For god's sake Microsoft please just release somekind of navigation controller, even if it's just as an extra. Controller free gaming is good and all, but why not allow the possibilty to use some buttons or an analog stick if people want to, atleast then we get something else then just on-rail games.

And these press guy's have to stop trying to make it look like Kinect is the cheapest motion control option out there, everyone knows it's expensive. Just give us some good games and a proper working device to warrant the price.(and stop paying these kind of idiots to do an interview).

That's exactly why I said that.  Though in truth I was also speaking more to hardcore titles seeking to replicate the feel of driving vs the (very fun) style of something like Mario Kart.  Mind you, I do find it much better with the wheel than without.

In the end, the superior - i.e. best - controller for a driving game is a wheel a gamepad is okay and something like Kinect I have to be blunt and say is probably at the bottom of the pile.

They'll make driving games on it anyway - but it's just a waste really.

But then I'm a form and function type of guy - I want the best form for the function.

LOL! Shenmue 3 playable with Kinect. He looked nervous and I don't think he expected those questions.

I agree, even very strongly about driving games, but about gestures, yes, I thought too about some gestures based solution, but having to use at least one limb for navigation control would mean partially sacrificing the full body 1:1 motion tracking that is, together with the controller free feature, one of the two biggest Kinect's strong points. Giving up 1:1 motion control of one or more limbs to emulate with gestures what was done with buttons partially defeats the controller-free experience, a not natural, and not corresponding 1:1 to avatar's on screen motion, control scheme must be learned, and what's sometimes worse, the gestures that replace buttons, mouse and sticks, don't have the tactile feedback their classic competitors have. In most cases the games will allow some simplification of body tracking and simulation, some won't require both arms, some won't use legs for anything else than moving around, so a playable and enjoyable control scheme will be devisable, but it won't be full 1:1 body motion tracking.

Even without the wheel add-on, in Mario Kart Wii you hold something, just like you hold a wheel in a real car. Driving with a WiiMote is not so different from driving a car or a bike with automatic transmission. Obviously a good wheel with force feedback and pedals is a lot closer to reality, and the choice for those desiring more realism. OTOH, with Kinect, holding an invisible wheel, with no tactile feedback at all, is an experience totally different from driving a real car, although it could be perfect to simulate the invisible bike of the Hair Bear Bunch.   

I take it you are not a REAL car enthusiast. I can see the true car geeks will like that feature.

On the flip side, one could argue that playing as a petal floating in the wind is not a game but that was an awesome experience, this is catering to a specific group.

My only gripe with the Forza video is that they crapped on Polyphony for "stealing" their racing line idea but then openly admit to "looking at" other racers for ideas...double standards much?

I'm gonna argue the reason why most games on Kinect seems to b e on rails so far is because they haven't perfected the art of free movement yet with it. I think it would be cool if the uses gestures to mimic Direction input, e.g push your left palm forward to go forward etc etc.

Movements along those lines (left palm forward = walk forward) are simply proxy motions which take games back into the territory of gesture controlled input and away from the 1:1 motion control input that so many regard as being the key to full immersion input schemes.

It's a fundamental design issue for something like Kinect or the PSEye as a standalone input system.

The most realistic way of having a 1:1 movement system for a motion tracking based controller would be to have a specialized 2 way treadmill that moves in all directions, allowing the player to effectively walk or run in place naturally to move an on screen character without resorting to "if I lift my foot, that means my character starts walking until I put my foot down to make it stop" type input.

It goes without saying that a multi-directional treadmill based system would cost far more than any controller ever released just for the added realisim of being able to walk or run to control a character's moment in true 1:1.

As for Forza, it just looks like it's an optional control scheme for driving games, albeit one that appears to be less accurate and less responsive than a basic analog stick based game pad. In order for Kinect based control input to be truly competitive, the game code will likely have to bump up the steering input assist so significantly that the player would no longer be driving on his own. Bascially, it's a novelty, that allows a player to use his Kinect camera to play Forza.

The best control input for any driving game based in reality will always be a well-designed, well made steering wheel/pedal controller. And until they start making real life cars that are controlled by anything else, I don't see that ever changing.

The games shown in that video looked just terrible. No controller really limits what you can do.

MS doesn't even need to design and market a supplemental nunchuck or navi-con unless they really want a one handed controller for basic character navigation (walking/running). The standard game pad analog stick would work fine.

The only problem with that is from a marketing perspective, seeing as how one of the key marketing bullets for Kinect has been "controller free gaming" and the suggestion that only controller free gaming is "real" motion control that takes gaming to the next level. It's just marketing of course, but admitting that an analog stick is still the simplest way to navigate a character around an environment pretty much flies in the face of one of Kinect's key selling points.