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Forums - Sales - halo Wars sales will be huge for it's genre - bigger than killzone 2.

Khuutra on 01 February 2009
NinjaKido said:
Khuutra said:
shio said:
Khuutra said:
TyePhoid_PAL said:
RTS just arent for consoles. Unless this raises the bar substantially then its going to be disapointing unfortunately. Still I expect both games to sell well over time.

They said this about first person shooters for a long, long time.

well I think it's obvious the vast difference between consle FPS gameplay and PC FPS gameplay.

 

Well duh.

There's a difference between a genre playing different on two media and a genre not being compatible with a medium, though. Console first person shooters are stomping the living Hell out of PC FPSes in terms of sales for a reason.

 

Console Vs PC FPS is all about accuracy and movement issue, PC's are X% more efficient at aiming etc . This argument is more to do with preciseness and efficieny , I've heard people say the ultimate "FPS experience is on the PC"but not "FPS's have no place on a console they should stricltly be on PC's" .

Console Vs PC RTS is all about functionality . RTS's just aren't as functional on consoles due to the limitations of the gamepad , i've read reports about how the gameplay elements of Halo Wars have been simplified ... probably to accomodate the XBOX 360's gamepad , but RTS's are supposed to be complex by nature hence the "Real Time >Strategy<" name given to the genre. If porting the genre to another platform limits the genre then it has no place on the platform .

being less efficient is a problem but still acceptable , if a game begins to lack functionality in a genre where functionality is key then you have to question whether the game belongs on the platform.

 

Real time strategy has nothing to do with complexity and everything that the name actually says - real time and strategy. Unit allocation, quickness of plan implementation, and the ability to retool one's strategy on the fly is the hallmark of RTSes. Complexity is not.



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NinjaKido on 01 February 2009
Khuutra said:
NinjaKido said:
Khuutra said:
shio said:
Khuutra said:
TyePhoid_PAL said:
RTS just arent for consoles. Unless this raises the bar substantially then its going to be disapointing unfortunately. Still I expect both games to sell well over time.

They said this about first person shooters for a long, long time.

well I think it's obvious the vast difference between consle FPS gameplay and PC FPS gameplay.

 

Well duh.

There's a difference between a genre playing different on two media and a genre not being compatible with a medium, though. Console first person shooters are stomping the living Hell out of PC FPSes in terms of sales for a reason.

 

Console Vs PC FPS is all about accuracy and movement issue, PC's are X% more efficient at aiming etc . This argument is more to do with preciseness and efficieny , I've heard people say the ultimate "FPS experience is on the PC"but not "FPS's have no place on a console they should stricltly be on PC's" .

Console Vs PC RTS is all about functionality . RTS's just aren't as functional on consoles due to the limitations of the gamepad , i've read reports about how the gameplay elements of Halo Wars have been simplified ... probably to accomodate the XBOX 360's gamepad , but RTS's are supposed to be complex by nature hence the "Real Time >Strategy<" name given to the genre. If porting the genre to another platform limits the genre then it has no place on the platform .

being less efficient is a problem but still acceptable , if a game begins to lack functionality in a genre where functionality is key then you have to question whether the game belongs on the platform.

 

Real time strategy has nothing to do with complexity and everything that the name actually says - real time and strategy. Unit allocation, quickness of plan implementation, and the ability to retool one's strategy on the fly is the hallmark of RTSes. Complexity is not.

 

When I talk about complexity think less about difficulty but more towards involving alot , consisting of many elements . Many of the things you mentioned and more constitue a complex game.



Khuutra on 01 February 2009

Then your definition of a complex game does not hinge on needlessly complex feature sets, and is applicable to Halo Wars in any case.

Tell you what,t though: I'll let you know how it stacks up to WC3 and Starcraft whenever the demo goes public.



JaggedSac on 01 February 2009
NinjaKido said:
Khuutra said:

Real time strategy has nothing to do with complexity and everything that the name actually says - real time and strategy. Unit allocation, quickness of plan implementation, and the ability to retool one's strategy on the fly is the hallmark of RTSes. Complexity is not.

 

When I talk about complexity think less about difficulty but more towards involving alot , consisting of many elements . Many of the things you mentioned and more constitue a complex game.


Well, it does look like they have decreased the complexity of Halo Wars.  But that does not mean they have decreased the fun of Halo Wars.  They have just focused more on combat, which for me, is quite easy to accomplish on the gamepad.  I was quite adept at BFMEII.  Switching back and forth from bases to combat is as easy as a press of a button.



JaggedSac on 01 February 2009

This is exactly what I was saying.

http://www.totalvideogames.com/Halo-Wars/feature-13647.html

TVG:  Halo Wars currently relies on using the gamepad for its control system; what is it about the scheme developed by Ensemble that succeeds where the likes of EA's Battle for Middle-Earth or Command & Conquer 3 on Xbox 360 perhaps doesn't?

I don't think it's just the controls; it's the controls coupled with a brand-new game mechanic that has many of the core elements of great strategy games, but has changed and evolved in a way that makes it feel native for the console.  I would say that games that have their roots in the PC, have their roots in a mouse and keyboard metaphor, and a mechanic that supports that.

Our game doesn't have that baggage.  It's not just that we developed a unique control system that you can overlay onto a game that's fundamentally 'mouse and keyboard'; we developed a unique control scheme over a brand new game mechanic that's fundamentally console.

TVG:  So it's more the fact that Halo Wars has been build solely up as a console IP?

Absolutely.  One thing to say is that part of the way we've changed the mechanic is to give you fixed bases.  When you no longer have to be jumping over the map to manage your oil production over there, or your wood production over there, that takes away a whole series of problems right there.  Then the question becomes [whether] it's going to a deep enough experience for strategy players.  The way we've addressed that is to introduce the notion of multiple bases, and so what represented the early development was really just evolving the mechanic from the get go to be very console friendly.

TVG:  But the PC as a platform is still THE platform for strategy games, isn't it?

It is until we release...

TVG: ...so you really do believe that Halo Wars can change the future of the genre on the console?

What I would say is that there's room for everybody.  I think that there are things you can do on the PC that you can't do on the console, and that's great.  There are things that you can do on console that you can't do on the PC, and I that I think is something people will see when they play Halo Wars.  They're going to say, “Wow, there's an entire strategy experience that I probably wouldn't be able to have to such an extent on the PC, I can have it on the console and it's awesome.”  I think we can have both.

I think we'll fundamentally alter the conversation so that it's no longer appropriate to say 'PC is the only place you can do strategy.”



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NinjaKido on 01 February 2009

there's not alot more to say about it ... i'll wait for the release of the reviews & Halo Wars before I make my conclusions.



TyePhoid_PAL on 01 February 2009

Not seen a good one yet. RTS requires VERY quick use of your mouse for scrolling. Having tried C&C on 360 the difference is huge. If Halo Wars was set for release it would have me looking forward to it much like I'm looking forward to Dawn of War 2.
I hope it proves great because I much prefer sitting on my couch relaxing on console games apposed to sitting at my crappy PC desk lol



Ynwa.

Coca-Cola on 03 February 2009

Halo Wars making its move on Amazon.
Currently at #50 for Limited Edition and #100 for the regular one.



ssj12 on 03 February 2009
gebx said:
Halo Wars will do to Console RTS's to what Halo CE did to console FPS's!!

Read Ars' Hands on!

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009/01/the-covenant-return-hands-on-with-halo-wars.ars

Thanks in large part to the game's control and Ensemble's clear consideration for the limitations of a controller when playing an RTS, Halo Wars manages to achieve a level of playability and accessibility that truly is fitting of the Halo dynasty. As Halo brought console FPS games to the masses in a way that Goldeneye couldn't, so to will Halo Wars introduce RTS games to a whole new league of gamers.

The multiplayer options of the game only make this kind of sweeping adoption more likely. Halo Wars features the full gamut of offline skirmish and online multiplayer modes for up to 6 players. Where the game will really win gamers over, though, is in its fully co-op capable story campaign. Given how hot co-op gaming is these days, that feature alone will win the game fans from gamers who aren't necessarily RTS fans or Halo fans.

 

I'm sorry but Halo did not do anything as good as goldeneye did for the console FPS genre. M$ is way to full of themselves.



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Cthulhu on 03 February 2009

lol who cares about halo wars, I really dont care if it sales 4 times more than killzone2. On the 5th of Feb i having the demo. oh wait today its the 3rd, so thats in 2 days. Killzone2 will rock....

I hope you enjoy Halo wars, an RTS...i will be playing dawn of war 2 when it comes.