And fortunately Crysis doesn't look as bad as the FPS on the HD consoles.  I love how things that come around go around. 

Now fortunately you did provide something of use but with no proof.  Seriously that's why I don't make statements like that because I'm not going to find ever PS360 FPS and prove it looks better than The Conduit.

Otherwise its an opinion in a thread that asks for proof.  So what's the purpose of eve saying it.  I have no idea if The Conduit is graphically better than any PS360 game but I'll keep an open mind until the proof is presented because that's the best way to enter a discussion.  Of course I'm stubborn about some things as well but I try to keep it to a minimum.

Haha that's cute tryign to get out of it.  YOU made the empirical statement... not me.  Meaning the burde of proof is on YOU and not me.  So either you retract it as an opinion which requires no proof or you start researching now.  No one is going to take your word on it so start.

I guess i'll bite. The Conduit looks better than the following games:

Bomberman Act Zero
Operation: Darkness
Spectral Force 3

Do note all three of these games are riding the edge of being shovelware, but they are 360 games. I'm failing to see the ultimate purpose of the thread though. Are we supposed to marvel at The Conduit for looking better than fastily thrown together crap on a more powerful system? The answer was pretty obvious from the beginning that "yes" there are games The Conduit looks better than on 360 and PS3, but those games are usually to the HD consoles what Cruis'n is to the Wii. There is no HD game with any effort put in graphically that looks worse than The Conduit.

I think a much more impactful thread would have asked the audience what Xbox games look better than The Conduit, if any. At least we could have come up with a possible level of seperation between the two console's power.

Zucas, i generally admire you for being at almost all times a pretty reasonable poster, but here i must contest.  You have on one hand said that the burden of proof lies on the side of HD but then in another post said that the appearance of games is entirely subjective.  I agree with the second part of the statement in that i believe there are already Wii games that look better than some HD games.

This is what i was getting at in my initial post.  Even if someone can 'prove' that there are HD games that look worse than The Conduit, then what?  Why not just judge the game on it's own merits rather than saying it looks better than the graphically worst game on the HD systems, which isn't much of a compliment.

Wise words. I agree.

While I have no idea who you are I admire you for being honest with me.  Burden of proof does lie with him.  If you know what an empirical statement is you know why the burden of proof is on him.

And yes I have said looks is clearly subjective. Meaning his job is going to be a lot harder now isn't it.  I never said his job was unreasonable now did I.  All I said if he's going to make the empricial statment then he has to be able to back it up.  And if it's impossible to back up then what does he have to admit? I think you get my point. 

Trust me I'm always completely reasonable its just in this case my reason can only be shown if he admits his faults which usually doesn't happen so in turn just makes me look like an ass I suppose. A correct one though. 

I totally agree that games should be judged on their own merit.  I'm one of the few people on this god forsakken forums that think graphics shoudl be judged on polish, design, and atmosphere instead of simply how realistic it looks. But this is not what this topic is about so it's kinda pointless to make that statement anyways.  Or is it?  I think whether the author intended for it or not that this thread leads to nothing and has no end. Meaning the only point of the thread is to come up with that thought which would be the most open minded thing ever now wouldn't it.  Such shallowness comes out of a thread like this when the only possibly answer is one of of open mindedness to perception is reality and beauty is in the eye of the beholder.  Spanx whether ya did that on purpose or not I give ya kudos for it.

Now why would I waste my time going through hundreds of games trying to find one that looks worse than The Conduit, when I say there are none. That would be a huge waste of time for me, because I would find none.

But just to satisfy you I will make an addition to my statement.

No PS3 or 360 game made with atleast a sliver of effort played in 480p looks worse than The Conduit. End of Thread.

Also, usually when you think someone is wrong, you are suppose to be able to prove them wrong. Not go about this "You are wrong and I want you to try to prove that you're wrong" business. Because if I think I am, and know I am right, why would I waste time on an effort that I know isn't going to accomplish anything?

Would you like me to post a video of every game out on the PS3 and 360?

Well my silly friend first of all according to your first statement you wouldn't go out trying to find a game that looks worse than Conduit but show that ever PS3 and/or 360 game looks better than it. It's alright to have opinions but when you make it an empirical statement there has to be proof as no one is simply going to take your word on it. And unfortunately you made your statement very very braod. And it might be a huge waste of your time but we'll never know until you do it.

Alright you've changed it that's great. Now you need to do 2 things. Define "sliver of effort" and then prove that every last one of those games does indeed look better for your statement to be true. I'm assuming you've at least rid yourself of a decent amount of games to shorten your duress.

Haha well here's the thing I never said you were wrong. Look at the quote chain. Never even questioned right or wrong. All I said was prove it. You would be right if I had said you were wrong because then I would be making the empirical statement but I never said that now did I. You made the empirical statement meaning burden of proof is on you and no one else. And if you don't prove then it is nothing but an opinion that I'm sure many will respect but we'll hate your more for it because you said it as a statement.

Do I want you to post every video of every PS3 or 360 game to prove your point? Well depends have I said otherwise. But I think the question is on you. Just how willing are you to back up your statement. You had no problem telling people what the "truth" is but you sure do have a lot of issues proving it. I guess confidence doesn't mean passion.

And yes if you said the universe was endless and I disagreed with you then I would have to prove it had an end. But if you said the universe was endless then you'd have to prove it.  Kinda relates to a current situation don't it.

Well I'll tell you straight up, I know I am right, I do not want to waste my time proving it by showing every single video game trailer out there.

Now, if you think I am wrong, then you go ahead and waste your time trying to prove it.

Also, I apologize for f***ing up my post up there.