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Forums - Website Topics - Who else doesn't give a hoot about VG Chartz game ratings?

scottie on 29 March 2009

Actually Khuutra, if you are certain that you want those 3 sections to stay, there is one change that would make scores more consistent.

Currently, when deciding the final score, the only limitation is that it needs to be somewhere between the highest and lowest section.

If instead we changed it to actually being the rounded off average of the three scores, the consistency could be improved.

Just throwing it out there, feel free to do it or not



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Khuutra on 29 March 2009

This has nothing to do with my opinion, Scottie: this is not the proper context for me to express any particular opinion about the scoring system. As a contributor I implicitly agree to the system under which I write, by virtue of writing for it.

And I'm not in any control of that system, either. I'm just fostering conversation, here, because I find it interesting and I think it does people good to talk this stuff out.

My question wasn't how to look at the categories differently: is there any way to improve them without making them more specific? That does not necessarily mean leaving them alone: some people might think it superior to get rid of category scores altogether.



Riot Of The Blood on 29 March 2009
Khuutra said:
If we did that, wouldn't the second opinion make it a communal score? At that point you're moving towards a law of averages rather than an actual, critical review.

Let m ask you guys something: you're kind of referencing categorical scores that some big sites (namely IGN) use because you think that our categories, as they are now, are unclear. Would there be any way to alleviate this problem without just adding on more categories?

I don't think of it as adding more categories. Instead, I view it as breaking the one's we have into more detailed categories. The one's we have now are extremely vague, because they try to cover too much in one category. This, however, would be easily fixed just by spliting them up into more in-depth categories. However, you guy's seem so against the idea for whatever reason. If you're going to continue and use a system that scores games based on the average score of individual categories, then I'm afraid that I don't think you can realisticly alleviate the problem without breaking the categories up and/or adding more.

You could just get rid of the sytem period and reviewers give the score based on nothing more than what they thought the game deserved, but that would be even worse.

 



I am Washu-bot B, loyal servant of Final-Fan, the greatest scientific genius in the universe!


NanakiXI on 29 March 2009

Maybe just rid of categories scores all together and let the Reviewer decide the final score. But still let the reviewer give a brief description of categories at the very end. May not be foolproof though.



FootballFan - "GT has never been bigger than Halo. Now do a comparison between the two attach ratios and watch GT get stomped by Halo. Reach will sell 5 million more than GT5. Quote me on it."

Khuutra on 29 March 2009

Well, that's what I mean to ask: working from the ground up, ignoring what VGChartz already has in place, how would you do it? What categorical scores would be listed, if any? What scales would be used? Would there even be a score? What should the body of the review contain?

This question I charge you with: what should a review be, and how should it be made?



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NanakiXI on 29 March 2009
Khuutra said:
Well, that's what I mean to ask: working from the ground up, ignoring what VGChartz already has in place, how would you do it? What categorical scores would be listed, if any? What scales would be used? Would there even be a score? What should the body of the review contain?

This question I charge you with: what should a review be, and how should it be made?

 

The review should have the main Categories like most review sites but should be only in the article.

Each category could describe in more legnth how they feel about Story, Music/Sound/, Gameply/Mechanics, Concept, Graphics.

May be more risky though as it is harder to give an overall score for author.

Story

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Music/Sound

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Gameply/Mechanics

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Concept

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Graphics

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Short Descriptions of Cons and Pros at end pf Article

Story

+    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Music/Sound

+    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Gameply/Mechanics

+     ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Concept

+     ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Graphics

+     ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-     ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Overall Score - ?/10 (Based on authors decision)

 



FootballFan - "GT has never been bigger than Halo. Now do a comparison between the two attach ratios and watch GT get stomped by Halo. Reach will sell 5 million more than GT5. Quote me on it."

Fumanchu on 29 March 2009

Off topic from the scoring system; I would suggest putting a stop to these 'legacy' reviews. While I think it's good to keep people on the site for longer, it appears to have created more of a adverse reaction with people pointing out their futility as any credibility and relevance is lost in posting them a year after the game's release.

Perhaps a new policy should be enforced that see's reviews posted within a 3-month window from release. Sure there will be lots of games that slip through the gaps with limited resources, but I think it will go a long way to establishing more credibility within the industry as you're not 'unfairly' treated with the gift of hindsight. The community would also benefit more from it as well as you're educating people at a time closer to when they're considering purchase, which is the point isn't it?



Khuutra on 29 March 2009
Fumanchu said:
Off topic from the scoring system; I would suggest putting a stop to these 'legacy' reviews. While I think it's good to keep people on the site for longer, it appears to have created more of a adverse reaction with people pointing out their futility as any credibility and relevance is lost in posting them a year after the game's release.

Perhaps a new policy should be enforced that see's reviews posted within a 3-month window from release. Sure there will be lots of games that slip through the gaps with limited resources, but I think it will go a long way to establishing more credibility within the industry as you're not 'unfairly' treated with the gift of hindsight. The community would also benefit more from it as well as you're educating people at a time closer to when they're considering purchase, which is the point isn't it?

Not really.

We are encouraged to score newer games, but the point of a review is not just to inform people concerning purchasing decisions.



BengaBenga on 29 March 2009
coolestguyever said:
Strategyking92 said:
BengaBenga said:
Strategyking92 said:

That could well be. But people that moan about reviews simply because they disagree, like coolestguy, simply don't understand what a review should be about.

 

 

Unfortunately there will always be people that like to bitch about anyting, but I tend to think most people like our reviews, at least as a feature of the site, and as VGC continues to grow people will have to accept that they're there.

 

Well let me put it this way, i like the written part of the reviews. They are very in depth and well written. Its the score I don't always agree with. So many obscure games get high scores that may not always be deserved, while some very popular games get left in the dust with low scores.

 

So why don't put this in the OP?

This reaction is a mature, well argumented opinion why you don't like our scoring (not the reviews) and it sound very reasonable. This contrary to the "I don't give a hoot" statement.

Yes, I can see there appears to be a slight preference towards niche genres and Japanese games in general. Everyone has a bias and that's no difference to the staff. Especially since VGC has a relatively high number of people liking Japanese games.

However it's not very different form the IGN-it's a hyped game so it get's a high score-bias. Everyone knows this is the case, so you take that into account.

Not saying we won't listen to you and take it into consideration (we will), but I'm sure a JRPG fans are glad with a site that won't subtract points simply for being a JRPG.

 

 


I would suggest putting a stop to these 'legacy' reviews. While I think it's good to keep people on the site for longer, it appears to have created more of a adverse reaction with people pointing out their futility as any credibility and relevance is lost in posting them a year after the game's release.

To make sure we get review copies from publishers we have to prove and show how we review. And the only way to do that is to review older games (mostly games that are simply owned by the reviewers). In the (near) future I'm sure we'll do mostly new games and the transition is already happening. We had a number of reviews up before the release, something that will only increase.



Fumanchu on 29 March 2009

Well that's good to hear. Can't you adapt the 3-month window strategy now though? Why devote what little resources you have, to old games that will attract no outside attention and be shunned by the existing community?

I'm not sure that the publisher's will ever be convinced though because of the fact that it's community driven website, that doesn't require reviewer's to have any real industry experience/credentials. You would think that after 100 reviews they would have accepted it by now.