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Forums - Movies & TV - George Lucas Was Right About the Star Wars Fanbase

I really respect star wars for what it did for the cinema industry in the 60's,but i never cared about the movies at all.To me they are fun little stories with a cool concept,but they are far from masterpieces(but i'm the guy who don't care about superhero movies when the hole world loves them more than ever,so what do i know).

So,i liked this one,because it was like every other decent star wars to me.it was not even close to perfect,but you can have fun watching it.I guess i can understand people not liking it if they super crazy about the overall franchise(what a lot of folks are),since this one has a little of a change in pace compared with previous entries.



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The force awakens was a pile of poo.

But please, let's stop generalising every single person's opinion as the fanbase opinion. Some people didn't like it. Whatever. I will decide when i watch it in a few days.



Of course the fans like the movie. If you don't like the movie, you're not a fan. Simple.

After 40 years, isn't it time for something new. It's been milked enough.



mZuzek said:
This is true of fans of anything, really - I've experienced it first hand with GotG Vol. 2, a movie that expanded on so much and was so awesome and better than the original in so many ways, yet because it was different people disliked it.

Except that's completely false, GotG Vol2 is clearly inferior to the first one, is just how it is. And I don't think people disliked it at all, they just liked it less.

Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 17 December 2017

Thechalkblock said:
Aeolus451 said:
It has too many plot holes and it shatters SW canon. It's the perfect little cashcow for disney and the fans who don't care if it makes any sense or follows canon. After these recent movies, I'm better off just ignoring the series altogether until disney sells the IP.

You'll ignore Star Wars until the end of time then

Disney selling the Star Wars IP is about as likely as Nintendo selling the Mario IP.

If they keep making films like this, it won't be that long.



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Films that are among the highest grossing films of all-time as soon as they release, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-grossing_openings_for_films#Biggest_worldwide_openings_since_2002,  and crack 1 billion USD without even trying.

Oh yeah, Disney is just bleeding money with the IP as we speak. Won't be long now. XD



Angelus said:
I'm sure there's more than few Star Wars fans out there who hate this movie for the wrong reasons, but lets not pretend there aren't plenty of objectively valid reasons to dislike it.

No arguments there. Most of the feedback I've heard from those disliking the movie stems from a didn't "feel" like Empire. Many of those same voices were singing the praises of "Awakens". I have a feeling that general perception of the film should improve over time. Many of the biggest problems with the movie were one's carried over from "Awakens". Perhaps if it were more focused, it might have addressed some of those in more satisfying ways.



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I liked it alot. 

 

TFA was basically comfort food.  It was fun and enjoyable, and pretty much exactly what you would expect from a Star Wars movie.  Not a bad thing necessarily, but I enjoyed it, and than had no strong feelings about it an hour later.

 

After reestablishing the Star Wars formula, the Last Jedi broke tons of conventions.  They questioned the wisdom of the foolhardy heroes rushing headlong into danger, questioned whether everyone could or should be saved, and so on (I'd give specific examples, but spoilers.  A few plotlines should have been trimmed down, but ultimately it was engaging.  I didn't really know what would happen, and that's basically the first time I could say that in a Star Wars movie.

 

*Spoilers*

After TFA, one would think that there would be a number of priorities for its sequel. Fleshing out the characters of Snoke, Finn, and Rey. Give Phasma some screen time after she was so thoroughly ignored in TFA. TLJ gets around to, at best, two of these, and one hardly counts considering that they take the time to characterize Snoke and then proceed to immediately kill him off. What is the point of establishing an Emperor-esque figure that is so much more powerful than everyone if you're just going to off him not even halfway into the trilogy?

On top of this, there are plot holes on top of plot holes, probably as a result of the movie trying to juggle so many plot points. Why can Leia magically float through space now? How did Rey develop competent lightsaber wielding and force using skills within the span of a day of lessons? It took Anakin years to get there, so what makes Rey so special beyond simply having "raw power." Why does Luke not tell the resistance that he's going to buy time for them to escape, and instead has to rely on Poe being able to intuit his plan? Why does creating a projection of himself kill Luke? Where the hell did Snoke come from, and how did he get to be such a powerful force user? And still, how the hell did Luke/Anakin's old lightsaber wind up in Lemon Head's possession? Again, these could have been addressed if TLJ made better use of its time. But it didn't, and now Episode IX has a ton of baggage from the previous two movies along with whatever storyline it carries out, and chances are a significant portion of these will be dropped and never heard from again

"Plot Holes"

*Spoiler warning again*.

1.  The Force.  Leia is established as exceptionally force sensitive in ROTJ if not earlier.  We see her using some degree of basic force abilities in Force Awakens.  We've seen force powers used through instinct before (i.e. Anakin and Luke's piloting skills, Rey's ability to use the Jedi mind trick, etc).  Floating through space would only require the slightest nudge (since nothing would stop her momentum), so I could buy it.  I think it looked silly, but I have no conceptual objections.

I actually have to rewatch this scene, cause thinking back on it, I'd like to double check and see if Kylo is pushing Leia.  Because, that would be well within his abilities.  

2.  Luke is blocking laser shots blindfolded within a day of meeting Obi Wan.  Her force powers really aren't a tremendous leap forward from TFA, so if you want to call it a plot hole, call it one for that movie.  But in this one, she doesn't seem to be doing anything mindblowingly impressive in comparison.

Furthermore though, Snoke explains that her power is also related to Ren's.  They pretty directly explain that there is a balance between light and darkness (I forget the line exactly), so as one grows in strength the other does.  This would also kind of explain why Anakin was so much slower to learn than Luke or Rey, considering the amount of Jedi and the balance of power in the force at the time.  Since Rey is almost solely responsible for balancing against the dark side at this point, the force power is stronger in her than it normally would be imo.

3.  If there's a plothole here, it's that the rebels didn't figure it out sooner.  It's kind of obvious.  They, especially Leia, have a pretty good sense of what a Jedi is capable of.  There would be no reason for them to expect that Luke is going to singlehandedly decimate Ren's forces.  

And honestly, it would just be far less cool if Luke said it.  When Hitchcock was asked why one of his characters didn't just go to the police, he said because it'd be boring.  That principle is at play.  It makes for a more exciting movie.  

4.  They actually allude to this early in the movie, with Ren asking Rey (I think, may have been the other way around) how she can communicate as they do without being dead.  But, this is basically an application of the force ghost shizzy that we've seen since Empire.  When Jedi truly become "one with the force" they can appear as a projection basically wherever they want ala Obi Wan or Yoda.  Luke however, unlike the others, still has something to do in this world.  So he is able to partially give himself to the force, essentially leaving him halfway between life and death, which is why his force apparition is more corporeal.  

This kind of thing isn't a plotholes.  It's something that's not explained fully, but we know enough that we could fill in the blanks.  We have seen projection as an ability used specifically by dead Jedi, but is not able to be used while they are alive.  From there we could figure out the rest.

5.  Who cares?  Snoke's past is not relevant to understanding the plot in anyway.  It may be interesting, or may be not, but it doesn't have much bearing on the events in the last jedi, so if you are concerned about too many plot threads, I don't really know why you'd push for this.

Bear in mind, we didn't know anything about the Emperor in episodes IV-VI.  We only find his backstory, and even then we never find out why he's especially powerful, in the prequels.  And really, did that add much to the originals?  Maybe they'll have some movies to fill in the space between VI and VII, but it's really not important here.

Last edited by JWeinCom - on 17 December 2017

JWeinCom said: 

3.  If there's a plothole here, it's that the rebels
And honestly, it would just be far less cool if Luke said it.  When Hitchcock was asked why one of his characters didn't just go to the police, he said because it'd be boring.  That principle is at play.  It makes for a more exciting movie.

 

Thank you for bringing up this quote. It's lost far too often. There's a logic and language to film that isn't 1:1 with reality. 

Another Hitchcock quote about plot holes: "I’m not interested in logic, I’m interested in effect. If the audience ever thinks about logic, it’s on their way home after the show, and by that time, you see, they’ve paid for their tickets."

A little cynical but I think it speaks to a fundamental truth about filmmaking.



I love how George is sarcastic.
Basically laughing at those screaming shit at his job and now they get real shit with the new trilogy.



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