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Forums - Sales Discussion - FF7 Rebirth has reportedly sold half what Remake did in the same timeframe

Soundwave said:
Chrkeller said:

Personally I think we should wait till:

A) Switch 2 specs are confirmed
B) Switch 2 price is announced
C) See how well the Switch 2 does

Feels like people are getting ahead of themselves.

But back to the Final Fantasy Discussion... ps5 has what 55 million potential FF consumers? By going to xbox, Nintendo and PC, Square will increase their potential base by what? I'm guessing but 500%? Maybe more?

By that logic FF7 Remake should have sold millions on PC, it only sold about 1 million copies on PC. 

Their problem is their fan base is aging, they need to invest in platforms like the Switch 2 and start rebuilding their fanbase up from the grassroots by getting younger people not an average user base that looks like this guy today:

This is going to take them a while too, it's not going to happen overnight where they magically increase sales by 300%. It's an age and demographic problem they have brought onto themselves by sticking only to Sony home consoles, home consoles (non-Nintendo ones anyway) in general are an aging demographic. 

Again your analysis is too basic, childish and frankly immature.  FF Remake launched long after the ps5 version and hyped died down.  It also was priced at $70, which is $10 more than most steam games.  And it was a bad port, stuttering in particular.  

Quality of port does matter.  Look at Horizon or GoW versus TLoU2.  

If your ability to properly discuss situations doesn't improve quickly, I'll have to cease our interactions.  It is getting old so very quickly and you lack any actual value in specifics.  



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Soundwave said:

Anyways maybe if people like you actually put their money where their mouth is and actually bought high budget games like FF7 Rebirth and FF16 Square-Enix wouldn't be running back to Nintendo on their knees and could instead prep for a dream $300 million dollar Final Fantasy 17 that's never gonna happen now. Too bad, so sad.

So many of these so called "visual showcases" that are not putting up big sales, almost as if the general market just isn't impressed by the same ol' sales pitch of pretty graphics. 

Something clearly isn't lining up. 

The “official” discourse is that Square is an exclusive company, its latest games do not sell well and the solution is to stop releasing exclusives.

I don't agree that that is true. In numbers: In recent years Square has published about 7 exclusive games on play5, another 7 exclusive on switch and almost 80 multiplatform.


Square is not a company interested in making exclusive games. And they don't do them unless the money that Sony pays them in advance compensates them or the promotion that Nintendo gives them compensates them. Sony no longer pays them as much as they used to.


But they have also realized that most people complete 3 or 4 games a year. Their new strategy is that they are going to stop releasing so many games to focus on making fewer but much better made games.


If the change of direction really goes well for them and they really become a company that makes the quantity of games we need and with the quality we need, then they no longer need Nintendo to promote anything to them. Because their games are going to sell themselves.



Soundwave said:
zeldaring said:

Lol you named a few butchered ports, let Me see switch run red dead 2, resident evil 4, last of us 2, CoD most of the big third party didn't come cause switch would end up melting, those games look worse then 360 games on Switch come on now.

The gap is not that large considering the Switch has to run on battery. And sure several of those games probably could be ported, it's mainly the image quality that suffers with no DLSS quality image upscaling solution. 

If Nintendo actually made a Switch Pro that was double the launch model Switch it would run most PS4 games with no fuss, that's completely a different ball park than systems like the Wii and DS that weren't even close to the other consoles of the time. 

 To me switch was much closer to 360/ps3 then ps4. so we'll agree to diagree.



Chrkeller said:
Soundwave said:

By that logic FF7 Remake should have sold millions on PC, it only sold about 1 million copies on PC. 

Their problem is their fan base is aging, they need to invest in platforms like the Switch 2 and start rebuilding their fanbase up from the grassroots by getting younger people not an average user base that looks like this guy today:

This is going to take them a while too, it's not going to happen overnight where they magically increase sales by 300%. It's an age and demographic problem they have brought onto themselves by sticking only to Sony home consoles, home consoles (non-Nintendo ones anyway) in general are an aging demographic. 

Again your analysis is too basic, childish and frankly immature.  FF Remake launched long after the ps5 version and hyped died down.  It also was priced at $70, which is $10 more than most steam games.  And it was a bad port, stuttering in particular.  

Quality of port does matter.  Look at Horizon or GoW versus TLoU2.  

If your ability to properly discuss situations doesn't improve quickly, I'll have to cease our interactions.  It is getting old so very quickly and you lack any actual value in specifics.  

PC market has it downsides too notably a lot of people don't like paying full price for anything outside of a few IP. A lot of PC sales have to come in the discounted range, Square-Enix doesn't like that and didn't like giving Steam a 30% cut of their software on top of that. 

$70 is going to be the norm for many games going forward, so PC gamers are just going to have to get used to that. $80 is probably coming at some point too. 

Last edited by Soundwave - on 17 May 2024

zeldaring said:
Soundwave said:

The gap is not that large considering the Switch has to run on battery. And sure several of those games probably could be ported, it's mainly the image quality that suffers with no DLSS quality image upscaling solution. 

If Nintendo actually made a Switch Pro that was double the launch model Switch it would run most PS4 games with no fuss, that's completely a different ball park than systems like the Wii and DS that weren't even close to the other consoles of the time. 

 To me switch was much closer to 360/ps3 then ps4. so we'll agree to diagree.

The 3DS is officially eighth generation. The switch is officially the successor to the 3DS. And it's also 100 times more powerful than the 3DS. And when the cycle of the switch and the play5/xbs is over, all the analysts will say that the switch cornered the play5/xbs in the market, but not the play4/xbo. Because the switch is the competition of play5/xbs.



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Tico said:
zeldaring said:

 To me switch was much closer to 360/ps3 then ps4. so we'll agree to diagree.

The 3DS is officially eighth generation. The switch is officially the successor to the 3DS. And it's also 100 times more powerful than the 3DS. And when the cycle of the switch and the play5/xbs is over, all the analysts will say that the switch cornered the play5/xbs in the market, but not the play4/xbo. Because the switch is the competition of play5/xbs.

Switch and especially Steam is huge reason why those 2 will sell lower combined this gen.



zeldaring said:
Tico said:

The 3DS is officially eighth generation. The switch is officially the successor to the 3DS. And it's also 100 times more powerful than the 3DS. And when the cycle of the switch and the play5/xbs is over, all the analysts will say that the switch cornered the play5/xbs in the market, but not the play4/xbo. Because the switch is the competition of play5/xbs.

Switch and especially Steam is huge reason why those 2 will sell lower combined this gen.

No doubt.  Especially with things like the Deck, Ally and Go.  Steam is going to start providing console direct competition.  Steam is growing like wildfire.  I did a brief search, so I haven't confirmed the numbers but at a glance active users a month increased 23,000,000 last year...  that is close to half the ps5 install base.

Edit

And realistically how is the Deck or Ally different than a console?  It is pretty plug and play, simple and streamlined.  PC gaming isn't just "high end" and "custom" builds.  Clearly it is moving into the console arena.  

And downplaying Steam and direct impact to financials is silly.  Quick math on Horizon Zero Dawn, 3.3 million sold, $150 million the bank....  people are worried about 300 million dollar budget, steam offsets that quickly.  

Last edited by Chrkeller - on 17 May 2024

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Soundwave, you need to chill.
I agree some a lot of your points, but you really don't need to be so rude and antagonistic.
This is supposed to be a fun hobby, not something to hassle people over.



Regarding Switch vs PS4 in terms of power, it's complicated.

In terms of raw horsepower, on paper, Switch sits closer to PS3/360 than PS4/XBO. However, horsepower alone doesn't tell the whole story, as the Switch has access to technology 10 years more modern than PS3/360, so it is massively more efficient.

It's like if you have a plane and a bus that have the same horsepower, but the bus can get stuck in traffic while the plane just flies straight to its destination.

This enables Switch to close the gap with PS4 enough that it can run the same games, just at lower settings. It also helps that the Switch has 3.2Gb of RAM available to games, which is closer to the 5GB or so of PS4/XBO than the less than 500MB PS3 and 360 have.

Of course, being a portable machine brings with it certain limitations as well; particularly memory bandwidth, which is the Switch's weakest link, so you have this halfway house of 7th gen horsepower and bandwidth with 8th gen GPU features and RAM capacity.



curl-6 said:

Regarding Switch vs PS4 in terms of power, it's complicated.

In terms of raw horsepower, on paper, Switch sits closer to PS3/360 than PS4/XBO. However, horsepower alone doesn't tell the whole story, as the Switch has access to technology 10 years more modern than PS3/360, so it is massively more efficient.

It's like if you have a plane and a bus that have the same horsepower, but the bus can get stuck in traffic while the plane just flies straight to its destination.

This enables Switch to close the gap with PS4 enough that it can run the same games, just at lower settings. It also helps that the Switch has 3.2Gb of RAM available to games, which is closer to the 5GB or so of PS4/XBO than the less than 500MB PS3 and 360 have.

Of course, being a portable machine brings with it certain limitations as well; particularly memory bandwidth, which is the Switch's weakest link, so you have this halfway house of 7th gen horsepower and bandwidth with 8th gen GPU features and RAM capacity.

For me the Switch is way, way, way more ps3 like than ps4.  I'm always surprised people think the switch runs with the ps4.  The ps4 produced GoW, Horizon, ghost, etc....  all well beyond what the switch can do.  The switch is a ps3.

Don't get me wrong breath is my all time favorite game.  But if that launched on the ps4 I would be disappointed in graphics and performance.  If it launched on the ps3, yeah I would be happy.  



i7-13700k

Vengeance 32 gb

RTX 4090 Ventus 3x E OC

Switch OLED