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Forums - PC Discussion - 200,000 PC Gamers Signed Petition Against MW2

Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
Meanwhile Activision sold 5 million copies or so of MW2 on the first day....

PS : and the above poster is right, by bitching everytime there is a change on a PC game, all you will get is less and less hyped games released on the PC...

If those games are gonna be the pile of shit that MW2 is then I'll be glad if they don't make it to the market period.

 

@people hwo say pirates are themajrity

I had a discussion with someone about this and he got owned pretty hard, don't even bother.

Lol and you are the industry expert on this I guess..

The only reliable data we have on this is the latest Stardock game that was released without needing a customer key to connect to the developers servers for online play.

Stardocks themselves ( which is a studio that is huge against DRM and only develops for PC) said that what they saw is that 80% of the players on the servers were using pirated versions of the software.......

He's actually referring to me - And I got "owned pretty hard" because he didn't fully read anything I wrote, ignored statistics, links, and developer quotes, and pretty much blocked his ears and yelled "LALALA NO PIRACY ANYWHERE LALALA."

I remember reading a similar article to that stardock game - where a company had 200,000 more people playing the game on their servers than they had copies sold.

Fortunately, industry experts (like Vlad) are here to assure us that piracy is not a big problem, and none of your fancy "numbers" are going to change that.



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jefforange89 said:
And I'll say it again: you seem to be working under the false assumption that a pirate copy equals a lost sale.

Which, in truth, it's typically the opposite - most pirates wouldn't buy the game it that were their only choice. Thus, it doesn't actually affect the publisher or developer in the slightest.

You gave a very weak example of this argument.  I think it is actually the reverse.  A pirated copy (or download) equals more than one lost sale.  If it's been pirated, it can be spread to any friends, family, etc. without any of them having to buy it themselves.  If one friend pirates it, then other friends play it and want to play with him, that friend can just burn them a disc with the cracked game and have instant free gaming.  Most people don't even see PC game pirating as a bad thing, just like song downloads.



NJ5 said:
1) Why did this thread get derailed into piracy so quickly?

2) Dedicated servers are important to me, so I don't think I will buy any games which don't support them. Unless it's a game I want for the single player of course.

1) PC haters lacking valid arguments?

2) You are totally right, if older multiplayer PC games offered them, their removal is a regress, and a serious one, as gamers appreciated them.



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jefforange89 said:
And I'll say it again: you seem to be working under the false assumption that a pirate copy equals a lost sale.

Which, in truth, it's typically the opposite - most pirates wouldn't buy the game it that were their only choice. Thus, it doesn't actually affect the publisher or developer in the slightest.

The Stardocks guys that had to work over a holydays week-end to fix their servers because they were exploding due to the number of pirates on them beg to differ............

 

PS : if it didn't affect sales don't you think you would get bigger sales on the PC than on the consoles for games where the PC features are actually good ( like CoD4).

I mean we keep getting told there are hundreds of millions of PC users while the numbers of consoles users are much lower, yet despite that games that are similar on both mediums sells more on consoles and piracy isn't the reason ?( and to boot it the console version is actually more expensive than the PC version by 10$)

 



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

jefforange89 said:
And I'll say it again: you seem to be working under the false assumption that a pirate copy equals a lost sale.

Which, in truth, it's typically the opposite - most pirates wouldn't buy the game it that were their only choice. Thus, it doesn't actually affect the publisher or developer in the slightest.

Ok, and if piracy didn't exist, would these individuals go on and do something else with their time, like take up stamp collecting, or create music?  I would wager most pirates would end up feeling the need to buy SOMETHING, if they had to.  They are just part of a culture where it is easy to not have to pay for anything, so they will play with this game or that, and get some hours of enjoyment out of it, and not pay anyone a cent.  They have the mentality of being freeloaders and gloating in how they rip off the system.  In this, I am NOT speaking of individuals who do this to try stuff out first and buy, just the individuals who life a live as a leech. 



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vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
Meanwhile Activision sold 5 million copies or so of MW2 on the first day....

PS : and the above poster is right, by bitching everytime there is a change on a PC game, all you will get is less and less hyped games released on the PC...

If those games are gonna be the pile of shit that MW2 is then I'll be glad if they don't make it to the market period.

 

@people hwo say pirates are themajrity

I had a discussion with someone about this and he got owned pretty hard, don't even bother.

Lol and you are the industry expert on this I guess..

The only reliable data we have on this is the latest Stardock game that was released without needing a customer key to connect to the developers servers for online play.

Stardocks themselves ( which is a studio that is huge against DRM and only develops for PC) said that what they saw is that 80% of the players on the servers were using pirated versions of the software.......

 

Indeed that happened to stardock and it happened the first week onlye, if you remember. I wonder if that is still the case.

A the same time if you look there are games that are still in the top 10 sellers lists even after years, while they don't break even the top 10 list on the pirated sides at all. Wonder how that happens....

Because you will only find recently released titles on the top 10 lists of pirate sites.

As a title gets older more people have it available and you can find it on every torrent or even get it from a friend and you don't need to visit the best site to get hold of it.........



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

nightsurge said:
vlad321 said:
nightsurge said:
vlad321 said:
nightsurge said:
To clarify, I am not saying that the petition is filled with pirates signatures. I was not defending that remark by whoever I quoted. I know very well why people who only get games like this on PC are upset. It's basically a console port with mouse + keyboard support, completely taking out everything that made it unique on PC. I understand all that and that's the reason why I will only be getting it on 360 now rather than on both. I was merely adding to the whole "most PC gamers are pirates" generalization since in my experience as well, it sure seems this way.

That's funny cause statistics who that your experience maybe just that, your experience.

Nah, I think it's the experience of most people, actually, or if not the majority, then at least 1/3 or higher and it will soon be the majority..  Especially when recent PC developers have said that their game's online component is being played by 80% pirates....

Someone already provided the link to show that pirates aren't as much as buyers, can you provide me with actual statistics to show otherwise?

That was just a list of 2008 only.... CoD4 released in 2007.... DemiGod had 80% piracy.  CoD4 had 830,000 downloads in the year after its release... I wonder with the frontloaded holidays if it had 3x that amount in 2007.  No one has shown me any 2007 stats yet.  With CoD4 on PC only having an estimated 1-3 million retail sales, it makes sense that a large portion (of at least one third for most games and much higher for others, which will only keep growing) of the people playing the actual game are pirates.  Why else would IW not release any info on the PC only sales, and then with the next game iteration they only develop a console version?

I also wonder how much CoD4 sold in that  same period as well as how many of those downloads were from places where getting the game legally is also next to impossible (lack of publisher, few retail stores, etc.).



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
Meanwhile Activision sold 5 million copies or so of MW2 on the first day....

PS : and the above poster is right, by bitching everytime there is a change on a PC game, all you will get is less and less hyped games released on the PC...

If those games are gonna be the pile of shit that MW2 is then I'll be glad if they don't make it to the market period.

 

@people hwo say pirates are themajrity

I had a discussion with someone about this and he got owned pretty hard, don't even bother.

Lol and you are the industry expert on this I guess..

The only reliable data we have on this is the latest Stardock game that was released without needing a customer key to connect to the developers servers for online play.

Stardocks themselves ( which is a studio that is huge against DRM and only develops for PC) said that what they saw is that 80% of the players on the servers were using pirated versions of the software.......

 

Indeed that happened to stardock and it happened the first week onlye, if you remember. I wonder if that is still the case.

A the same time if you look there are games that are still in the top 10 sellers lists even after years, while they don't break even the top 10 list on the pirated sides at all. Wonder how that happens....

Because you will only find recently released titles on the top 10 lists of pirate sites.

As a title gets older more people have it available and you can find it on every torrent or even get it from a friend and you don't need to visit the best site to get hold of it.........

So only recently released games get pirated, yet games manage to sell for years. Ultimately there are far more sales than there are pirated copies, especially if the game is not some shitty game like Crysis.

There is a reason why they are the most popular torrents, because they are used by the most people, so your argument as people finding it on other trackers is actually kinda pointless....

 

@Jereel

I wish you had provided ANY statistics that I could have ignored, sadly you didn't.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
Meanwhile Activision sold 5 million copies or so of MW2 on the first day....

PS : and the above poster is right, by bitching everytime there is a change on a PC game, all you will get is less and less hyped games released on the PC...

If those games are gonna be the pile of shit that MW2 is then I'll be glad if they don't make it to the market period.

 

@people hwo say pirates are themajrity

I had a discussion with someone about this and he got owned pretty hard, don't even bother.

Lol and you are the industry expert on this I guess..

The only reliable data we have on this is the latest Stardock game that was released without needing a customer key to connect to the developers servers for online play.

Stardocks themselves ( which is a studio that is huge against DRM and only develops for PC) said that what they saw is that 80% of the players on the servers were using pirated versions of the software.......

 

Indeed that happened to stardock and it happened the first week onlye, if you remember. I wonder if that is still the case.

A the same time if you look there are games that are still in the top 10 sellers lists even after years, while they don't break even the top 10 list on the pirated sides at all. Wonder how that happens....

Because you will only find recently released titles on the top 10 lists of pirate sites.

As a title gets older more people have it available and you can find it on every torrent or even get it from a friend and you don't need to visit the best site to get hold of it.........

So only recently released games get pirated, yet games manage to sell for years. Ultimately there are far more sales than there are pirated copies, especially if the game is not some shitty game like Crysis.

There is a reason why they are the most popular torrents, because they are used by the most people, so your argument as people finding it on other trackers is actually kinda pointless....

 

@Jereel

I wish you had provided ANY statistics that I could have ignored, sadly you didn't.

Where exactly did I say that ?

Once many people have a pirated version of a game you don't need to get hold of it through a site that tracks downloads is all I said...

Getting it from your budy next door is still pirating ( and is a lot more convenient and faster, college campus for example don't look kindly on their networks users having huge uploads which you typically need to get good torrent download speed).

 



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

nightsurge said:
Mudface said:
Slimebeast said:

The large majority of PC gamers are pirates, especially guys that play shooters, so it's pretty safe to say that the majority of those who signed the petition are pirates.

 

These figures would tend to disagree with your assertion, especially as a fair percentage of those downloads would later translate into sales. There's a lot of piracy for sure, but nowhere near a majority of PC gamers are pirates.

But thats just ONE torrent site:  BitTorrent.  Pirates use uTorrent, Vuze, ArcticTorrent, Aria2, BitCommet, Bitflu, BitLet, BitThief, BitLord, CTorrent, Deluge, Halite, KTorrent, etc. etc.  That link you posted just goes to show that the majority of PC gamers ARE pirates because on just one Torrent Client you already have 830,000 downloads of CoD4.  I imagine the pirated copies of CoD4 actually far outnumber the legitimate ones!!!

you really have no idea how a torrent file works... a single file can be uploaded to all those sites. All stats tracked for 1 file will translate into the majority due to all seeds and peers being connected to a tracker that downloads from ONE point. AND, it doesnt matter what the main file for the torrent is named, MW2 crack, MW2 pirated, MW2 steal, etc could easily be all the same torrent named differently due to the main URL for the files being ONE TRACKER location.



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