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Forums - Sales Discussion - Why are people upset the blockbusters are on the HD Consoles?

Squilliam on 31 December 2008
Kasz216 said:
Squilliam said:
Because once to factor in all the costs, the bigger the game the less the Wii "advantages" on overall cost are important.


1. Massive advertisement; You have to advertise as much if not more than HD games to target the wider demographic of users on the Wii.

2. The cost/benifit ratio still applies; Why spend $10,000,000 making a Wii game look good when for an extra $10,000,000 the game will look 5* better?

3. Overall cost ratios come down and favour HD development more as your overall budget increases. Wii $10,000,000 game + $10,000,000 advertisement vs HD $20,000,000 game + $10,000,000 advertisement and the ratio is 2:3.

4. Easier to target demographics and advertising + word of mouth very easy to do with the HD community. The demographics they target for these games are deep, wide and easy to get to within the HD owner userbase. Also never underestimate the power of word of mouth selling games, especially within Xbox Live.

I actually disagree with all your points here.  I'd argue word of mouth is better on the Wii... i mean that's why wii games have better legs.

And games cost more to make look better on the PS360... in general.

Your making all the wrong arguements.

Market Diversification and the fact that the PS360 games when they flop, flop hard is the reason.

 

Not really, I was talking advertisement. When your userbase is more similar you can target your advertisements better to make them more effective. If you could target one TV station and know that 40% of your potential demographic is watching it then you don't have to spend as much to target them.

Word of mouth is at least as strong on the Xbox 360 when you consider the whole online community has mics and and the purchasing patterns are different, just because a game sells most of its sales quickly doesn't mean that it wasn't helped by major word of mouth. The Wii looks like it has better long term sales because A.) Their console owners take their sweet time to make purchases. B.) The sales of the console are higher so there are a lot of people buying multiples of games when they purchase their system and the games are cheaper so they are likely to pick up a couple of cheaper $20 games.

Btw, name one BIG HD game that has flopped. (40-60 Million budget)

 



Tease.

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Squilliam on 31 December 2008
madskillz said:
Squilliam said:

I want a Wii Fable 2 port with motion +!!! It would be such an awesome game and it would show Microsoft to be above the usual interconsole bickering and prove that they actually believe in the concept of Wii60!

But LOTR would be massive! I would love to play a game like that on the Wii provided it was well done. Its the perfect I.P to develop a mass appeal but awesome WRPG on the Wii.

 

I would love to be Legolas or Aragon on the LOTR Wii. My favorite parts of LOTR is when Lego is popping clowns like he's a Force Recon sniper in the Marines!

That's a game I would love to see the Wii as the lead console.

 

Hell yes! It would be awesome if Stephen Speilberg can direct that game, Boom blox is a fine example of creative talent and giving him the chance to use his movie making skills backed up with a big advertising budget would completely rock my world. EA, please! We know you love me, so do as I command.

 



Tease.

Kasz216 on 31 December 2008
Squilliam said:
Kasz216 said:
Squilliam said:
Because once to factor in all the costs, the bigger the game the less the Wii "advantages" on overall cost are important.


1. Massive advertisement; You have to advertise as much if not more than HD games to target the wider demographic of users on the Wii.

2. The cost/benifit ratio still applies; Why spend $10,000,000 making a Wii game look good when for an extra $10,000,000 the game will look 5* better?

3. Overall cost ratios come down and favour HD development more as your overall budget increases. Wii $10,000,000 game + $10,000,000 advertisement vs HD $20,000,000 game + $10,000,000 advertisement and the ratio is 2:3.

4. Easier to target demographics and advertising + word of mouth very easy to do with the HD community. The demographics they target for these games are deep, wide and easy to get to within the HD owner userbase. Also never underestimate the power of word of mouth selling games, especially within Xbox Live.

I actually disagree with all your points here.  I'd argue word of mouth is better on the Wii... i mean that's why wii games have better legs.

And games cost more to make look better on the PS360... in general.

Your making all the wrong arguements.

Market Diversification and the fact that the PS360 games when they flop, flop hard is the reason.

 

Not really, I was talking advertisement. When your userbase is more similar you can target your advertisements better to make them more effective. If you could target one TV station and know that 40% of your potential demographic is watching it then you don't have to spend as much to target them.

Word of mouth is at least as strong on the Xbox 360 when you consider the whole online community has mics and and the purchasing patterns are different, just because a game sells most of its sales quickly doesn't mean that it wasn't helped by major word of mouth. The Wii looks like it has better long term sales because A.) Their console owners take their sweet time to make purchases. B.) The sales of the console are higher so there are a lot of people buying multiples of games when they purchase their system and the games are cheaper so they are likely to pick up a couple of cheaper $20 games.

Btw, name one BIG HD game that has flopped. (40-60 Million budget)

 

You seem to miss my point.

That's why the BIG HD games need to be on the 360.

Because the regular games flop... and they cost 10-20 million.

While the big games should at worst make a small loss... on any system.

Though Strangehold was supposed to be in that range.

Something like 30 million not counting advertising?

And Too Human of course...



mike_intellivision on 31 December 2008
Squilliam said:

On the Wii you have the massive advertisement budgets which can meet and exceed the HD budgets easily. For example Wii-Fits advertisement is well on its way to passing the $100,000,000 mark at this point and other Nintendo releases can also see massive advertisement. With the overall costs this high the development costs start to be overshadowed by the advertisement. Look at Movies for a prime example of this where they can easily spend more again to market than to actually develop the movie.

 

 

 

In the US, it seems as if there is at least as much if not more advertisements for PS3/X360/PC games.

For example, I have not seen buildings covered with Wii game logos like I saw Chicago and Left4Dead.

The point is that the advertising probably is a wash. Many Wii titles (and DS titles) spend their ad money on programs aimed at children, tweens, and teens. The PS3/X360/PC buy ad time on sports-related programming, which can be more pricey.

So ad costs may wash out.

 

Now to the OP -- there  are blockbusters on the PS3 and Xbox 360 because they have been multiplatform games aimed at a certain segment of the market. And in almost every case, these have been established IPs with their latest sequel.

There have been blockbusters on the Wii as well (Wii Fit, Mario Kart) aimed at non-traditional and semi-traditional gamers. Think about it, the highest selling new IP this generation costs JPY 8300/USD 90/EUR 90/UKP 70 and includes what is essentially a bathroom scale.

The other blockbusters are either bundled in some way (Wii Sports, Wii Play) or old IPs (MK Wii, Halo 3, GTA IV, MGS 4).

Mike from Morgantown

 

 



      


I am Mario.


I like to jump around, and would lead a fairly serene and aimless existence if it weren't for my friends always getting into trouble. I love to help out, even when it puts me at risk. I seem to make friends with people who just can't stay out of trouble.

Wii Friend Code: 1624 6601 1126 1492

NNID: Mike_INTV
Dgc1808 on 31 December 2008

I'm not upset about it. My main system's a Playstation 3


As for the people that are:

Life's unfair.... Try saving up for another system. Then You can have the best of both worlds



4 ≈ One

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mike_intellivision on 31 December 2008
RPG said:
People are under the thinking that 3rd party games are on HD consoles because it was too late to stop development and start making the games on Wii. I mean that is about as disillusion as one can get, your not going to get flagship 'hardcore' games like RE on the Wii.

Unless of course there is something I do not know, we going to see RE6 sell 8 million on the Wii? Games like No More Heroes has not done great, shovelware and Nintendo first party games do fantastically though.

 

Considering that FF 13 has been promoted since before the current generation of consoles was fully released, this is not entirely preposterious. However, I will admit that as time goes on, it is harder to see the interia being overcome by the reality of market position (in other words, companies are slow to change their focus).

Also, remember that RE 4 for the Wii sold on par with the GC version -- 1.69M -- which could be played on the Wii. And if RE could sell 8M on the Wii, they should make it since only two titles have ever exceeded 4M.

Finally, NMH sold the most for any Suda 51 game. So people who speak ill of its sales don't realize that Suda's titles have generally been met with limited sales. But NMH is getting a Wii sequel, which speaks volumes.

 

Mike from Morgantown



      


I am Mario.


I like to jump around, and would lead a fairly serene and aimless existence if it weren't for my friends always getting into trouble. I love to help out, even when it puts me at risk. I seem to make friends with people who just can't stay out of trouble.

Wii Friend Code: 1624 6601 1126 1492

NNID: Mike_INTV
blink182 on 31 December 2008
Squilliam said:
Kasz216 said:
Squilliam said:
Because once to factor in all the costs, the bigger the game the less the Wii "advantages" on overall cost are important.


1. Massive advertisement; You have to advertise as much if not more than HD games to target the wider demographic of users on the Wii.

2. The cost/benifit ratio still applies; Why spend $10,000,000 making a Wii game look good when for an extra $10,000,000 the game will look 5* better?

3. Overall cost ratios come down and favour HD development more as your overall budget increases. Wii $10,000,000 game + $10,000,000 advertisement vs HD $20,000,000 game + $10,000,000 advertisement and the ratio is 2:3.

4. Easier to target demographics and advertising + word of mouth very easy to do with the HD community. The demographics they target for these games are deep, wide and easy to get to within the HD owner userbase. Also never underestimate the power of word of mouth selling games, especially within Xbox Live.

I actually disagree with all your points here.  I'd argue word of mouth is better on the Wii... i mean that's why wii games have better legs.

And games cost more to make look better on the PS360... in general.

Your making all the wrong arguements.

Market Diversification and the fact that the PS360 games when they flop, flop hard is the reason.

 

Not really, I was talking advertisement. When your userbase is more similar you can target your advertisements better to make them more effective. If you could target one TV station and know that 40% of your potential demographic is watching it then you don't have to spend as much to target them.

Word of mouth is at least as strong on the Xbox 360 when you consider the whole online community has mics and and the purchasing patterns are different, just because a game sells most of its sales quickly doesn't mean that it wasn't helped by major word of mouth. The Wii looks like it has better long term sales because A.) Their console owners take their sweet time to make purchases. B.) The sales of the console are higher so there are a lot of people buying multiples of games when they purchase their system and the games are cheaper so they are likely to pick up a couple of cheaper $20 games.

Btw, name one BIG HD game that has flopped. (40-60 Million budget)

 

 

 Too human!



nintendo and sega fan since i was old enough to hold a game controller.

note: my games collection on my profile is only 20ish% complete, i've got a boatload of 360,saturn and dreamcast games to add and a few ps3 games, thanks :)

 

Millennium on 31 December 2008
Kasz216 said:

If you took all the blockbuster games off the HD systems, you'd just be left with average games... unlikely to make back their money, and even worse, highly prone to totally flopping and costing millions.

This right here is the fatal flaw in your argument: the misconception that HD systems are making games better. That simply isn't true, nor can it be, because the HD consoles offer nothing over the previous generation but pretty pictures.



Complexity is not depth. Machismo is not maturity. Obsession is not dedication. Tedium is not challenge. Support gaming: support the Wii.

Be the ultimate ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today! Poisson Village welcomes new players.

What do I hate about modern gaming? I hate tedium replacing challenge, complexity replacing depth, and domination replacing entertainment. I hate the outsourcing of mechanics to physics textbooks, art direction to photocopiers, and story to cheap Hollywood screenwriters. I hate the confusion of obsession with dedication, style with substance, new with gimmicky, old with obsolete, new with evolutionary, and old with time-tested.
There is much to hate about modern gaming. That is why I support the Wii.

Kasz216 on 31 December 2008
Millennium said:
Kasz216 said:

If you took all the blockbuster games off the HD systems, you'd just be left with average games... unlikely to make back their money, and even worse, highly prone to totally flopping and costing millions.

This right here is the fatal flaw in your argument: the misconception that HD systems are making games better. That simply isn't true, nor can it be, because the HD consoles offer nothing over the previous generation but pretty pictures.

When did i say that?

I said if you didn't put blockbusters on the HD systems... you'd be putting only regular games on.


"regular" games that cost as much as it would to make a Wii blockbuster.

Games that could fail and cost you 8+ million a piece.

If an average Wii game flops... it costs you like... 4+ million a piece.

The regular games are more likely to flop, so why not put them on a system where the blow is going to be less... and put a lot of average games on the wii, and your few big ones on the HD consoles?

 



leo-j on 31 December 2008
One_touch_KO said:
Yeah but the blockbusters for this entire gen will be only on the Wii:

Wii Sports
Wii Sports Resort

Fanboys Cry. Skies Shatter. But it's the way life is.

 

 lol sucks that thats all you will be stuck with in your gaming life, while I play my amazing games, you can play your blockbuster wii sports.



 

mM