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Forums - Politics Discussion - US rivers drying up, massive heat waves, devastating cold snaps

SvennoJ said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

Also, isn't the problem increasingly going from "keeping the sea out" to "getting the river water out into the sea"? With rising sea level, the water level on the Rhine Delta and halfway inlands also rises, as the river is almost flat at sea level by that point. In other words, on a high tide, the water wouldn't flow off anymore and start accumulating, risking to flow over the levies if too much accumulates that way.

Yep, hence that crazy idea to dam the entire North Sea. It's either that or build walls along the rivers all the way to Germany and Belgium.

Perhaps nuclear fusion driven mega pumps to the rescue. The Rhine discharges 13 million liters per second at maximum.

The most powerful pump, Nijhuis-HP1-4000.340 pumps 60K liters per second at 5,364 HP

You would need 217 of them to pump out the Rhine at max flow, it's do-able :)

Dunno what it would cost in energy, a lot probably.

I don't think reclaiming Doggerland is economically feasible. The amount of soil and pumping required would be insane.

Also the UK would throw the biggest tantrum the world has ever seen. Because if that happened they would share a land border with the rest of the EU.



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SvennoJ said:
JRPGfan said:

The ironic thing is this will have devistating consequences for some areas, while others will only be slightly effected.
Russia as a exsample, will hardly be hit by this (not near any coast lines) and large area's of siberia, will be hotter, and suitable for farm lands.

Other places like scandinavia, canada, if we can deal with riseing sea levels, it wont effect us that much.

Rising sea levels won't effect us, but flooding from the rivers and tornadoes are increasing in risk

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/barrie-tornado-ef-2-clean-up-1.6105258

That's Barrie, Ontario, happened yesterday

Legit tornadoes here in ON are more rare  yet arent really increasing. Though the ones that do touchdown are causing more destruction when they do. Most of the time big storms get quite narly but the twisters never fully touchdown let alone grow, so they're not counted. Barrie is part of tornado alley here in ON, but it's nothing like tornado alley down in the states, not even close. If that twister had hit a small farm town like is more typical, the news wouldn't have cared if there was something more 'important', like a mean tweet or something. It's because our news has been hyper focused on the heatwave and fires in BC lately and because Barrie is close enough to the Toronto bubble to 'matter' in ON.

We should trade some of that BC drought to the Dutch in exchange for some water though. Get on it Trumpdeau! 



Sir David Attenborough (95 yrs old) tells World Leaders what they must do to avert the coming Climate Crisis at COP26, he is amazing 



On average, you can't blame drought conditions on warming. Most of the US, for instance, has been consistently getting wetter.

Yeah, you can extrapolate from Clausius-Clapeyron and surmise that, unless it gets consistently wetter year-round, that rain events would become more intense. But that in itself won't cause lack of water for obvious reasons.

You might argue things are slightly different in the Southwestern US:

But even a sample of a hundred years might not be enough to extrapolate on long-term climate cycles in certain places, and that at the beginning of the last century, the Southwest might actually have been at its wettest in over a thousand years, so nowhere to go from there but toward drier conditions:

Same thing with tornadoes, by the way.



 

 

 

 

 

haxxiy said:

On average, you can't blame drought conditions on warming. Most of the US, for instance, has been consistently getting wetter.

Yeah, you can extrapolate from Clausius-Clapeyron and surmise that, unless it gets consistently wetter year-round, that rain events would become more intense. But that in itself won't cause lack of water for obvious reasons.

You might argue things are slightly different in the Southwestern US:

But even a sample of a hundred years might not be enough to extrapolate on long-term climate cycles in certain places, and that at the beginning of the last century, the Southwest might actually have been at its wettest in over a thousand years, so nowhere to go from there but toward drier conditions:

Same thing with tornadoes, by the way.

Keep in mind as global temperatures rise there will be far more moisture in the air, but also combined with higher temps, this has the perverse effect of areas having very different outcomes to each other due to geography and location, some will see massive increases in rainfall due to higher air moisture, and other areas will dry out dramatically with higher temperatures, all of which will have far more active weather patterns like huge storms/tornadoes due to rising energy levels in the whole system resulting in greater instability in a run-away weather system, the danger is once the tipping point has been reached human intervention will have negligible effect    

Last edited by Rab - on 01 November 2021

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Rab said:
haxxiy said:

Keep in mind as global temperatures rise there will be far more moisture in the air, but also combined with higher temps, this has the perverse effect of areas having very different outcomes to each other due to geography and location, some will see massive increases in rainfall due to higher air moisture, and other areas will dry out dramatically with higher temperatures, all of which will have far more active weather patterns like huge storms/tornadoes due to rising energy levels in the whole system resulting in greater instability in a run-away weather system, the danger is once the tipping point has been reached human intervention will have negligible effect    

I mean, it's hard to be sure. For instance, most models in the 2000s estimated stronger Hadley circulation with increasing temperatures but now it is theorized that both Hadley and Walker circulation would be weaker than present day due to decreased equator-to-pole temperature gradients. As for storms, we'll have to see. So far neither cyclones or tornadoes seem to be becoming more prevalent.

That is not to say warming is desired or morally fine, particularly at the present scale. While Earth has been much warmer throughout most of its history, climate changed in scales 10 - 1,000 times slower than current rates and animals and plants could migrate without cities and other human infrastructure in their way. Half of the world's population living at or very close to sea level doesn't help, either.

But to assume Earth's pre-industrial climate was somehow optimal for life or even human interests is a fairly ad hoc hypothesis.



 

 

 

 

 

Rab said:

Sir David Attenborough (95 yrs old) tells World Leaders what they must do to avert the coming Climate Crisis at COP26, he is amazing 

Great speech. My favorite grandfather! He hits the nail on the head, yes it has been much warmer in the far past, and yes the climate has been unstable before. However all what we have now is based on a long long period of stability that we're quickly effing up.



haxxiy said:

But to assume Earth's pre-industrial climate was somehow optimal for life or even human interests is a fairly ad hoc hypothesis.

Keep in mind this is coming from David Attenborough... Who is almost a century old and seen the world go through multiple world wars and seen the changes in the planet in the scope of a nature historian.

I would take more credence in his information than cherry picked graphs.



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Looking to comedians for our leadership

Last edited by Rab - on 07 November 2021

A look at the weather forecast in Australia and International News in 2050