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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Was Xbox's 2022 First Party Output the worst in their gaming HISTORY?

eva01beserk said:
Ryuu96 said:

Did anybody say that? The thing is that some of these studios have moved to AAA production whilst still being ~100 employees so they've had to staff up significantly to become a AAA capable.

InXile for example, their next title is AAA, but they were a ~100 sized studio, as a result they've staffed up over the years and moved into a much larger studio to accommodate that. So, it's not that anyone is saying "a studio getting bigger would slow development" it's that people are saying "AA-sized studios are moving into AAA production so they need time to staff up"

Undead Labs too, State of Decay 3 is being described as AAA and they were a ~100 employee studio, since then they've opened two more studios and started expanding, whilst supporting State of Decay 2 (even today) with content updates.

And in someone like Playground's case, instead of using the Forza Horizon team for Fable, they opened a brand-new studio and started to staff it up from 1 employee to a target of ~250 so that would explain why that is taking longer too.

So my question still stands. What are the current devs doing during this increase or move to new place or creating a separate team? Because the worst part is these teams even with the excuses you are making still had the ability to show what they are working on. So some work had to have been done for them to show off a game like they did with perfect dark or fable or stay of decay. So they canot have been doing nothing. Or they had nothing but still decided to show off? Wich is also not good.

Working on the project? Lol.

You aren't entitled to see their project until they want to show it, you've gone from a development argument to a marketing one.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 20 November 2022

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Ryuu96 said:
eva01beserk said:

So my question still stands. What are the current devs doing during this increase or move to new place or creating a separate team? Because the worst part is these teams even with the excuses you are making still had the ability to show what they are working on. So some work had to have been done for them to show off a game like they did with perfect dark or fable or stay of decay. So they canot have been doing nothing. Or they had nothing but still decided to show off? Wich is also not good.

Working on the project? Lol.

You aren't entitled to see their project until they want to show it, you've gone from a development argument to a marketing one.

Yes we are. If they are selling you a box with the promise of games coming soon and then they go MIA. We have a right to complain that we where sold a lie. Not me of course, I stopped believing as soon as Phil came in. 

So on the marketing point. You trying to say they pulled an anthem? They had nothing and the dev team was unaware of what marketing was showing? Whos fault is that then? Is the marketing department separate from MS? 



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

Well sometimes you need a drought before a flood is my take. But yeah some studios should have produced something by now. Especially Ninja Theory, it's been a long while since Hellblade. It was also a difficult year to hat a third party game, so the year being lackluster isn't totally their fault, but it's still pretty bad, for such a major publisher.



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar

Intrinsic said:
Kakadu18 said:

Newsflash: games take time to develop. It's not like they sat down and went like: "We won't release anything this year for no reason at all." Most AAA games that their newly acquired studios develop started development not to long ago, got delayed like Starfield or just take forever like TES VI.

It's not that hard to understand.

This is honestly a bullshit justification.

While what you are saying is 100% true.. games take time to make... that doesn't change the fact that this is at the very least showing a gross lack of foresight on MSpart.They are a platform holder and publisher. While games take time to make, their development is also planned and initiated years before their expected releases. If you look at the output of MS FP software over the last 6 years, their real problem becomes clear to see.

Its why it was just easier to buy up studios that already had projects either pending or in development.

Lets t pretend that we aren't living in the same world where Playstation and Nintendo exist. Just look at sony's output this year, last year, and even the year before that. Or the one before that...etc.

But pretty much most of the studios if not all that Ms did buy has released games already..



gtotheunit91 said:
eva01beserk said:

Late to the party. But can somebody explain why a studio getting bigger would slow development? That does not make sense.

Its suposed to be comon knowledge that studios are always working on something and bigger studios work on multiple projects at one. If a studio got bigger sounds logical that whatever project was being worked on would now be done faster with the extra manpower.

Unless im to assume that phil came in and said this studio is now 2x bigger. Scrap everything you had and start from scratch. Or those studios whete just sitting on their asses for years waiting to the team to grow. Either is just poor management on MS part.

Apparently nobody played the games these studios released in the time AFTER they were purchased lol, and the positive impact the studio purchase had on the outcome of the games, but, no one’s ever going to pay attention to the important details outside of their own bias

Damn shame too. Wasteland 3 by inXile in 2020 and the 2 expansions released in 2021 were literally one of the best true RPG’s I’ve played in idk how many years. 

I dont understand the fans of other systems in this thread. Pretty much every studio Ms did buy has released something already.



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I don't know, but despite FM7 I still feel like 2017 was worse. It's a bar set too low that it's gonna be hard to surpass how bad it was



 

derpysquirtle64 said:

I don't know, but despite FM7 I still feel like 2017 was worse. It's a bar set too low that it's gonna be hard to surpass how bad it was

I think 2017 also was cuphead launch , I think Microsoft wanted to buy the developer but decided not too and instead bought 5 other studios in 2018? Cuphead could've been exclusive?



Guess which version of Hatsune Miku this is? She has my Birth stone color turqoise in her eyes, And I'm most honest Sega Saturn lover alltime.Picture far right is Sega first Real Mascot. Represents my birth animal the helpful Bunny want you to find his name.My ruling Planet is Saturn if connect the Birth month I was born and year.

eva01beserk said:
Ryuu96 said:

Did anybody say that? The thing is that some of these studios have moved to AAA production whilst still being ~100 employees so they've had to staff up significantly to become a AAA capable.

InXile for example, their next title is AAA, but they were a ~100 sized studio, as a result they've staffed up over the years and moved into a much larger studio to accommodate that. So, it's not that anyone is saying "a studio getting bigger would slow development" it's that people are saying "AA-sized studios are moving into AAA production so they need time to staff up"

Undead Labs too, State of Decay 3 is being described as AAA and they were a ~100 employee studio, since then they've opened two more studios and started expanding, whilst supporting State of Decay 2 (even today) with content updates.

And in someone like Playground's case, instead of using the Forza Horizon team for Fable, they opened a brand-new studio and started to staff it up from 1 employee to a target of ~250 so that would explain why that is taking longer too.

So my question still stands. What are the current devs doing during this increase or move to new place or creating a separate team? Because the worst part is these teams even with the excuses you are making still had the ability to show what they are working on. So some work had to have been done for them to show off a game like they did with perfect dark or fable or stay of decay. So they canot have been doing nothing. Or they had nothing but still decided to show off? Wich is also not good.

In InXiles case they released Wasteland 3 near end of 2020 and two expansions in 2021. <--Not our fault if you didnt play them.

In Undead Labs case they released State of Decay 2 in 2018, They releases a massive update/Expansion in 2020, have been constently updating the game with another update just a few months ago <--Once again not our fault if you didnt play it.

In Playgrounds case they released Forza Horizon 5 November 2021, released one expansion for it in 2022 so far plus a bunch of updates <-- And again not our fault if you didnt play it.

Point is for you and other Sony fans if you dont follow xbox games news or releases dont be coming talking shit unless you have facts to back it up.



I don't know why Microsoft is even in the console/gaming business anymore to be honest. I've been very patient with my series x, but I feel like I was lied to. I was given this false hope of a better tomorrow. So far, they have not delivered. Let's rewind to Xbox One reveal. TV, TV, COD, Kinect, Always Online, DRM, Sports, TV, watercooler, get a 360. Arguably the worst of Xbox's days right? Wrong. 2017. Cancelled games, studios, projects, etc. Scalebound, Lionhead, Fable Legends. Even before then, Halo 4 was the last game of the 360 that year, they put out nothing else... This shows that historically speaking they do not deliver when push comes to shove. They rest on their laurels, Halo, Forza, Gears; all three are currently in a massive decline. Halo, not even going to mention the problems with that. I'd need another 3000 characters probably. Forza is the same racing game with prettier graphics, yawn, and again, Gears has not been good since 3. Judgment terrible, 4 and 5, no real impact and dead player based games.

Looking at their studios they currently had were abysmal. They had 5 studios, mostly all on the decline. Halo has never recovered since Halo 3. Gears of War has never come close to its glory days since 3. Fable, still dead at the time. Forza Horizon? It's the same game with a new coat of paint. Motorsport has gotten progressively worse with microtransactions as well. Minecraft, they can't take any credit for that as it was already created. And MS just bought them out, shocked. Their other studios like Rare putting out SoT, arguably their worst game. Sure it has done well numbers wise, but that's because of PC.

Then you fast forward to the false good years I'll call it. All those studios they bought. What have they really done since? Obsidian. Grounded and Pentiment are small games with no real impact. Where are the AAA games from them? We are still waiting for Avowed, and ToW 2. Ninja Theory still working on Hellblade. I remember Xbox fans trashing games like Uncharted, but they seem to love a walking sim like Hellblade? Hmmmm. Compulsion hasn't done really anything of note, Inexile another one stuck in limbo rumor-ville. The Initiative ended up being a lazy studio that has to hire outside help. Double Fine nothing new, Psychonauts 2 has no MS credit. Undead Labs, still making glitchy broken game and still no word from SoD 3. Perfect Dark and Indian Jones have had no real substance in a long time, except fake news from journalists pretending to be insiders.

Then they bought Bethesda.. and what have they done since. Starfield delayed, mixed messages on exclusivity. They've pretty much rode on the success of their MMOs for player count alone... Using that player stat to buff up their investor meetings probably to make them look like they have higher engagement. Arkane was working on a game before MS bought them, same with Tango. So MS gets no credit. They end up getting "cuked out" and have to wait a whole year to even put the game on the game pass. Gamepass... been a massive let down tbh. Low meta, shovelware games. It's even more of a scam that once gamepass runs out, you can't even play them anymore. Like wtf. I'll touch on Japanese support which has been dry as well. Missing games to Stadia ie Trails of and Ys. Still no FF, and missing a lot of obscure games that just do not get the light of day on Xbox. Redfall another delay that looks like a bland co op Back 4 Blood clone. A bunch of 2nd party games from mid studios like Avalanche. Only good thing about Contraband was that song in the beginning. Nothing else shown either. Insider rumors on 2nd party games from IO as well. 2025 and beyond. I don't know what I'm doing in 37 hours, let alone 2025 for Project Dragon???. More rumors which end up being fake from games years away. This is MS' problem, they show these games so early and then have nothing to show for it and base hype around those rumors.

2022... Literally the only good part of 2022 could be argued was January. When they announced the purchase of Activision. They wasted billions on mobile gaming which does nothing for Xbox, COD which will remain on PS unless Phil lies again (FF 14 anyone?), COD support studios that haven't produced in years. Activision/Blizzard themselves which are a PR disaster that already happened. Mixed messaging on exclusivity as well. Is it coming to PS or is it not? Billions of that money could have been put into making their own studios. What tastes better store bought tomatoes from like Dollar Tree, or home grown delicious, ripe, juicy tomatoes that were made by yourself. The answer is obvious. Gamepass releases have been a disaster, as well as delays as well, which have plagued Xbox in 2022. 2023 doesn't look much better. Starfield will get delayed again and release in a broken state. You're better off waiting until 2024-25 for the full complete edition as well. Redfall and Forza, will have no real impact as well.

All in all, MS has gotten to where they are simply through spending money with no real talent to back them up. Their solution is to sell the people on false hope, waste money on studios because they don't have their raw talent to create things themselves (look at the initiative), and get people to worship false idols like Game pass. the cult of game pass is probably one of the worst things that have come out of Xbox. If any good could come from 2023, it will be MS getting denied their Activision deal, they lose even more consumer trust, and eventually are forced to adapt to change or fade to obscurity.



eva01beserk said:
Ryuu96 said:

Working on the project? Lol.

You aren't entitled to see their project until they want to show it, you've gone from a development argument to a marketing one.

Yes we are. If they are selling you a box with the promise of games coming soon and then they go MIA. We have a right to complain that we where sold a lie. Not me of course, I stopped believing as soon as Phil came in. 

So on the marketing point. You trying to say they pulled an anthem? They had nothing and the dev team was unaware of what marketing was showing? Whos fault is that then? Is the marketing department separate from MS? 

You trying to say Sony never showed anything Years in advance?. Its called marketing for a reason.