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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - IGN N-Podcast 60 and Summary - How Wii doesn't even compare to Current Gen.

jefforange89 said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
jefforange89 said:
lol@people bickering over NSMBWii online

Any sort of lag whatsoever would completely ruin the game. That's why they didn't do it.

I would say that if the game actually was running at a level closer to DS specs, then online would have been easy, since it certainly wouldn't be a lot of information to process.

Yes, but there's also the fact that some people have shit internet connections, you can end up with high pings, and so on.

The real limiting factor would be internet connections for it having online, not the Wii hardware itself.

Of course, but that applies to every game. The game side is about taking care of the parts they can control.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

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noname2200 said:
So, I'm not sure how much longer this thread is going to go, but if there are any folks here who are looking for a great Nintendo podcast to replace the never-all-that-fun IGN one, I'd like to suggest Radio Free Nintendo. It's funny, it's not-at-all fanboyish (all the cast have other systems too, and talk about those games at least once per episode), and the Retroactive's are AWESOME. Download the Super Metroid one in particular; I'm sure it'll make you want to listen to more.

Subscribed to the RSS feed. Thanks!



Gnizmo said:
Khuutra said:
He probably didn't want to find out: it was probably presented to him by the technical team. Or something. I don't know. Coming up with scenarios for it feels dishonest for me, because I'm only making shots in the dark.

I just have trouble disbelieving him out of hand.

I can agree with this, which is where my original position comes in. Trying to get online to work effectively proved to be impossible. I could see it being presented to him, but I can also see it as a feature that was never fully explored. When someone as in charge as Miyamoto dislikes the idea of a feature in a game you can bet it won't get a lot of work put in to trying to implement it. I agree that coming up with various scenarios is a bit dishonest, but given the counter-intuitive nature of the claim it seems the only way to try and actually understand what is going on behind the scenes.

@LtNK
Considering I have put that in almost all of my replies to you, and only now do you address it I would say you are absolutely evading it. The reason he most likely didn't do the programming is because he works the design aspects. I am not fully aware of the exact structure in Nintendo, but it would be the only studio I have heard of that has someone being a prominent figure in both aspects. Logically it doesn't make sense.

If it was reported to him then it is, at best, second hand knowledge. This could mean he mis-interpreted what was said, or did not accurately convey the message in the interview. When you require as much evidence as you can provide I will entertain your argument again. Until then there is no point in trying to discuss a point when you have less than no interest in actually entertaining both sides of the debate.

Well, they did say he would watch programmers over the shoulders for hours sometimes, so he was pretty close to the production process.

Even then, I think what he said might have been missinterpreted, and that online was out because of the same reasons you seem to point.

Also, man, this thread exploded.



Do you guys know the meaning of ping? It would destroy NSMBWii online. It could be a 8-bit game and still lag due to slow ping.



routsounmanman said:
Do you guys know the meaning of ping? It would destroy NSMBWii online. It could be a 8-bit game and still lag due to slow ping.

I try to be up for learning new things. What specifically would be the problem?



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

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ph4nt said:
I really, really have lost hope in the gaming community as a whole.

This sorry excuse for a podcast claims the Gamecube was a hardcore console, they acted like they loved the cutting edge graphics. Yet, the Gamecube was largely received as a Kiddy system, got no third party support, failed sales wise (tho still made money). So they decide to go into a different direction that works wonders, they create the two best selling systems of all time, sell more software than any other system before it, making record profits, and guess what? Everyone hates them for making casual games (when it was the third parties who are making the crappy casual games). Not having a lot of horsepower, not having a huge online component. Well, when they actually had graphics noone bought their system, why would they continue that route? Here Sony has lost every penny they ever made with the Playstation brand, Microsoft is just barely turning a profit, and yet they think Nintendo should be more like them? please!

This.



 

 

        Wii FC: 6440 8298 7583 0720   XBOX GT: WICK1978               PSN: its_the_wick   3DS: 1676-3747-7846                                          Nintendo Network: its-the-wick

Systems I've owned: Atari 2600, NES, SNES, GBColor, N64, Gamecube, PS2, Xbox, GBAdvance, DSlite, PSP, Wii, Xbox360, PS3, 3DS, PSVita, PS4, 3DS XL, Wii U

The best quote I've seen this year:

Angelus said: I'm a moron

wick said:
ph4nt said:
I really, really have lost hope in the gaming community as a whole.

This sorry excuse for a podcast claims the Gamecube was a hardcore console, they acted like they loved the cutting edge graphics. Yet, the Gamecube was largely received as a Kiddy system, got no third party support, failed sales wise (tho still made money). So they decide to go into a different direction that works wonders, they create the two best selling systems of all time, sell more software than any other system before it, making record profits, and guess what? Everyone hates them for making casual games (when it was the third parties who are making the crappy casual games). Not having a lot of horsepower, not having a huge online component. Well, when they actually had graphics noone bought their system, why would they continue that route? Here Sony has lost every penny they ever made with the Playstation brand, Microsoft is just barely turning a profit, and yet they think Nintendo should be more like them? please!

This.

Just Sony lost all the profits from the PS2. Not sure about the PS1. But otherwise those numbers do show the bashers just have trouble grasping the math there.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

routsounmanman said:
Do you guys know the meaning of ping? It would destroy NSMBWii online. It could be a 8-bit game and still lag due to slow ping.

I believe the term you are referring to is latency.

It is not necessarily true that latency would destroy NSMBWii,  it depends on the net-code itself, but let us suppose it is done well, then it would be fine.

latency for Close geographically located people (same country) has already been solved, take a look at counterstrike which requires fast twitch action (and that was released many many moons ago), and Xbox and playstation and a rather large large online area.

It would destroy the value of NSMBWii because online play is not a really social thing on the level of playing with your friends, NSMBWii, and virtually every multiplayer game on the wii, is a family-friendly type game, not the more antisocial nerdy online play atmosphere.

Remember, at least for now, Nintendo is aiming at every market segment BUT the hardcore gamer-types (which sony and microsoft is fighting over).

Net-play would simply be aiming the hardcore market segment, and since those gamers are more on sony/microsoft, well NSMBWii would not have sold as well.



LordTheNightKnight said:
routsounmanman said:
Do you guys know the meaning of ping? It would destroy NSMBWii online. It could be a 8-bit game and still lag due to slow ping.

I try to be up for learning new things. What specifically would be the problem?

Ping is the time required to respond to a call between the client and the server / another client. You can have the fastest connection in the world and still have very low ping, thus, when you browse a page, you see no difference from the person next to you with a 1Mbps connection.

Mario platformers require quick reflexes, thus low ping, response time. The network system is not fast enough for a game like Mario, or other split-second decision games.



routsounmanman said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
routsounmanman said:
Do you guys know the meaning of ping? It would destroy NSMBWii online. It could be a 8-bit game and still lag due to slow ping.

I try to be up for learning new things. What specifically would be the problem?

Ping is the time required to respond to a call between the client and the server / another client. You can have the fastest connection in the world and still have very low ping, thus, when you browse a page, you see no difference from the person next to you with a 1Mbps connection.

Mario platformers require quick reflexes, thus low ping, response time. The network system is not fast enough for a game like Mario, or other split-second decision games.

I'll expand on this by saying shooters are a completely different category from something like a platformer, since shooters rely heavily on prediction in their coding since the days of DOOM on 56k.  Look at how the characters physically interact in NSMBW, now show me a shooter that has that level of interaction between players. Again shooting doesn't count because it's (usually invisible) projectiles relying on prediction, which also leads to so many "oh that's a bunch of BS!!!!" moments in online shooters. Compare local FPS gaming (LAN party or 4 player split screen) with online, you'll see a massive difference.

Actually Gears of War had physical projectiles, and its online was pretty abysmal from a technical standpoint (host advantage was very apparent).