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Forums - Sales Discussion - US Market...thats that then...

cookingyourmama said:
Esmoreit said:
Cookingyourmama... the real question is, how much of those titles will end up on the PS4. Am I wrong to expect a Metal Gear Solid Spin-off on it? GT6? Uncharted will undoubtedly be on sequel number 3 by then. Ratchet and Clank had enough succes to warrant a sequal...

Uncharted, Resistance and the rest you mentioned... are indeed new IP's and you are right that Sony has more new IP's this generation then Nintendo (could also be wrong but I'm to half-asses this sunday to look it up.)
Main point is... Motorstorm, Uncharted, Resistance. All have already confirmed to be followed up upon. Uncharted is already coined up for a whole series. We get Motorstorm: Pacific Drift in late 2008 - two years after the first one is released. 2 Years. Between mario Kart Wii and double dash was 4.5 years.
Between Twilight princess and Wind waker? 3.5 years.

I hope you see wht I'm trying to say. Sony is just as capable of chruning out sequels to both existing franchises and new IP's - sometimes even faster then Nintendo - given the time to do it.

I'll even be so bold to say that Nintendo most likely has less new IP's both due to fans demand of classics relived, but also because Nintendo tends to take more development time then sony.

Some of those games will end up on the ps4 but most likely not all of them, unlike nintendo that will carry over 99% of the games they always do and rehash them for their 8th, 9th, 10th versions of the game. It's ok to make some sequels but their comes a point when you have to say enough is enough because the game is just the same game over and over again and a new game needs to be created instead. Sony create a large amount of new ip's whilst only keeping a few of their established games where as nintendo create next to no new ip's and continue to rehash 99% of their old games over and over again whilst throwing their characters into spin off games for marketing reasons.


I certainly don't mean to cherry pick but talking about spin-offs... wasn't there a crash-bandicoot racer??

Anyway, looking at iterations and generation points can be made for both sites. Looking at the NES library a lot of games did not cross over, a lot less then the 99% you mention. Everyone still cries out for a Kid Icarus sequel. We haven't seen Ice climbers since the NES I believe. I could pull out the video game vault from from Screwattack and probably find 50 more titles following these two.

I would hardly be surprised if 10 years from now, when we are in the eigth generation and we can better compare the PSone and NES versions crossover to the generations down the line, the ratios would hardly differ all that much.



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trestres said:
@Cooking~: Maturity has nothing to do with this. You fail, and thats about it.
Also when your saying that Sony has got more famous franchises, what do you base your belief on? Name a franchise thats as popular as Zelda or Mario.

You show everyone how blind you are by saying only little kids buy Nintendo games. Every Nintendo fan knows that every sequel that gets released is completely another game, only misinformed, angry, insecure and blind fanboys will say the opposite. Even if the game is on its 6th or 7th sequel, they are HIGH quality games.
Do people care if the Star Wars movie coming is the 7th in the series? Fucking NO, they know that they are quality movies and thats all it counts. And Nintendo innovates with new IPs every generation, in fact this Gen is on pace of getting more new IP's (DS + Wii) than the previous with GC + GBA.

No i don't 'fail' because you say so, although your maturity does fail. Sony has more famous franchises in number and gran turismo is as popular as zelda and mario. I never said little kids are the only people who buy nintendo games, you need to learn how to read, what i said was nintendo games appeal to little kids, big difference, and these kids have never played a zelda or mario before so they are not jaded, just like the nintendo fanboys aren't jaded but some gamers who don't arent blind fanboys and some gamers who arent little kids are fed up of the same old games being rehashed by nintendo and want some new games.



cookingyourmama said:
trestres said:
@Cooking~: Maturity has nothing to do with this. You fail, and thats about it.
Also when your saying that Sony has got more famous franchises, what do you base your belief on? Name a franchise thats as popular as Zelda or Mario.

You show everyone how blind you are by saying only little kids buy Nintendo games. Every Nintendo fan knows that every sequel that gets released is completely another game, only misinformed, angry, insecure and blind fanboys will say the opposite. Even if the game is on its 6th or 7th sequel, they are HIGH quality games.
Do people care if the Star Wars movie coming is the 7th in the series? Fucking NO, they know that they are quality movies and thats all it counts. And Nintendo innovates with new IPs every generation, in fact this Gen is on pace of getting more new IP's (DS + Wii) than the previous with GC + GBA.

No i don't 'fail' because you say so, although your maturity does fail. Sony has more famous franchises in number and gran turismo is as popular as zelda and mario. I never said little kids are the only people who buy nintendo games, you need to learn how to read, what i said was nintendo games appeal to little kids, big difference, and these kids have never played a zelda or mario before so they are not jaded, just like the nintendo fanboys aren't jaded but some gamers who don't arent blind fanboys and some gamers who arent little kids are fed up of the same old games being rehashed by nintendo and want some new games.

Does this mean you don't buy any Sony IP sequels?  

Sounds to me like you're arguing against your own argument.   Contradiction, irony, etc....

 



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Viper1 said:
cookingyourmama said:
trestres said:
@Cooking~: Maturity has nothing to do with this. You fail, and thats about it.
Also when your saying that Sony has got more famous franchises, what do you base your belief on? Name a franchise thats as popular as Zelda or Mario.

You show everyone how blind you are by saying only little kids buy Nintendo games. Every Nintendo fan knows that every sequel that gets released is completely another game, only misinformed, angry, insecure and blind fanboys will say the opposite. Even if the game is on its 6th or 7th sequel, they are HIGH quality games.
Do people care if the Star Wars movie coming is the 7th in the series? Fucking NO, they know that they are quality movies and thats all it counts. And Nintendo innovates with new IPs every generation, in fact this Gen is on pace of getting more new IP's (DS + Wii) than the previous with GC + GBA.

No i don't 'fail' because you say so, although your maturity does fail. Sony has more famous franchises in number and gran turismo is as popular as zelda and mario. I never said little kids are the only people who buy nintendo games, you need to learn how to read, what i said was nintendo games appeal to little kids, big difference, and these kids have never played a zelda or mario before so they are not jaded, just like the nintendo fanboys aren't jaded but some gamers who don't arent blind fanboys and some gamers who arent little kids are fed up of the same old games being rehashed by nintendo and want some new games.

Does this mean you don't buy any Sony IP sequels?

Sounds to me like you're arguing against your own argument. Contradiction, irony, etc....

 


Yeah...accept im not arguing against my own point. Playing the same rehashed game time after time and generation after generation makes you jaded, nintendo very rarely offer a new traditional ip to play instead of the same old rehashed games where as sony do offer me something else, i can take a break and play the other new ip's sony offer me and then after missing an iteration or two of a franchise come back to it several years later without having to cut back on the number of games i play, if i don't play the same old whored out franchises on my wii then their are no other nintendo alternatives. Here's just a little example of where i am with nintendo's and sony's franchises that i have played more than 1 version of.

sony:

God of war - Played both god of war 1 and 2, the first one was great but the second one was just more of the same and finishing it was quite boring. If god of war 3 is more of the same then i won't be buying it.

The getaway - Both versions were average games and the second one offered nothing significantly new and again unless the 3rd version of the game is significantly improved over what is already their and offers me new things to do then i won't be buying the 3rd one.

Gran turismo - The first one i owned was gran turismo 3 and that game is so huge i still hadn't finished by the time gt4 prolugue and gt4 the full game were released. Gt4 was just a rehash of 3 with more cars and better graphics and it failed to have online so i didn't buy it. I brought gt5 prolugue to see what was new and the answer is not alot. Unless gt5 the full game has a decent online side to it and realistic damage modelling then i won't be buying it.

Nintendo:

Zelda - I've completed a link to the past, the ocarina of time, the majoras mask and the windwaker. The jump from 2d to 3d was great and added so many new things to the game. The 3 day time mechanic of majoras mask made the game interesting and it didnt feel like i was just playing the same game again, but by the time i got to the windwaker it was just the same old game with a new art style and water. I started playing the twilight princess but after an hour i just couldn't be bothered because it was just yet another rehash.

Mario kart - I've played all the console versions of the game and the latest one was not only just more of the same in terms of gameplay but alot of the levels are taken straight from double dash, i've already sold it and unless mario kart has some major changes done to it i won't be playing another mario kart for a good 5 to 10 years.

Metroid prime - The first 2 games i loved but the third one was just the same game again but with motion controls, im not jaded yet with the game but unless the next game is something new then i won't be buying it.

Mario - mario galaxy was my 4th mario game and after super mario sunshine i was already jaded and galaxy didnt do anything to change that. I might come back to mario galaxy at the end of the generation.

Smash brothers - one was great, the second one was just a cash in and the third one i only brought because it had online which isn't anything spectacular. The gameplay and things that are worthwhile that you can do in the game have barely changed.

So whilst i've been jaded with the above games what new ip's have sony created that interested me and i brought:

Killzone
Shadow of the Colossus
Motorstorm
Heavenly Sword
Uncharted: Drakes Fortune

Nintendo games:

None



You mention Killzone and Shadow of the Colossus, those games are from last gen...
And its all about tastes, many more people bought the Nintendo games you name than people who bought the Sony games you named.

Why didnt you mention:
-Pikmin
-Wii Sports
-Wii Fit
-Eternal Darkness
-Trauma Center
-Wario Ware
-Animal Crossing
-Star Fox Adventures

There's clearly a lot of fanboyism in your claims. Also saying that MP1 = MP3 shows you havent played the game and you know nothing about the series.
SMS very very different from SMG.
Brawl is a huge improvement over Melee, in all aspects.
Every Zelda game is extremely different from the other, maybe the settings are similar, but the story line, the puzzles, the items, the characters, the music, the bosses are all different.

If you dont like the idea of sequels, please keep it to yourself, I know everyone else enjoys sequels or different new games from the same franchises, clearly on this one your opinion is inside the minority.



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lol @ Zelda's story lines



''Hadouken!''

Lol @ you not playing a single Zelda game, if you had, none is similar, other than the fact you gotta rescue Zelda (not in all of them).



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Pandora's Tower will sell less than 100k lifetime in Japan.
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trestres said:
You mention Killzone and Shadow of the Colossus, those games are from last gen...
And its all about tastes, many more people bought the Nintendo games you name than people who bought the Sony games you named.

Why didnt you mention:
-Pikmin
-Wii Sports
-Wii Fit
-Eternal Darkness
-Trauma Center
-Wario Ware
-Animal Crossing
-Star Fox Adventures

There's clearly a lot of fanboyism in your claims. Also saying that MP1 = MP3 shows you havent played the game and you know nothing about the series.
SMS very very different from SMG.
Brawl is a huge improvement over Melee, in all aspects.
Every Zelda game is extremely different from the other, maybe the settings are similar, but the story line, the puzzles, the items, the characters, the music, the bosses are all different.

If you dont like the idea of sequels, please keep it to yourself, I know everyone else enjoys sequels or different new games from the same franchises, clearly on this one your opinion is inside the minority.

Before my last post i have stated the facts that nintendo are worse when it comes to rehashing the same old franchises over and over again when compared to sony, sony have stopped making sequels to over half the games they have released 5 or more sequels to where as nintendo continue to whore out all the games they have made 5 or more sequels to and i have posted the facts that show sony release more original ip's then nintendo do. After that i posted my personal opinions on some games and you've completely missed the point. For starters you accuse me of being a fanboy when i am not and at the same time you are a massive raving nintendo fanboy which is clear to see from most of your posts.

Next up i talk about killzone and shadow of the colossus because they are original ip's that i have played, i never said i was only talking about this gen. From the list of 8 games you made starfox is not an original ip, nor is warioware and trauma center is not made by nintendo it's made by atlus, this isn't a discussion about exclusives, it's a discussion about games made by nintendo and sony. So that leaves 5 original nintendo ip's made in the past 2 generations of console gaming. So in that space of time how many new ip's has sony released:

God of War
Shadow of the Colossus
Killzone
Rogue Galaxy
Ratchet and Clank
ICO
Jak and Daxter
Dark Cloud
SOCOM
The Getaway
Sly Cooper
Eye Toy: Play
ATV Off Road Fury
SingStar
Buzz
Primal
Siren
Amplitude
The Mark Of Kri
Rise Of The Kasai
Uncharted: Drakes Fortune
Heavenly Sword
Resistance: Fall of Man
Motorstorm
Lair
Folklore
Eye of Judgement
Genji

Sony have made 28 original ip's in the time nintendo have only made 5.

As for your other remarks that i haven't played any of the nintendo games, well you have no proof and are talking absolute rubbish at the same time. Only a die hard nintendo fanboy would try and argue that zelda isn't the same old thing rehashed. You start off as an elf like creature with a green tunic on. You then go round collecting money and 95% of the same old items and abilities. Then princess zelda gets captured and you have to go and save her. You collect the same old hearts and magic bar upgrades, along the way you go to different themed areas and then enter the dungeon of that area, you solve puzzles and fight mostly the same old enemies as you do in all zelda games until you get to the dungeons boss fight which revolve round finding it's weak spot and usually hitting that weak spot 3 times. Eventually you'll get to fight the final boss gannon.....yeah their's only so many times you can play the same rehashed game before it gets boring. And it's the same story for mario, smash brothers and metroid.

Some sequels are fine but when you start doing the same games over and over again and they are just rehashes then that's a problem, and nintendo are very guilty of this.



Well, Nintendo does have a lot more "Original IP's" than just believe, majority of which have not seen a single sequel as of today.

IP's Nintendo does have, I'll gladly name them:

Excitebike
Clu Clu Land
Wild Gunman
Duck Hunt
Hogan's Alley
Balloon Fight
Ice Climbers
Wrecking Crew
Stack-Up
Gyromite
Super Mario Bros
Mach Rider
10-Yard Fight
Balloon Fight
Urban Champion
Popeye
Donkey Kong
Gumshoe
Kid Icarus
Metroid
Mike Tyson's Punch-Out!!
Pro Wrestling
The Legend of Zelda
Famicom Wars
Tetris
Dragon Warrior
Faxanadu
Mother
Dr. Mario
StarTropics
Snake Rattle 'n' Roll
Fire Emblem
Kirby's Adventure
Wario's Woods
Famicom Grand Prix - F1 Race
F-Zero
Pilotwings
Mario Kart
Sim City
Star Fox
Super Tennis
Super Scope
Battle Clash
Vegas Stakes
Metal Combat
Stunt Race FX
Tin Star
Uniracers
Illusion of Gaia
Donkey Kong Country
Killer Instinct
Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars
Wave Race
Blast Corps
Tetrisphere
Mischief Makers
GoldenEye 007
Banjo-Kazooie
1080° Snowboarding
Yoshi's Story
Pokemon Stadium
Mario Party
Super Smash Bros.
Custom Robo
Perfect Dark
Sin and Punishment
Animal Crossing
Doshin the Giant
Luigi's Mansion
Pikmin
Eternal Darkness
Metroid Prime
Star Fox Adventures
Cubivore
GiFTPiA
Nintendo Puzzle Collection
Donkey Konga
WarioWare
Paper Mario
Battalion Wars
Geist
Chibi-Robo!
Odama
Wii Sports
Excite Truck
Wii Play
Eyeshield 21
Big Brain Academy
Link's Crossbow Training
Endless Ocean
Wii Fit


And I havent listed upcoming games, Wii Ware games or Handheld games.
This is a list of original IP's for home consoles, which I know is vastly incomplete.

Bolded are the last 2 gen games. 20 new franchises of games, be it with old characters or not, but still new franchises.

Next time check the amount of franchises Nintendo has, because it doesnt need to create as many as you say, it has more than enough and the infinite possibilities that open up when planning on doing a new game.



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tag - "I wouldn't trust gamespot, even if it was a live comparison."

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Pandora's Tower will sell less than 100k lifetime in Japan.
Stakes: 1 week of avatar control for each one.

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trestres said:

Well, Nintendo does have a lot more "Original IP's" than just believe, majority of which have not seen a single sequel as of today.

IP's Nintendo does have, I'll gladly name them:

Excitebike
Clu Clu Land
Wild Gunman
Duck Hunt
Hogan's Alley
Balloon Fight
Ice Climbers
Wrecking Crew
Stack-Up
Gyromite
Super Mario Bros
Mach Rider
10-Yard Fight
Balloon Fight
Urban Champion
Popeye
Donkey Kong
Gumshoe
Kid Icarus
Metroid
Mike Tyson's Punch-Out!!
Pro Wrestling
The Legend of Zelda
Famicom Wars
Tetris
Dragon Warrior
Faxanadu
Mother
Dr. Mario
StarTropics
Snake Rattle 'n' Roll
Fire Emblem
Kirby's Adventure
Wario's Woods
Famicom Grand Prix - F1 Race
F-Zero
Pilotwings
Mario Kart
Sim City
Star Fox
Super Tennis
Super Scope
Battle Clash
Vegas Stakes
Metal Combat
Stunt Race FX
Tin Star
Uniracers
Illusion of Gaia
Donkey Kong Country
Killer Instinct
Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars
Wave Race
Blast Corps
Tetrisphere
Mischief Makers
GoldenEye 007
Banjo-Kazooie
1080° Snowboarding
Yoshi's Story
Pokemon Stadium
Mario Party
Super Smash Bros.
Custom Robo
Perfect Dark
Sin and Punishment
Animal Crossing
Doshin the Giant
Luigi's Mansion
Pikmin
Eternal Darkness
Metroid Prime
Star Fox Adventures
Cubivore
GiFTPiA
Nintendo Puzzle Collection
Donkey Konga
WarioWare
Paper Mario
Battalion Wars
Geist
Chibi-Robo!
Odama
Wii Sports
Excite Truck
Wii Play
Eyeshield 21
Big Brain Academy
Link's Crossbow Training
Endless Ocean
Wii Fit


And I havent listed upcoming games, Wii Ware games or Handheld games.
This is a list of original IP's for home consoles, which I know is vastly incomplete.

Bolded are the last 2 gen games. 20 new franchises of games, be it with old characters or not, but still new franchises.

Next time check the amount of franchises Nintendo has, because it doesnt need to create as many as you say, it has more than enough and the infinite possibilities that open up when planning on doing a new game.


Sorry to laugh but a large amount of games on that list weren't made by nintendo they were made by other developers and other games on that list weren't even released on a nintendo home console at all. Try again with a correct list next time.