I agree Kuuthra..wouldn't it make more sense if TP came after Adult link timeline?

since WW takes place when the hero didn't appear..right? doesn't that mean..that young Link would be in termina..wich means..young link ending= WW

and adult link=TP..

and then TP still makes no sense

besides all these things..the zelda timeline made right now is ASSUMPTION since there can be tons of games that could come in between...

OoT comes before AlttP for sure..no doubt

problem is..we don't know exactly WHEN...so...it comes before..now TP comes in between..wich is fine..another one can come between TP and AlttP

it's all a mystery..and the grand storyline(timeline) interests me..

I want another Hero of Time game.. (not generic Hero..and not Wind Hero either)


on another note..'Link' is never the hero's name..the Hero is NEVER called Link in the series..except for a name to give him..since the destined Hero of Time is always someone else..wich makes sense why the Hero's supposedly have no names

and also why you can change your name before you start a file
you can't say that all of them are called Link XDD lol..would be odd and too obvious for Ganondorf to kill his lineage

Well, I could offer my explanation for those things... Just remember that Aonuma is talking pretty generally here. It should be obvious by actually playing the games what exactly happened.

But several parts of that don't make sense. He didn't just "do something outrageous", he went to war with Hyrule.

Yeah, Aonuma doesn't specify the crime he is commited for, but as TP tells us, that's pretty much what he did. There is no contradiction here, however, as far as I can tell.

They didn't merely leave him alone

Didn't they? Aonuma says the execution scene takes place years after the ending of OoT, and until that time, that's pretty much exactly what they did.

and more than that, he didn't use the Gerudo as troops.

In TP, it is implied that he did (he was the leader of the gang of thieves that attempted to invade the Sacred Realm). In OoT, many of the Gerudo are his "followers." In short, I don't see the problem.

All the Sages are of an indeterminate race.

Yes, they are clearly different from the OoT Sages.

He didn't want to "obtain the power" - he already had it in the first place.

He wants the entire Triforce, you know.

If the scene of Ganondorf's execution takes place "several" years after Ocarina of Time, then the Skeleton Knight would have to be Ocarina of Time Link.

Well, we can't say for sure the Hero's Spirit actually fought Ganondorf, but sure, it's implied.

It doesn't solve the problem of Ganondorf dying with no clear way to be resurrected, either, unless he doesn't actually die in the ending of Twilight Princess.

He was reincarnated in FSA, you know. In that sense, his death sets up his return in the IW perfectly.

I can accept that it is supposed to take place in that timeline, but it is still a retelling of that story - it's not the same tale, not exactly. Too many facts change between the two of them.

Yes, I agree with that.

me and bacon thought he was another link in the past!

cause he said he was a hero when he taught you the last move! and he said something about a blood line!

There's not actually a lot here that we disagree on.

If we take "leave him alone" to mean that they didn't actively try to stop him from obtaining the Triforce, I guess that makes a certain amount of sense. Who held onto the Spiritual Stones, though, I w-nevermind, that's ridiculous. We agree that this is a different retelling, the method of accessing the Sacred Realm could be entirely different.

You may be right concerning him leading a gang of thieves, but I remember that being the backstory of the Twili, not Ganondorf's troops - the Twili being cast into the Twilight Realm because they sought out the power of the gods. But again, if we agree that it's a different retelling, then the Gerudo as a race aren't necessarily distinct from the Hylians. My only problem with this is that it contradicts the stated intent of Ganondorf in the Wind Waker, which was that he wanted to conquer Hyrule for the sake of bettering the lives of his people. The idea that he basically sacrificed his own people in order to obtain power contradicts that characterization of him.

I seriously need to replay the game just to brush up on that particular sequence.

As to him wanting the entire Triforce - ehhhh, not really. It's a means to an end, not an end in and of itself. The only game in which he was preoccupied with obtaining the whole thing after already winning was Ocarina of Time. He wanted it in Wind Waker, yes, but only to bring back Hyrule. I don't think he ever mentioned wanting to take the "power of the gods" that had been bestowed upon Link and Zelda in Twilight Princess.

Wait, Ganondorf can be reincarnated? What, just as a Hylian, or a human, or are there still Gerudo, or what? I never played FSA.

I agree Kuuthra..wouldn't it make more sense if TP came after Adult link timeline?

since WW takes place when the hero didn't appear..right? doesn't that mean..that young Link would be in termina..wich means..young link ending= WW

and adult link=TP..

No, TWW takes place after adult OoT where Ganondorf was sealed in the SR and Link went back in time, hence why he dissapeared in TWW.

TP explains what happened in the timeline where Ganondorf was not sealed.

on another note..'Link' is never the hero's name..the Hero is NEVER called Link in the series..except for a name to give him..since the destined Hero of Time is always someone else..wich makes sense why the Hero's supposedly have no names

and also why you can change your name before you start a file
you can't say that all of them are called Link XDD lol..

Actually, I can. Link is his offical name. It's the default in most games, and some games DO force the name on you (FS/FSA). I always name him Link anyway, so, yeah. Besides, what would you have us call him? Pinglesworth?

no...you don't get it..they HAVE to name him SOMETHING

lol but technically he's just A Hero..or THE Hero..

his name is always left out within the actual game..it's never important as it can be anyone's character..lol

we could call him Link for reference but it's not like this was OoT Link..and all of them will be called Link in the bloodline 0.0

If we take "leave him alone" to mean that they didn't actively try to stop him from obtaining the Triforce, I guess that makes a certain amount of sense. Who held onto the Spiritual Stones, though, I w-nevermind, that's ridiculous. We agree that this is a different retelling, the method of accessing the Sacred Realm could be entirely different.

Well, some (such as myself) believe Link returned to a time after Ganondorf had already touched the Triforce, while others say he doesn't really have the Triforce of Power in TP - just the power granted to him by the goddesses (FYI, Ganondorf had some deleted dialouge about how the goddesses chose the wielders of power, and how fate will bring them together again even if he dies).

You may be right concerning him leading a gang of thieves, but I remember that being the backstory of the Twili, not Ganondorf's troops - the Twili being cast into the Twilight Realm because they sought out the power of the gods. But again, if we agree that it's a different retelling, then the Gerudo as a race aren't necessarily distinct from the Hylians. My only problem with this is that it contradicts the stated intent of Ganondorf in the Wind Waker, which was that he wanted to conquer Hyrule for the sake of bettering the lives of his people. The idea that he basically sacrificed his own people in order to obtain power contradicts that characterization of him.

I seriously need to replay the game just to brush up on that particular sequence.

Yes, I was confused about that, too. However, the Sages say: "His name is... Ganondorf. He was the leader of a band of thieves who invaded Hyrule in the hopes of establishing dominion over the Sacred Realm. He was known as a demon thief, an evil-magic wielder renowned for his ruthlessness..."

The "band of thieves" are obviously the Gerudo. The Twili are an entirely different people that preceeded Ganondorf and his ilk. What happened to the Gerudo in TP remains a mystery (though the Hylians apparently built a prison on top of their fortress...)

PS. Ganondorf was such an awesome villain in TWW... Too bad his TP incarnation is nothing like that.

As to him wanting the entire Triforce - ehhhh, not really. It's a means to an end, not an end in and of itself. The only game in which he was preoccupied with obtaining the whole thing after already winning was Ocarina of Time. He wanted it in Wind Waker, yes, but only to bring back Hyrule. I don't think he ever mentioned wanting to take the "power of the gods" that had been bestowed upon Link and Zelda in Twilight Princess.

True, but if TP follows OoT's events, then he should want the entire Triforce in that game too. His expressed intent in either game is to rule the world by any means possible, after all.

It is true that he never attempts to steal the Triforces from and Zelda, which is why some people beleive they are not actually Triforce pieces.

Wait, Ganondorf can be reincarnated? What, just as a Hylian, or a human, or are there still Gerudo, or what? I never played FSA.

Yes, he returned as a human Gerudo child in FSA. He apparently was raised as a normal person, but his evil grew with his age, and he eventually betrayed his people and sought out an ancient demonic artefact (the Trident of Power) that turned him into the Demon King.

i thought it wasn't a single link but the embodiment of all the links that have passed and will

that is why he had knowledge of all thinks linkish as well as teh ability to urn into a wolf...

see problem solved

The skeletal knight is Link's father, the one who died in the Hylian War

The golden wolf is the missing piece of the Triforce (Courage), incarnate into a wolf so Link may understand his form, and recognize it as a part of him. Recognize being part wolf, and having the Triforce of Courage.

Pardon me for borrowing your replying style - I'm used to BBcode and have been struggling with how to quote someone with a modicum of proper appearance.

Well, some (such as myself) believe Link returned to a time after Ganondorf had already touched the Triforce, while others say he doesn't really have the Triforce of Power in TP - just the power granted to him by the goddesses (FYI, Ganondorf had some deleted dialouge about how the goddesses chose the wielders of power, and how fate will bring them together again even if he dies).

This would make a certain amount of sense, except that it is implied in Ganondorf's execution scene that the power only awoke inside of him in that moment. If it had been there before, the idea that he could have been defeated at all, much less tethered, is somewhat less believable.

The matter of him having the Triforce of Power the entire time is more problematic - if Link and Zelda don't interfere, Ganondorf should have conquered the world no problem, just as he did in the Adult Link timeline in Ocarina.

As to it being "the power of the gods" vs. "the Triforce" - well, there's no effective difference between these two concepts, since the Triforce has been shown to have its own agency an is essentially the congealed power of the gods anyway. The appearance is the same, the symbol is the same, the effect is the same - only the name is different. And the Triforce by any other name still lets Ganondorf tear off your face.

Yes, I was confused about that, too. However, the Sages say: "His name is... Ganondorf. He was the leader of a band of thieves who invaded Hyrule in the hopes of establishing dominion over the Sacred Realm. He was known as a demon thief, an evil-magic wielder renowned for his ruthlessness..."

The "band of thieves" are obviously the Gerudo. The Twili are a entirely different people that preceeded Ganondorf and his ilk. What happened to the Gerudo in TP remains a mystery (though the Hylians built a prison on top of their fortress...)

I don't know - he's always cited as leading a band of thieves in nearly every Zelda game's backstory, most famously Link to the Past. That they are Gerudo isn't something we can readily assume, though it does seem logical. Remember: since this is a different retelling, the all-female race so genetically distinct from the Hylians may have never existed in the first place. It's almost easier to ague that they were probably just a race of desert nomads.

PS. Ganondorf was such an awesome villain in TWW... Too bad his TP incarnation is nothing like he was.

I agree with this, but my feelings towards Twilight Princess Ganondorf have softened considerably. Once I considered that Wind Waker Ganon was still completely insane, that his more sympathetic traits may have been completely delusional, it helped me appreciate TP Ganon more.

And the TP version is, at the very least, the best at just wrecking everyone.

True, but if TP follows OoT's events, then he should want the entire Triforce in that game too. His expressed intent in either game is to rule the world by any means possible, after all.

Granted, but he is capable of ruling the world with only one piece. He only wanted the other pieces in Ocarina so that they would pose no threat to him. In Twilight Princess he doesn't seem entirely aware that the other pieces allow Zelda and Link to fight him at all.

It is true that he never attempts to steal the Triforces from and Zelda, which is why some people beleive they are not actually Triforce pieces.

I dunno. I'd sooner assume that it's Ganondorf's hubris.

Yes, he returned as a human Gerudo child in FSA. He apparently was raised as a normal person, but his evil grew with his age, and he eventually betrayed his people and sought out an ancient demonic artefact (the Trident of Power) that turned him into the Demon King.

Well I will be dag-blamed. I had no idea.

As to Soriku:

I'm trying to get a hold of what you're saying here. I'm hearing that it basically comes down to the idea that in each of these stories, there is a Ganondorf story and then things that continue after Ganondorf is gone for good. That about right?