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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nintendo and Third Party... Who is really to blame?

Soundwave said:
Here's an interesting question though ...

What would happen if you gave Nintendo the PS4 chipset and you forced Sony to make the Wii U their chipset.

Odds are (grudingly or not), Nintendo would get most of the third party games that Sony currently has.

With such a high powered console and relative ease of porting from PC/XBox One, developers simply could not afford to ignore it.

Whereas Sony, as much as third parties "like" Sony ... eventually support for a Wii U like Sony console would fizzle out after a couple of years as developers transitioned more over to the next-gen hardware.

It's business. Not personal. Nintendo makes weird business and design decisions that don't suit third parties. Given the choice of two other options that are far more predictable, third parties will chose that route.

In that scenario, third parties would still avoid nintendo and support sony. The proof is that developers simply cannot afford to ignore the wii u right now but do so anyway.



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Tagging this for later. Kinda late for me. Good night.



Materia-Blade said:
Soundwave said:
Here's an interesting question though ...

What would happen if you gave Nintendo the PS4 chipset and you forced Sony to make the Wii U their chipset.

Odds are (grudingly or not), Nintendo would get most of the third party games that Sony currently has.

With such a high powered console and relative ease of porting from PC/XBox One, developers simply could not afford to ignore it.

Whereas Sony, as much as third parties "like" Sony ... eventually support for a Wii U like Sony console would fizzle out after a couple of years as developers transitioned more over to the next-gen hardware.

It's business. Not personal. Nintendo makes weird business and design decisions that don't suit third parties. Given the choice of two other options that are far more predictable, third parties will chose that route.

In that scenario, third parties would still avoid nintendo and support sony. The proof is that developers simply cannot afford to ignore the wii u right now but do so anyway.

They wouldn't be able to easily port XB1/PC games to the "Sony Wii U" though, that would be a huge pain in the ass. 

Nintendo would get a lot of third party support by default if they had Sony's hardware. Too late for this generation (probably too late in general) though obviously. 



I'm to blame of not buying 3rd parties. I am to blame to refuse to buy a broken game. I'm to blame for complaining of having a broken BF4 over my PC (The coo called us trolls for not accepting the game the way it is). I have a wii u and a PC and both I do not buy anything from EA, Ubi or Activision since last year. 



Soundwave said:

They wouldn't be able to easily port XB1/PC games to the "Sony Wii U" though, that would be a huge pain in the ass. 

Nintendo would get a lot of third party support by default if they had Sony's hardware. Too late for this generation (probably too late in general) though obviously. 

All information we have right now says otherwise.



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mike_intellivision said:
Nintendo has had a bad history with third parties since there was a real competitor (Playstation). At that point, its Draconian contracts and its reliance on older technology became too much.

If you look at the top-selling games for each system, its been 80% Nintendo, 20% third-party for Nintendo consoles since the Gamecube generation (if not before). It was the inverse for the competing systems.

Most recently, this has been exacerbated by increasing hardware differences, making ports more difficult and less profitable (than compared to systems with similar architecture). The use of Nintendo products as a secondary console lessened the market for third-party multiplats. Finally, the demographic of those who have only a Nintendo console usually is not interested in the M-rated multiplats.

In a few cases, the publisher bears almost all blame as it almost tried to fail (e.g., EA). But other times the fault is mixed with some good games and some problem ones (e.g., Ubisoft, WBI), And some have just had to make business decisions (e.g., Activision).

Personally, I just enjoy the games and hope for more good ones.

Very nice post. Thanks for posting it.

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All THREE are to blame.

Nintendo for not actively seeking third party support.
Third parties for not supporting Nintendo consoles AND even making gimped versions of said games.
Gamers for not buying the games.

But that being said third parties expecting their games to sell millions upon launch is ludicrous! Sales arent all or nothing, but are instead are steady stream of sales, with each new release building upon the sales.



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Soundwave said:
Here's an interesting question though ...

What would happen if you gave Nintendo the PS4 chipset and you forced Sony to make the Wii U their chipset.

Odds are (grudingly or not), Nintendo would get most of the third party games that Sony currently has.

With such a high powered console and relative ease of porting from PC/XBox One, developers simply could not afford to ignore it.

Whereas Sony, as much as third parties "like" Sony ... eventually support for a Wii U like Sony console would fizzle out after a couple of years as developers transitioned more over to the next-gen hardware.

It's business. Not personal. Nintendo makes weird business and design decisions that don't suit third parties. Given the choice of two other options that are far more predictable, third parties will chose that route.

Actually, third parties go to where the money is. If that high powered Nintendo console sold less than the low powered Sony console then third parties would put games on the Sony console.

Look at the Wii last gen. The weakest of the 3 consoles yet still got FIFAs, CODs, Godfather, Transformers, Splinter Cell, a Dead Space game, among others simply because of its install base.



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FarleyMcFirefly said:

It is us, the gamers.

I'm going to post something I said on N4G, hopefully you can check it out, it took me a while, especially considering my poor level of English:

Let's suppose there are 8.3-8.5 million Wii U units in homes all around the world. 

1. There are 2 million Wii U consoles in Japan: How many units did Black Ops II sell on PS3 in Japan? About 600K apparently. You might say that's a lot, and it is, but trying to replicate those numbers on Nintendo's machine it's simply impossible. Try to tell me a non-Nintendo game that has surpassed the 100K barrier in Japan; I'm pretty sure you will come here again with two or three, and all of them will be very Japanese titles. Western titles don't sell on Nintendo's consoles there. So 2 million consoles less. Third party publishers have to be lucky if they want to sell 6.5 million units of their games on Wii U 

2. Not all consoles are active today: Do you think everybody are still playing their Wii U? Nope. I'm not sure why neither Smash or Kart 8 have bigger numbers. I mean, they should have if there are many people still playing the thing. 250-500K consoles less? 

3. Not all parents are interested on Assassin's Creed or ZombiU for their kids: Think about it, do you really think all Wii U owners are "strong Nintendo fans"? I don't think so; indeed, there are many parents that only want to buy these consoles just to keep entertained their children. They know Nintendo produces the machine, so what games do they buy? Nintendo titles starring their popular characters. 

The number of Wii Us under these conditions I think is very high. 3 million, what do you think? I mean, apparently Hyrule Warriors IS THE ONLY third party game that has surpassed the million mark, and it has Zelda themes everywhere. 

4. What do I win if I buy Black Flag on Wii U? Lower frame rates?:https://www.youtube.com/wat... Where's also the incentive for buying this game on Wii U? I see better stuff for it on Xbox Live... Where is Nintendo's strong online infrastructure? I don't see it. So again, why should I buy this game on Wii U? What do Ubisoft and Nintendo offer to me? Nothing in my opinion, but funny enough, I still bought the game on Wii U and I regret it completely. Thank you Mario and Rayman. 2 million consoles less? 

5. Do not generalize, Wii U owners also play on other platforms, belive it or not: I play on PC and Xbox 360, I bought many third party games for Wii U but I stopped with Black Flag because, number 1, there wasn't anything in 2014 aside from Watch Dogs, and number 2, I just did not like Ghosts and Black Flag, those games made me stop from trying to purchase any other third party game for Nintendo's thing. Then one year later you could see me buying AC Rogue for Xbox 360. 1 million less? 

6. Yes, there are people that simply don't want to buy third games on Wii U because of your reasons, author, why not? 1 million less? 

So, in the end, with all things considered, what is the possible number of sales for any third party game on Wii U? 500K? 300K? 200K? Publishers are right about abandoning the console, but they still did their madness with ugly ports, and that's not acceptable either. 

But I blame Nintendo completely.



My bet with The_Liquid_Laser: I think the Switch won't surpass the PS2 as the best selling system of all time. If it does, I'll play a game of a list that The_Liquid_Laser will provide, I will have to play it for 50 hours or complete it, whatever comes first. 

Maraccuda said:
All THREE are to blame.

Nintendo for not actively seeking third , arty support.
Third parties for not supporting Nintendo consoles AND even making gimped versions of said games.
Gamers for not buying the games.

But that being said third parties expecting their games to sell millions upon launch is ludicrous! Sales arent all or nothing, but are instead are steady stream of sales, with each new release building upon the sales.

Gamers have the fault? How? And are people actually supporting this? Why? People in the end buy whatever they want, they can't be wrong while not purchasing third games on Wii U. That's responsability of both Nintendo and the publisher, but mainly Nintendo, they must generate interest in the consumer, they have to make appealing the purchasing of third games on Wii U for consumers. 



My bet with The_Liquid_Laser: I think the Switch won't surpass the PS2 as the best selling system of all time. If it does, I'll play a game of a list that The_Liquid_Laser will provide, I will have to play it for 50 hours or complete it, whatever comes first.