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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Do you remember NTSC AND PAL?

snyps said:
I thought it was still a thing. I’m an American. I used to pirate Dreamcast games. If I accidentally grabbed a pal version it played like a total mess.

Here in Luxembourg for instance, we switched to digital broadcasting in 2006 already

Also, you can be happy it worked at all. An NTSC version of a game generally didn't run on a PAL console at all (unless it's a Turbografx game, since that console was signal-agnostic)



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Yeah, I still do because I import old games. PAL games ran slow because of the 50MHZ or when I softmodded a Wii to play Xenoblade and it was in black and white until I adjusted some settings. I never did get hardware from PAL as I did not want to mess with converters.



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

Of course, PAL has disappeared and so has NTSC.
Now we play in 1080p60Hz, 1440p60Hz or 2160p 60 Hz and soon 120Hz



NTSC = never twice (the) same color



Yes, they still exist. Even HD image have this type of stuff, 720p for USA cable tv and 1080i for Japan cable tv.



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PAL was better for movies, higher resolution (576 scan lines vs 480 for NTSC) and no 3:2 pull down filter. Movies ran 4% faster on PAL in Europe, displaying 25 frames per second from the 24 frames per second original. It was too small of a speed up to interfere with sound.

Movies converted to NTSC had the annoying 3:2 pulldown filter or telecine process that introduces judder. Converting every 4 frames into 5 by interlacing different frames together. That judder still exists today, except no more interlacing, thus a simple repeat of every 4th frame to convert to 30fps. On (4k) blu-ray you get true 24p output, although many tvs have 3:2 pulldown detection and will correctly display it at 24fps.

For games the reverse, running 8% slower on PAL and black borders for the 96 fewer scan lines. Consoles also had that horrible RCA composite video output, always suffering from low color resolution and color bleeding. S-VHS was a bit better until component video became an option. Component cables could actually carry 1080p looking just as good as HDMI. The original 360 didn't have HDMI output yet. I spend $300 on a custom made component video cable to run through the walls and ceiling to my projector, just for the 360.

Now we have 720p (cable tv), 1080i (cable tv), 1080p (streaming), 2160p (streaming), 24hz (movies), 50hz (BBC documentaries), 60hz (tv)
As well as HDR10, Dolby Vision, HLG, Samsung HDR10 Plus, Technicolor advanced HDR
And we still have Stereo, PCM, Dolby Pro-logic, Dolby Pro-Logic Plus, AC3, DTS, Dolby True HD, DTS HD-MA, Dolby Atmos

Different versions of HDMI supporting different formats, the fun never ends.



Yes, and most people don't understand what those two things meant



Bofferbrauer2 said:
YanisFromFrance said:

In Europe we had the choice between the Pal at 50Hz and the Pal 60Hz which was like the Ntsc

Since you're from France, you should also definitely remember SÉCAM, since all french channels actually used that system instead of PAL. Eastern Europe also adopted SÉCAM for political reasons: NTSC was from the Americans and thus not an option, while the neighboring countries from the Warsaw block used PAL. So to avoid the inhabitants to receive that signal, the Soviet Union, and by extension the whole Warsaw block,  choose SÉCAM as their transmission standard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SECAM

IMHO your Wiki link doesn't really support that.

It explains SECAM had technical reasons for adoption, from superior color to allowing longer cables between studios and transmitters. It says Soviet Union was involved in development of the standard. While East/West German political situation is mentioned as one way "people have attributed" or "explained" the difference, that is not only explanation given, and since Soviet Union not East Germany had originally co-developed the standard, this "political" explanation seems more likely a post-facto rationalization. As it explains the only inherent difference between PAL/SECAM is in color, so that factor alone wouldn't block viewing/hearing program in black and white, that would be a piss poor attempt at blocking propaganda since color TVs weren't even common for decades after it's introduction. As it also explains, using different standard for black and white and audio components (which is independent of PAL vs SECAM difference) would be actually effective at blocking propaganda, which was actually the case in all Soviet and Eastern Europe countries EXCEPT East Germany and Yugoslova (showing exact opposite intent to blocking signals there, as they are varying from Soviet standard in order to share b&w and audio standard with W Germany).

So it seems people's technical misunderstanding leads them to invent fables about political SECAM, when really it was a cope to ignore why West Germany had lower quality of color TV standard than East Germany/Soviet Union and France, and likely influenced by internal West German propaganda narrative about East, despite East Germany all along was receiving the b&w/audio signals just fine (with most TVs being b&w for several decades later) and eventually moved to dual PAL/SECAM decoders. SECAM seems to have been basis of the would-be next gen analog standards particularly in Scandinavia and 4:2:0 digital video and was even licenced to improve PAL. So it's non-universality vs. PAL seems more of a patent licencing/cost issue.

Of course from perspective of NTSC (and gaming based on that) PAL/SECAM were practically the same.

Last edited by mutantsushi - on 10 October 2020

I remember NTSC, but not PAL. However, these days, I do play with SCART, for my older consoles, because it's better than the composite cables we have in the US.. :/



I remember everything.