you, gaming industry or what? At least I'm a customer and act like one. Besides, I can't afford to buy too many new games, especially if things ever get digital-only.


Lol, read the post above you xD

Yeah, I noticed that... right after posting. Still, serves you right, you should really make it more obvious. Or more subtle.



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Personally I dont believe in used games. Infact I prefer asking to borrow a game rather than giving money to companies that can affect developers and publishers.

For starters, when you buy new games, the money goes to the developer/publisher like all you said. Piracy gives none, and used games gives money to the company. Many have mention that those company use the used game money to buy new games but lets take a look inside this.

Company like Gamestop uses the Video game fanatic into believing they love games. Well it truth, its a company driven by money, like always. And you might thing that money from used games go to new games, but a company such as money driven might think different. 

If they sell a new game and they get them used faster than expected, they buy even less new games, cause they realized the used obviously is giving them more money than the new, so they order even less copies and the developer get less income and Gamestop gets more income. Thats where the dilema starts. I dont might buying used games when they are discontinued and the developer is gone cause obvoiusly there's not going to be new copies around anymore, so for that, I can understand.

But buying a game for 60, play it, gave it in trade in and get 20 and so they sell it at 54. Those 54 doesnt go to the developer, and then we complain why there isnt goog games around each year, and its because we buy them used and do piracy. And its true that borrowing wont give them money but atleast youre not helping the big company knock the developers income of a game. 

I used to work at Gamestop and I can say that for some games at one store we could get 5 copies of a new one and 15 of a used one. The company want us to offer the used first, and they give you specials so they can make you buy them. Their membership is one. Gamestop bully us to offer everything used and we have to do a %  everyday or you're out. Plus they give you twice the job that you know you need one hour, but they want it on 15 min. Its all driven by money, even the employee told me and thats why they left one by one. 15 hours a week for a supervisor at 7.70 with twice the job as a regular one (.45 c of different) isn't even enough to pay a car payment. Ive seen employees refuse SGA position cause the .45 c of different isn't worth for the amount of job to do. Technically you're a mini manager with much ore less pay and you can be step on it by somebody else bigger. (said by an employee that refused twice the position and left the company afterwards.

Ive seen games they give people 1.50 and then sell them for 14.99 that three time more than they paid you. And if they used that gain to pay the employees better, or fix the stores horrid appearance (at least the store I was you couldn't even use the bathroom, everything was falling apart)or more new games but no. Its all about the more money they make and how many slave they have.

Plus some stores, doesn't test the used games. They sell it to you even if there's damage. Just to get money in. Ive know of employees taking disk that they look they did djhero on them and still put them as sale instead of defective, so the trade numbers increase. Plus in my area they have 20 to 26 years old guys as manager and most doesn't even have the skills of leadership and honesty as a manager and responsibility of a store. They all do it so that the DM can have more controls over the kids. Its harder to say to a 40 year old lie about something that has no logic and reason whatsoever than a 24 years old. A 40 years old would complain for the irrational things, and treatment to clients and employees because of maturity, rather than a 24 that still doesn't have the skill to say no thats not right, and say yes mommy. Believe me Ive learn so many thing of this company inside from the same employees that has been years in it. Gamestop doesn't know how to say thank you and that from 16, 15 you did it right; great job. They will only say, you didnt do one thing right. (or at least the DM from that area is like that). Also they force you to reserve them games tricking you into holding them from you when they actually the company says sell as much you can to everyone including those without reservation and when you go , in some case there's isn't anything available. (this happened to collectors from black ops and the Mario all star game)

They care less if you love games, if you like games. It might be a plus, but the less you show youre a fanatic on game the more they consider you a canditate. They always think you might stealing especially if you love games, and you need to sell their services like a maniac. If you show you sell their used stuff they'll want you in there, even if you know nothing of video games. (and this is so company like when they're this big and vicious)

I prefer now pay for games to help my people keep their job as developers. If fact if I was a publisher, instead to directing my product availability to other companies I would do an online store to my products and assure my income and achievements of my hard work and not et other win them from me. If that would happen. Gamestop would be a bit tighter in income. Cause if they spend (lest say) 40 for a game of 60 to sell They wont game income from new and have to crawl with the income of used. And the price would be higher to sell. Ive seen games that last week to be at 20 new and next week 60 new. They rampage the new game prices and keep the used of those low so they can catch you there.

I left because I am finishing my studies as a video game designer and I though Gamestop might have been the best place to work at my college years but I realized Im destroying my own field and dreams by working there so I left. 

And Ive never feel more relieved with myself. 



renting and buying games costs money!



llewdebkram said:
renting and buying games costs money!


Bit of an odd necro, any particular reason?



wrong completely,
renting games= you pay 6-8 bucks a night then return it to blockbuster , or netflix or pay it off and keep it

used games- your paying money out of your pocket to the pawnshop or gamestop or thrift store , -
piracy means your not paying a dime into the economy - i dont care who recieves the money because 1 -the developer already made the money off the first 100 k plus buyers if not more-cod any one gta any one
2 if i have to replace a game im not going to buy another new copy! if i can find a cheap one used , or if the gen is over , there would be no new copies of what ever game i purchase -looks in the corner at 2 crates filled w nearly 200 snes games --- ya exactly , ,
not going to spend an arm and a leg to find rare un open stuff knowing ill be opening it any way



So by that logic isn't selling anything 2nd hand considered piracy? Wouldn't that make eBay a bigger piracy website than Pirate Bay?



On 2/24/13, MB1025 said:
You know I was always wondering why no one ever used the dollar sign for $ony, but then I realized they have no money so it would be pointless.