jetrii said: Euphoria14 said: @jetrii Ever thought of doing a Gears vs. MGS4 comparison? I would really be interested in that one, regardless of the outcome.   That one may take a while. I don't like to take guesses at games unless I know the underlying technology, even if I am confident that I am correct. I have a few documents and tech interviews that really cover the MGS4 engine in great detail but for some reason, I've never really looked at them for too long. I've been mostly reading up on the Unreal Engine, Crystal Tools (FFXIII), Killzone 2 engine, Naughty Dog engine, Insomniac engine, EDGE, and a few others. Sony first party/second party developers both interest me and frustrate me. They are capable of making great engines, yet they refuse to work together and instead decide to re-invent the wheel over and over again. It's good for innovation but slows things down. The best I could do for MGS4 vs Gears is a superficial comparison, I wouldn't be able to talk too much about the MGS4 technology like I did in page 5 unless I actually catch up on it. I can recognize different techniques and whatnot, but I don't think it would be as interesting as this one. However, if I decide to, I will let you know!

Thanks a lot.

If you are really unsure whether or not it would be as good as this thread feel free to just PM it to me.

As was the case with this thread here, I am sure I would find it to be a very worthwhile read.

Right, this is why is fairly obvious you don't know what you are talking about. Even talking about a memory footprint for a kernel may not even make any sense accept for the footprint of the code which is sure as hell not 70-80MB. You can access whatever you want in a game, but it's not going to be brought into memory until it's needed.

You don't know what these people mean by OS or footprint. They may not even know. You don't know if you are comparing the same thing between the 360 and PS3. Both numbers obviously include helper libraries and may or may not include other applications. If the XMB is included the number for the PS3 is going to be meaningless as it's fairly obvious if you've ever used one that the XMB is swapped out when you are in a game.

man i just went back and read that stuff on page 5 and thats crazy. Thanks for all the info it really helps show exactly whats going on. Know anything about what is being used on the 360 with Gears 2 and Ureal Engine?

um not being a jerk or anything but I've read alot of jettri's posts and like none of yours and he does know what he's talking about.

Have you even looked into how the Killzone 2 game engine operates? Killzone 2 cannot be done in a similar manner with the Unreal engine.

Yes, I agree Killzone 2 has better designed assets, but also higher quality assets, higher quality graphics and audio.

Trees? Motorstorm: Pacific Rift and Uncharted have great looking trees.... But it would have been out of place in this world created for Killzone 2.

Killzone 2 provides a high level of destructability, amazing lighting (hundreds of independent light sources on screen at once and even implements some raytracing effects), realtime generated cutscenes, advanced movie techniques like full screen motion blur where every pixel has a direction / speed, audio well above anything the 360 can provide technically, etc.

Sorry, but Killzone 2 is technically well above what Gears of War 2 provides apart from just better designed assets.

Actually, I am not really sure what will become of Guerilla Games or the Killzone 2 engine. Perhaps Sony will decide that they want a Killzone 2 production value game and have GG start working on Killzone 3 for the PS4 launch. If they however decide to bring Killzone 3 to the PS3, I suspect it will have a fairly large bump in graphics and animations. There are still a few things that GG could have done to make Killzone 2 look even better and they have definitely learned a lot over while developing the game.

If Sony found a way to lower the memory of the PS3 to 10MB, it wouldn't make a difference. For compatibility purposes, the game will only be able to see the amount of memory available on the PS3 at the time of build. So if they use an SDK that had xx amount of memory reserved for the PS3's OS at the time of completion, Killzone 2 will never be able to access more than that.

GoWII and UT3 share the same engine with minor modifications to GoWII version of the engine. I suspect the similar characters are due to the art team, not the engine itself. Although the U3 engine does promote the use of bump mapping, games like Mass Effect proved you can have great characters on it.

Killzone 2 fatures very smooth animations which are only enhanced by the use of motion blur. The game does do a very good job of having a lot of particles and action on the screen at the same time. Also, Gears 2 and Killzone 2 are different games. Killzone 2 is suppose to be an intensive immersive battle while Gears 2 is suppose to be much more intimate. The Unreal 3 Engine would probably sweat trying to acomplish what Killzone 2 acomplishes.

Orange soda

MikeB on page 5 he breaks down exactly what the engine is doing.  And the numbers came straight from Gurilla.

I've said this before and i'll say it again , "Better 60 Million on an awesome Exclusive, than 50 Million on some exclusive DLC"

alenphnull, there is nothing else I can or will say. I have already stated my claim that is backed up by dozens of news sites, Sony itself in the interview I posted earlier, Neogaf/Beyond3D developers that have actually worked on the game, and my old contacts back in Bethesda. The evidence is there, it is yours to believe it or not. Go to a forum in which game developers actively post and ask them that question. Heck, spent 5 seconds Google searching it. You will have your answer. 

If you wish to talk about something else, I am more than happy, but I am done having this discussion with you.

@jetrii

I have heard that outside of a few games like a Gears of War, the Unreal 3 Engine doesn't work too well on consoles. It caused issues with many games like LO, TLR and ME to name a few, like texture pop-in, slow down, massive load times, etc...

Let us just say EPIC or any other company for that matter tried to recreate KZ2 with the Unreal 3 Engine, do you think it would even run on either console? If it would run, do you think it would run at a reasonable framerate or that it would have a giant amount of technical issues?