Does anyone believe that ceasefire will stop the conflict?. Most people don't realise is that Hamas wants bloodshed. They want Israel to be wiped out completely even though they have as much rights to exist as Palestine
| dane007 said: Does anyone believe that ceasefire will stop the conflict?. Most people don't realise is that Hamas wants bloodshed. They want Israel to be wiped out completely even though they have as much rights to exist as Palestine |
You have no idea what you're talking about. Do you know that israel has broken the ceasefire way more times then hamas has. In 2014 they slaughtered 2500 civilians in gaza including 500 children. just a year ago in protest the march of the great return where not a single bullet was fired they took target practice on the Palestinians As a result, 214 Palestinians, including 46 children, were killed, and over 36,100, including nearly 8,800 children have been injured. One in five of those injured (over 8,000) were hit by live ammunition. These people live in a open air prison with no basic human rights, being used for target practice and test new weapons and you expect hamas not to attack?
Look at what happening in the west bank with no hamas in charge, forced displacement and land being illegally stolen everyday this is recognized as illegal by every country and international law. some guy could convert to Judaism in new york and take a Palestinian home and land while the Palestinian has no rights on the land he was born in and his family roots goes back multiple generations.
Last edited by zeldaring - on 11 February 2024
| dane007 said: Does anyone believe that ceasefire will stop the conflict? |
I'm sure ceasefire number 250 will succeed where ceasefires 1 - 249 have failed! How could it possibly not succeed with such a stunning rate of success!
NyanNyanNekoChan said:
I'm sure ceasefire number 250 will succeed where ceasefires 1 - 249 have failed! How could it possibly not succeed with such a stunning rate of success! |
Yea if israel would recognize Palestinians as humans with equal rights the conflict will eventually be solved but israel goal is to kick them all out so i'm sure a cease fire will not work, genocide and ethnic cleansing is the best option for people like you.
| dane007 said: Does anyone believe that ceasefire will stop the conflict?. Most people don't realise is that Hamas wants bloodshed. They want Israel to be wiped out completely even though they have as much rights to exist as Palestine |
No, as Zeldaring said, recognizing Palestinians as humans, ending the oppression and apartheid system, ending the daily harassment of Palestinians, ending the frequent killings of Palestinians and illegal detentions, ending the continuous land grab and illegal evictions, expropriation of Palestinian properties, that would end the 75 year old conflict.
Hamas wants freedom, just like any other person on this planet. They have (long ago) resorted to violence as that's the only thing the international community pays attention to. Peaceful protests where the IDF uses Palestinians as target practice, bragging about how many knees they have shot go ignored.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2020-03-06/ty-article-magazine/.highlight/42-knees-in-one-day-israeli-snipers-open-up-about-shooting-gaza-protesters/0000017f-f2da-d497-a1ff-f2dab2520000
Oct 7 wasn't even the first major clash in 2023
INVESTIGATE POSSIBLE WAR CRIMES DURING ISRAEL’S MILITARY OFFENSIVE ON GAZA IN MAY 2023
https://www.amnesty.org/en/documents/mde15/6848/2023/en/
Settler attacks have only been increasing since Netanyahu came around.
Even before Hamas' attack on October 7, Israeli forces had already killed 234 Palestinians in the West Bank this year, while settlers were responsible for nine more killings. https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/palestinians-west-bank-2023-was-deadliest-year-record
Gaza has been an open air prison for decades, Israel limits food that goes in along with everything else
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/oct/17/israeli-military-calorie-limit-gaza
It's Israel that wants to wipe out / remove all Palestinians. The Likud charter uses the slogan from the river to the sea to wipe out Paletinians
The phrase was also used by the Israeli ruling Likud party as part of their 1977 election manifesto which stated "Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty." This slogan was repeated by Menachem Begin.
Hamas changed its charter in 2017 and was ready to recognize Israel, confined their fight with Zionist oppression, and was ready to live together in a 2 state solution, however based on 1967 lines, settlers out of the West bank.
Yes the conflict won't end with a ceasefire as Israel wants bloodshed, claim all the land plus a buffer zone, and continue their Zionist project to turn Israel into a white supremacist ethnocentric state
https://www.ajc.org/translatehate/Zionism-is-racism
https://arabcenterdc.org/resource/israel-legalizes-apartheid-and-ethnocentric-supremacy/
Read this from a non white Jew growing up in Israel
https://easternoak.co/maybe-its-time-we-started-talking-about-how-terrible-zionism-is-for-jews-too/
And watch this
A ceasefire isn't going to solve the conflict, it's going to save the lives of millions of people in the short term though. A lot needs to be done to solve this conflict.
Most people don't realise is that Right Wing Zionists wants bloodshed. They want Palestinians to be wiped out completely even though they have as much rights to exist as Israel.
Well maybe even more right since Israel is the colonizer and occupier since 1948. The ever green light from the USA has led to more and more redicalization on the Israeli side which is no in the grips of an radical right Zionist government, supported by a brain washed population from decades of propaganda dehumanizing Palestinians and making everyone believe they are the problem. But what can you expect from a country that celebrates Columbus day and Thanksgiving without even realizing what's behind those events.
The longer the genocide goes on, the more people there will be that do want Israel to be wiped out.
zeldaring said:
i'm sure a cease fire will not work, genocide and ethnic cleansing is the best option for people like you. |
Ah yes, because clearly those of us that point out that previous ceasefires have sadly not been effective simply must be fans of genocide and ethnic cleansing! This includes you too buddy, given that you also stated that you don't think the ceasefire would work. Welcome to the genocide and ethnic cleansing club, by your own logic!
Why only a trickle of aid is getting into Gaza
Lengthy inspections, rejected humanitarian aid and Israeli bombs raining down. Those are some of the hurdles to relief reaching the 2.2 million Palestinians in war-torn Gaza. The United Nations’ Under-Secretary-General for Humanitarian Affairs and Emergency Relief, Martin Griffiths, has described the process as “in all practical terms, impossible.”
Gaza was placed under a complete Israeli siege on October 9, when Defense Minister Yoav Gallant said he would halt the supply of electricity, food, water and fuel to the enclave after Hamas attacked his country, killing 1,200 people and taking more than 250 hostages. Israel has since begun allowing some aid to enter. Getting any form of relief into Gaza is a long and arduous process, aid workers and the UN say.
An average of 95 aid trucks per day entered Gaza between October 10 and February 1, according to the Palestinian Red Crescent, down from 500 commercial and aid trucks a day before the war, when Palestinians weren’t facing mass displacement and starvation. Some 2 million Gazans are dependent on UN aid now. Relief operations are expected to be further hampered after the United States and other top donors suspend funding for UNRWA, the main agency responsible for aid distribution in Gaza. The donors pulled their funding over allegations by Israel that some of its staff were involved in the Hamas attacks.
Yet Israel continues to try to convince the world they have no restrictions on aid and it's the UN that's stalling
https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/israel-blames-un-for-slow-aid-as-guterres-warns-of-catastrophe-1.2008528
https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/israel-is-holding-up-food-for-1-1-million-palestinians-in-gaza-the-main-un-aid-agency-there-says-1.6762807
Telling Israel not to enter Rafah is like telling us to lose the war, Prime Minister Netanyahu says
Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu reiterated that the Israeli military would soon launch an operation into Rafah and pledged to provide safe passage to civilians, but offered few details. "Victory is within reach. We're going to do it. We're going to get the remaining Hamas terrorist battalions in Rafah, which is the last bastion, but we're going to do it," Netanyahu told ABC News' Jonathan Karl in an interview releasing Sunday.
"We're going to do it while providing safe passage for the civilian population so they can leave," he said. When asked where Palestinians are expected to go, Netanyahu said "we're working out a detailed plan." "Those who say that under no circumstances should we enter Rafah are basically saying: ‘lose the war, keep Hamas there’," Netanyahu added.
There is no winning this war, only making it worse. You cannot wipe out the desire for freedom, support for Hamas has only strengthened and will have no problems to recruit new people or restart under a different name. People will continue to resist oppression and apartheid, resistance will continue. All you are doing is create more hatred.
And Rafah won't be the end. Settler violence and ethnic cleansing will continue in the West bank and East Jerusalem. Netanyahu has already stated he wants to create a buffer zone in Lebanon, take over the Philadelphia corridor to cut Gaza off from Egypt and keep a military presence in Gaza while some right wing politicians want settlements in Gaza.
There's one state that continues to be successful with this kind of oppression and apartheid regime, that's North Korea (discriminatory songbun system). And Israel is already using many tactics Kim Jung Un uses like collective punishment, starvation, killing and illegally detaining whole families of people it deems enemies of the state. Both use religion and propaganda to control the population, backed up by lethal force.
NyanNyanNekoChan said:
Ah yes, because clearly those of us that point out that previous ceasefires have sadly not been effective simply must be fans of genocide and ethnic cleansing! This includes you too buddy, given that you also stated that you don't think the ceasefire would work. Welcome to the genocide and ethnic cleansing club, by your own logic! |
Instead of singling mud back and forth (yes you too Zeldaring) what is your suggestion to do?
A ceasefire is necessary to stop the current bloodshed, starvation and rampant outbreaks of disease in Gaza. It won't solve the 75 year old conflict, but it will save many lives in the short term and limit further damage to any possible solution to the conflict.
Ceasefires have not been successful in the long run because the US keeps vetoing every effort to solve the root cause of the conflict. The US has created the feeling of impunity in Israel and encouraged far right Zionists to take control of the government.
https://www.thenation.com/article/world/far-right-israel-zionism/
https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/the-origins-of-netanyahus-all-systems-assault-on-israeli-democracy
Israel is long overdue a wake up call starting with sanctions. Hopefully it's not too late for the population to restore democracy before Netanyahu and the likes erode it further.
https://www.chathamhouse.org/2024/01/when-netanyahu-falls-israels-democracy-will-need-new-political-realignments
Ceasefires only work when work is done to solve the underlying conflict. Israel has never stopped the occupation nor continued stealing of land from Palestinians, treating them as second class citizens at best. All they have done is tighten the oppression and surveillance while building more checkpoints and walls. The IRA laid down their arms because that conflict was not solved with walls and apartheid.
Quoting Nelson Mandela
I am not truly free if I am taking away someone else's freedom, just as surely as I am not free when my freedom is taken from me. The oppressed and the oppressor alike are robbed of their humanity. When I walked out of prison, that was my mission, to liberate the oppressed and the oppressor both.
"Choose peace rather than confrontation. Except in cases where we cannot get, where we cannot proceed, or we cannot move forward. Then if the only alternative is violence, we will use violence."
There is a way out
https://globalnews.ca/news/10100613/nelson-mandela-great-grandson-israel-hamas-conflict/
Mandela said that his great-grandfather, the first Black president of South Africa, was considered idealistic for thinking that there was a solution to apartheid in his country and people would consider it a miracle if it happened — and then it did.
“The world looked at us and marveled to see us as a miracle. It’s not a miracle, it’s two conflicting parties coming into a realization that the violence would never resolve the conflict. They ought to find alternative ways to deal with that conflict,” he said.
And as with Israel, it took the US to stop supporting apartheid in South Africa to get the momentum going to start solving that conflict.
https://www.salon.com/2011/02/05/ronald_reagan_apartheid_south_africa/
Yet it took the international community to apply pressure on the US to finally stop backing the apartheid regime.
Israel has Europe in its pocket as well though :/
All hospitals in Rafah at full capacity: Kuwaiti Hospital doctor
Jamal al-Hams, a doctor at the Kuwaiti Hospital in Rafah, has told Al Jazeera that an Israeli attack on the southern city would cause endless suffering for Palestinians. “We are suffering a lot during these days because of the huge number of people who have been displaced from the northern and middle areas of the Gaza Strip towards Rafah,” he said.
“Secondly, we [already] have a huge number of injured people and patients with chronic diseases and acute illnesses who have been collected from all over the Gaza Strip [to Rafah]. We are suffering from the shortage of medical disposables and drugs – most of the antibiotics and analgesics are not available.”
“We have changed the admission beds to emergency beds. The Najjar hospital has a bed capacity of 70, and they changed it to 200 but that is still not enough,” al-Hams added. “There would be no place for more injured people. There will be no bed capacity not even for one because all hospitals [in the south] – the European, Najjar and Kuwaiti – are all at full capacity.”
“We are asking to stop war because it has continued for so long,” he added. “I don’t know what is coming but I am sure that we will suffer very much.”
Israeli forces snipe young woman and her little cousin in Gaza City
Al Jazeera has obtained video footage showing a young Palestinian woman and her little cousin lying on a street in the Sheikh Radwan area in Gaza City, after an Israeli sniper shot them both. According to Al Jazeera’s Ismail al-Ghoul, the child survived while the woman was killed. “These are difficult scenes to witness, but they have occurred over and over again,” al-Ghoul said.
Palestinian on hospital grounds killed by Israeli sniper
At least 395 displaced people killed in UNRWA shelters since October 7
There have been 298 incidents that have impacted UNRWA premises, according to the UN agency for Palestine refugees, which includes at least 31 incidents of military use and interference at UNRWA premises. The agency SAID that 150 different UNRWA installations have been impacted.
“UNRWA estimates that in total at least 395 IDPs [displaced] sheltering in UNRWA shelters have been killed and at least a further 1,379 injured since the start of the war,” it said.
More than 700 million litres of wastewater leaked into Gaza City streets: Municipality
More than 700 million litres of wastewater had leaked into the streets of Gaza City and the seaside since the Israeli offensive was launched on October 7, according to the municipality of Gaza. “This is considered a health and environmental catastrophe and threatens the city’s underground reserves,” it said in a post on X.
Israeli army chief approved Rafah ground operation on three occasions: Report
Herzi Halevi, the Israeli army’s chief of general staff, has told ministers during a cabinet meeting that he had approved a ground operation in Rafah on three previous occasions, according to Israeli newspaper Haaretz. According to the report, Halevi said he would present the details of the plan when it was required, adding that talking about it to the media would only “make it easier” for Yahya Sinwar, the leader of Hamas in Gaza.
People in Rafah ‘tired, drained and frustrated’
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has ordered the Israeli army to get ready for a possible ground incursion in Rafah. That’s what Palestinians did not expect to happen. Israel started its attacks in the north, ordering people to flee to the south, which is now the theatre for the Israeli military operations.
Palestinians do not want to be displaced again. They are completely tired, drained, frustrated, injured and have lost thousands of their community members. More than 85 percent of Gaza’s population are sheltering in Rafah without having any other place to go.
Palestinians, taking shelter in Rafah shop in an overcrowded market to meet some of their needs
PA is not relevant, and Israeli attack on Rafah is imminent: Israeli historian Ilan Pappe
It would be very difficult for [PA President Mahmoud] Abbas to remain relevant because in the eyes of the Israeli government he has not been relevant for quite a while. The only function he seems to serve as far as the Israeli government is concerned is some sort of security coordination to keep the lid on any potential uprising in the West Bank. I don’t think the Israelis are at all interested in consulting him about the day after in Gaza.
I think Washington is more keen to have the PA as part of the post-war arrangement, but I think it would be a terrible mistake for the PA to be part of it. This is going to be seen by so many Palestinians as collaborating with the destruction of Gaza and the Israeli visions of post-war Gaza, which is definitely very opposite from what most Palestinians would have liked to happen. We really don’t see any role for the PA in the next 15 months – because this is more or less the period in which the fighting will continue – and I don’t think there will be any substantial negotiations anyway for the day after.
History teaches us that strong American language of condemnation very rarely is supported by actions. Israelis have a way of allegedly taming their actions, creating the impression that this is not really a military operation but a limited operation.
I do think Israel will attack Rafah; I don’t think that the Israeli plans for how to deal with the refugees are going to easily materialise. We hope and we need a strong international reaction now because once the Israeli operation begins, it would be more difficult to stop them.
Israel seeks to cause ‘civil disorder’ in Rafah city
In addition to attacks on residential homes, Israeli forces are now also targeting the civil order in Rafah city. There has been recent systematic and intentional targeting of police departments and personnel. So far, we are looking at three separate attacks that killed police personnel, including the director of the investigative department and the director of the police department.
People here think that this is the beginning of such attacks as Israel seeks to cause civil disorder in Rafah city. The police department here has been working very hard to secure the delivery of humanitarian trucks, and to establish some sort of stability in healthcare facilities and food distribution. Rafah city will be heading for a civil collapse if such attacks continue.
Gaza’s children will be impacted by ‘severe war trauma for the rest of their lives’
Israel’s war has scarred children for life and “deeply affected” their care, according to Dr Alice Rothchild, a physician and filmmaker who focuses on Israel and Palestine. In an interview with Al Jazeera from Seattle, Rothchild pointed out that the occupation of Gaza has had an impact on children’s health services even before the war.
“There has been a huge number of injuries of children and young people … there is a number of orthopaedic trauma, particularly in teenage boys,” she said. “What we see is the children who have had an experience of severe war trauma as well as starvation, lack of medicines, are going to be impacted for the rest of their lives. “They have huge mental health issues to deal with. There are now reports of rising levels of anxiety, nervousness, bedwetting, inability to leave one’s parents.”
A child looks at the damage caused by Israeli bombardment in Rafah, February 9
Gaza Strip death toll rises to 28,176
At least 112 people have been killed and 173 others injured in the past 24 hours, raising the death toll to 28,176, according to Gaza’s Health Ministry.
Hebron women recount horrors in Israeli detention
Palestinian women from Hebron area in the occupied West Bank, arrested in late October last year and released on November 30 in the Israel-Hamas deal, faced extreme violence and threats of rape in detention, according to testimonies collected by the Israeli rights group B’Tselem.
“The women were removed from their homes violently, in the middle of the night, blindfolded and painfully handcuffed. They were then transferred between several prisons. Every transfer came with beating, swearing, and threats to themselves and their families, including threats of rape. The women were humiliatingly strip-searched several times,” the group said. It added that the holding conditions in all the prisons and detention facilities were “inhumane”, where the little food they were given was of poor quality, and they had to beg for drinking water.
“The cells were extremely small, crowded and filthy, and there was no way to clean them. Only some had mattresses, but these were extremely dirty, and the women were not given blankets or warm clothes. The toilets in the cell were exposed, even to people outside the cell, and requests for sanitary pads were repeatedly denied,” the group added.
Israel deports Palestinian woman arrested in West Bank to Gaza Strip
This morning:
Israeli military release the Palestinian journalist Seqal Yousef, 51-years-old, from prison and deport her to Gaza through the Karam Abu Salem crossing. She was kidnapped at a military checkpoint near Ramallah earlier this month, and now sent to the slaughterhouse.
— Mariam Barghouti مريم البرغوثي (@MariamBarghouti) February 11, 2024
Nearly 7,000 Palestinians arrested in occupied West Bank since October 7: Advocacy group
The Palestinian Prisoner’s Society says that Israeli forces have arrested 6,950 Palestinians in the occupied West Bank since October 7. Israel refuses to give information on the number and fate of those it has arrested from the Gaza Strip.
A Palestinian woman flashes a V-sign towards Israeli troops during an army raid in the Tulkarem refugee camp, occupied West Bank
Illegal Israeli settlers attack Palestinian vehicles with stones, tear gas driver in occupied West Bank
About two dozen illegal Israeli settlers have hurled stones at Palestinian cars near the occupied West Bank village of Bizzariya, northwest of Nablus, according to Israeli human rights group Yesh Din. The settlers smashed a vehicle’s windshield and tear-gassed the Palestinian driver who had to be taken to hospital for treatment.
Israeli settlers march from Tapuach Junction to the Israeli settler outpost of Evyatar in the Israeli-occupied West Bank
Israel using war on Gaza to fast track construction of illegal settlements
A report by Israeli daily Haaretz says that the government is using the war on the Gaza Strip as a distraction to build more settlements in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem. “We know that these settlements are illegal under international law,” said Al Jazeera’s Rory Challands, speaking from occupied East Jerusalem. According to Ir Amim, an Israeli NGO that monitors illegal settlement activity, 17 settlement plans have been advanced since October 7, or about 8,000 housing units. "Four plans have been approved since October 7 – that’s 3,700 housing units,” Challands said.
“What Ir Amim say is going on is that the government is using the war to basically fast track settlement construction,” he went on to say. “This is an incredibly bureaucratic procedure most of the time and involves local planning committees, municipal housing authorities, planning reviews, tender processes, etc. “If the government feels that any of these settlements are politically expedient, then the government can fast track them and that is what Ir Amin says has been going on at an unprecedented rate since the war broke out on October 7.”
Protests in Morocco call for end to normalisation with Israel: Report
Thousands of Moroccans have taken to the streets of their capital to call for an end to their country’s ties with Israel, in response to what they called the Israeli “genocide” in Gaza. “Normalisation is treason,” and “Stop the massacre”, read banners protesters carried in front of Morocco’s parliament in the centre of Rabat, according to the AFP news agency.
In late 2020, Morocco established diplomatic ties with Israel by signing the US-brokered Abraham Accords. As part of the deal, Rabat received Washington’s recognition of its claim to sovereignty over the disputed territory of Western Sahara.
Pro-Palestinian protestors stage demonstration at Museum of Modern Art in New York
Hundreds of pro-Palestinian protestors have staged a demonstration at the Museum of Modern Art (MoMA) in New York, demanding the institution cut ties with donors linked to Israel. A video posted on social media showed protestors draping banners from the museum’s upper floors and chanting, “Free, free Palestine”.
MoMA closed its galleries to the public at around 3:45pm on Saturday, after protestors took over the building’s second-floor atrium during the demonstration, which coincided with a protest at the city’s Brooklyn Museum, online arts magazine Hyperallergic reported.
🚨 BREAKING: As the twin genocidal pincers of Zionism and US imperialism strain to close on Rafah, 800 protestors staged a takeover of the Museum of Modern Art in New York City to demand an end to the siege of Gaza and an end institutional and arts complicity with Zionism 🚨 pic.twitter.com/7Xo0I6IePJ
— Palestinian Youth Movement (@palyouthmvmt) February 10, 2024
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