But doesn't god know the exact path you are going to take in the end? If he doesn't, then he's not omniscient...

As for this thread, it's obviously derailed already.

Look, angrypoolman, yeah it's not an original question at all and repeating something another person said doesn't make you smart (although intellectual doesn't necessarily mean smart). However, I don't really see why you think it's just "stupid". You don't think that it at least points out the obvious flaws of a "perfect" omni-X being (potent, in this case)?

It's not as if the debate is completely gone, and in fact, because you brought up the question, you've heard a lot of theist give their take on it and think about it. If a question did that, I don't see how it's "stupid".

I think you're just saying it's "stupid" because you're frusturated and didn't want to hear the Atheist's side of an argument.

That depends on your interpretation of the term "omniscience" and how it would apply to a god.

But this is still a contradiction.

God can know what path I am taking, but it can't make me take any path it chooses. This means it can't do anything (make me take a path of it's liking).

if it can, then I don't have free will. 

Knowing absolutely everything. Just like god is supposed to be able to do absolutely everything.

So god should know the pottential paths you would have been able to take with free will as you say, and the path you will take with free will in the end.

I won't comment on the ramifications of that, but in the god knows what you will do, made you that way, had the power to do anything, and will punish you for it.

Stepping away from the problem of evil (?), I think that the problem of hell is just a much simpler and down to earth question. Does anyone here, back he here on planet Earth, believe that torture is a valid punishment? You know, unusual and cruel punishment? Does anyone think, that even for mass murders like Hitler, we should torture him daily by burning? Whoever wants to do that just seems like a sadistic fuck to me O.o Literally taking enjoyment in the pain of others.

Also the concept of an infinite punishment for a finite transgression seems flawed too. Even Hitler, how long we are we going to burn him alive (or whatever was described in Dante's inferno O.o)? Forever? The concept of an infinite pain seems to always out weigh whatever finite ammount of pain he could have inflicted, however massive it is.

Lol, also I don't know if I'm breaking Godwin's law, because in this case I'm using Hitler to defend him.

^^That is your definition of omniscience. But that is all semantics really. I, for one, would take a being who understands all possible outcomes to all possible actions to be omniscient. The "capacity" to know everything infinitely.

Given enough parameters, anyone's actions can be predictable. Does that mean there is no free will?  Are we all just a series of bodily functions and synapses for a given set of parameters.  A parameter set that is incredibly huge.

Not thinking so technically and scientificly, don't we have the "capacity" to know anything? Well, ok let's have an actual example since you could argue that if memory was tied physically to our brains, it has a physical limit or whatever (I don't even know anything about the nature of memory though O.o)

I mean, I have the capacity to be able to bench 1000 pounds (or whatever the world record is) as a fellow human. However, having the capacity to do so doesn't make me a "1000 pound lifter" does it?

Well the issue of free will isn't just that god knows everything, but that he created the world knowing it would be that way.

If I knew that lets say, if I made a button on a elevator that would nuke Russia and start WWIII, and also told you, let you, etc on that elevator, would you have started WWIII out of your own free will? Were you forced to do something you didn't want to? And that's not even really the best analogy, since with god he's supposed to have created you knowing what would happen (or as ID proponents like to say "designed" you to be that way).

So again, no it's not just knowing the future, but creating something in a certain way, knowing their future.

How is it contradiction ? God could make you choose any path he wants, however he doesn't do so because it would remove your free will.

Have I not been speaking English in this thread?

Maybe I'm being a little complicated, allow me to simplify my argument.

1. Infinite and finite realms are two different things. For an infinite being to exist in a finite realm (our Universe) then it must adhere to the limitations in our Universe, therefore becoming limited by our time and power.

2. For an infinite being to create within our Universe then it become finite in order to interact with us, whether this is external or internal. (See Genesis being measured in periods of time argument)

3. If God created our universe then it must be finite to have done so. If god is finite then that must mean that at some point it didn't exist and at some point it will cease to exist. (This is a further catalist to the creators creator argument.)

4. Therefore two opposing conclusions can be drawn...

i. If God was an infinite being but created the finite Universe, then we must assume that God has had to become finite in order to interact or create it, therefore adhering to the same limitations as all beings within our Universe making it as mortal/fragil as you and I. So it can't move a rock of theoretical infinite size within our finite Universe.

ii. God is infinite and therefore can move any rock of any size, dimension or weight within an infinite realm. But this would make it unlikely that God is a creator of our Universe.

No, we do not have the capacity to know everything.  Especially when dealing with infinites.  But one could argue, is there an infinite amount of knowledge?

Well, it is probable that it, if one has an incredibly in depth knowledge of my body, my decision in your scenario can be easily obtained.  We are all just incredibly complex functions.

Well lets say knowing a language is consider knowledge. I can make English+A, by adding the letter A to every where. I can make the language, English+AA by adding AA to every word. With that, I have essentially created a new knowledge. If we consider knowing a number to be a knowledge, then it'll be infinite.

Now if we as humans are able to hold infinite knowledge, probably not, if the nature of memory is tied in with physical things (cells, etc). But my point was, with the weight lifting, having the capacity and capaibility doesn't actually elevate you up to that status of being able to do it O.o I'm able to be able to lift 1000 pounds XD It's just a matter of the English language and awkwardness. Being able alone isn't it, you have to actually be able to lift it at the momment, not be able to be able to lift it... you get my drift? XD (I know, it's awkward and confusing).