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Forums - Politics Discussion - NYT: Long-Concealed Records Show Trump’s Chronic Losses and Years of Tax Avoidance

OhNoYouDont said:
KingJames said:
I'm Canadian. I've paid attention to US Politics since 2008. Donald Trump is the worst US President ever, PERIOD.

You're not wrong.

"Donald Trump is rated the worst president in American history by a group of 170 political science scholars."*

Even ranks as one of the worst presidents by his own right-leaning political scientists. Mind you, this was pre-COVID so he would rank even worse now...were there any lower to go.

"But even among the Republican scholars, Trump ranked very unfavorably. Respondents who identified as Republicans or conservatives ranked Trump 40th out of 44 presidents. Self-described Democrats and Independents both ranked Trump dead last."*

*https://www.ibtimes.com/trump-worst-president-us-history-political-scientists-claim-2765338

Trudeau getting tons of hate over here and I'm like "DO YOU SEE THE COMPARISON?!?!?"



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RolStoppable said:
Dulfite said:

Are you honestly suggesting only one political party in America divides the country? lol okay.

Yes, that's what I am suggesting. Oppression of white supremacists doesn't count as dividing the country.

You arent wrong. Anyone at this point who still supports Trump in any significant way is a bad/disturbed person. It's a little too obvious at this point. 



Immersiveunreality said:
Locknuts said:
Legend. Income tax is theft.

Are you mocking that thought or supporting it?

Supporting it.



Valdney said:
No body in their right mind cares if a man is keeping more of his own money through legal tax deductions. Nothing to see here. Now onto the next “scandal”.

I don't give a shit if someone is able to fleece the system and thus places more of an overall tax burden on average joe, the plumber... Good on them for playing the game, clearly they were smart enough to do some research and save some money.

What I care about is the blatant hypocrisy of whinging about someone else paying a low amount of tax when they paid almost nothing themselves.
Trump is a toxic hypocrite.

And here is the evidence for it direct from Trumps twitter:



Conversely... Trump is in a position where he could tighten down tax laws and make the entire system fairer on everyone so everyone pays their way, but has obviously failed to do so, just like he has failed at managing COVID, building the wall and making Mexico pay for it, rebuilding the economy and all the other rubbish.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

NightlyPoe said:
Machiavellian said:

Isn't this the reason why he is being audited.  The IRS wants to know if he actually is doing it legally.  The president is already being investigated for Tax fraud and a few other money crimes and those investigations are waiting for him to leave office.

Being audited by the IRS is a few steps short of being accused of tax fraud.  If it's just tax lawyers arguing over whether a line of the tax code should have applied or not, which I believe is the case, then it's a fairly mundane process.

True, but he used that excuse already 4 years ago. Being under audit for 4 years straight ain't exactly a good sign in that regard.



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So he losses money instead or making it? We knew it, he is a pretty bad business man with a big mouth.
And he avoid taxes trying to use loopholes? Pretty sure most rich people do, the fundamental difference from rich to poor people is that law always applies to the poor and rarely to the rich. Here in Brazil this is everyday routine.



BraLoD said:
So he losses money instead or making it? We knew it, he is a pretty bad business man with a big mouth.
And he avoid taxes trying to use loopholes? Pretty sure most rich people do, the fundamental difference from rich to poor people is that law always applies to the poor and rarely to the rich. Here in Brazil this is everyday routine.

I found it funny that during the debate, he claimed both that he's paying millions in taxes but also very smart about them. If he were so smart and successful, he would maybe be paying a couple hundred thousand, but not millions, so which one is it?

But yeah, that he is a bad business man should be pretty well known. I mean, he managed to bankrupt 4 casinos. How do you fuck that up? That's like running out of money while owning the money printing press.



OTBWY said:
FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:

A lot of talk that can be said with less. I don't want to wade through shit to get to the nugget.

Wrong. You have only proven your confirmation bias by adding your own interpretation and putting that above the facts. 

Nope. I mean, aside from him showing that he has no moral compass and a fraud, much like his cult followers have a moral compass that's ossified and or simple lack one, it's pretty clear that he's been doing a lot of fraudulent shit to enrich himself and pay as little tax as possible by noting stuff as expenses that aren't. He is doing tax evasion. Aside from that, he takes money from foreign entities. And the great part about this is, there still stuff coming in. It's not even the end of it lol.

You have no moral compass at all. You keep saying things, but you're still lying. Stop lying.

The point I was making can be made simpler without using the term deep state. Alternatively I could say our taxes are mismanaged at an extreme degree that does not benefit the taxpayers in a proportion for what is put into it by those same taxpayers. That being said the deep state is a real thing. Russia. Russia. Russia. Except Trump was never prosecuted by Mueller over Russia because they found nothing. Right now we are dealing with massive voter fraud attempts at levels we have never seen before. See: Project Veritas. Look at the Republicans that are coming out against Trump. The literal swamp like McCain's wife, ex-CIA agents, neoconservatives, let alone all of the Obama leftovers. I'm worried about real issues like this, but I feel confident Trump will fight no matter what is thrown at him. No one should be upset about this tax news because it's ridiculously overblown compared to real things going on.

You used the word deep state, and now you step back from it. Now that's weak. 

Step back from it and then I didn't. I clarified it in an easy to explain manner. If I stepped back your next paragraph wouldn't exist as a reply to something I said.


Also, they DID say that Russia interfered, you can't simply wish that away. There was a final report that concluded 3 years of investigation from a commitee that: Found that the Russian government had engaged in an "extensive campaign" to sabotage the election in favor of Trump, which included assistance from some members of Trump's own advisers.

How did Russia sabotage the election for Trump? Provide evidence. There was nothing in the investigation that would ever hold up in court or could be considered proof of anything like that happening. Which is why Trump faced no charges. The deep state created the Steele Dossier as it has not been corroborated and put Michael Flynn through a serious of witch hunts which they should be charged for. I elected Trump in Pennsylvania and the people who flipped swing states were already tired of Obama and wanted Trump because of his campaign promises. Nothing more complicated than that. No one was tricked into voting for Trump because of something Russia did.

Project Veritas is a right wing hatchet job bullshit operation by a creepy douchebag named O'Keefe that doctors and edits his footage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QNg94HZKP8

They edit videos so they are watchable and not many, many hours long compared to the source material. Debunk the following video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWK56l2VaLY


Anyway, you do believe in a deep state. And that's believing in ghosts. You believe in ghosts.

McMaster said that there is a faction of people in the White House working to undermine the President in an interview with 60 minutes. That is a scratch to the surface. I'm not going to go in depth with a peabrainlet in regards to the deep state. It's a massive wall of text undertaking, and you're completely intellectually dishonest so I would have to hope it would be worth it for the couple of other people who might end up reading my posts. I probably have and will expand upon this in other political threads anyway.

Here's just a basic article featuring what one unethical deep state agent is up to: Meet Norm Eisen

The article above is from a right wing news site, but is also heavily sourced with evidence in detail. Feel free to debunk the evidence. 

Many democrats are in power right now via congress, courts, and executive branch including the White House (some of which are Obama leftovers). Corrupt government officials are still a problem to this country no matter what level they are at so Trump being president wouldn't dissolve that. Hunter Biden's scandals are a far more concrete example of corruption than this flimsy tax return data. Considering Trump is running against Joe Biden and Hunter's actions were not isolated away from Joe it's not a whataboutism, but actual relevant counterpoints.

This is a side step. Trump is in power and this is about him and his tax evasion. Try to keep your mental gymnastics focused on Trump please.

Nope, not a side step. Biden is Trump's competition and the hypocrisy is not lost.

I replied because saying we are a cult is a blatant gaslight. This is overblowing something which might not be true and proves no illegal activity. The initial comment was not meaningful, but I shut down disruptive noise.

Nah, you replied cause I insulted you.

No, I replied because saying we are a cult is a blatant gaslight.

Where's the argument? First I'm not afraid to be called xenophobic because I'm mixed raced. More importantly the term xenophobia only exists as a subversive ad hominem for social marxists to psyop people against thinking for themselves. Nothing I said was xenophobic. It was true. Maybe try having an argument instead of resorting to social marxist gaslight attempts. It shows you are weak. Try debating stronger.

Mixed race people can't be racist? Hell, you could be part Irish or Italian. I don't care. You support a xenophobe and that kind of makes it easy to conclude it as such. Easy.

Also *social maxist gaslight attempts* *psyop* Fucking kek.

Using xenophobe ad hominem as an argument is a blatant social marxist gaslight tactics. You made no points. Simple as.


Truth is I have worked directly with legal and illegal immigrants for many years and looked into the leftist talking points and their studies regarding the subject. In personal experience I've seen some migrants get paid under the table so they will still receive welfare and other benefits (while getting the maximum amount on the books masking the illegality of the situation). Meaning they get some amount of money on the books so they qualify for free healthcare or tax refunds, but getting anything over that amount in cash. I've also seen some co-workers brazen enough to brag about crimes they got away with including drunk driving or reckless behavior (one instance was a young co-worker about 17/18 who thought it was funny he was riding bike across lanes against oncoming traffic and getting out of the way last minute). These are crimes where they put other people's lives at risk and they are proud they get off the hook because of guilt tripping a judge or cop about their family or keeping their job. This is how they explained they got out of it. Removing my personal anecdotes from the situation we can look at bogus claims from journalists. We are told there is only maybe 10, 12, 15 million illegal aliens. That number has been around and used by the left for decades. They want us to believe the number has never gone up. Truth is there has to be something like 25-50 million illegal aliens in addition to countless anchor babies abusing a loophole which was never designed for that purpose. When it comes to the money they add to the economy they take almost all of it back themselves through welfare and a lot of it even leaves the country. The American workers they supplant are not benefiting in any way, but instead seeing lower wages due to artificial competition. The only American people who see any benefit from these workers are the business owners and the corporations. Trump has made improvements on this front. A lot of the problem has been a lack of enforcement of laws which already exist specifically by corrupt government officials namely the democrats. 

I mean, aside from your personal experience meaning shit, most of this anti immigration stance can be chopped down to xenophobia and great replacement conspiracy. That's how it works with right wingers, they hide their power levels. Trust me, the further he tries to argue this point the more it will come to this. That always happens with reactionary proto-fashies.

Talk about mental gymnastics. This is just baseless accusations when you can't make an argument against mine.

We have corrupt attorney generals at state levels dropping charges on hundreds of criminals who committed violent acts of rioting including repeat offenders, antifa terrorists, and the violent parts of black lives matter. The left represent the pressures from the top and bottom against the middle, against Americans who did things the right way for generations. Crooks at the top and crooks at the bottom who then use their group privileges and drag other African Americans into their BLM cause through grifting. We should care about how our government spends its money. We should also care that we have too much illegal and legal immigration. After all we have very racist policies such as affirmative action and racial quotas which supplant equal opportunity. Universities and colleges are discriminating on race despite massive federal funding. This has to stop. Democrats want to look the other way and only some in the Trump presidency even have the balls to fight it.

Right wing terrorism is the number one terrorist threat in America. They kill the most Americans. By far. How many deaths did Antifa (which is not even an org) and BLM cause? What do you have to say about that?

This is an obvious lie and everyone knows it's a lie. BLM and Antifa are the groups burning down buildings, shouting in people's front yard, drinking people's drinks while they eat dinner, trying to reclaim criminals as innocent. The media won't report of a black male kneeling on a white baby in what was an obvious hate crime. These groups have the benefit of fake news lying to the American people, corrupt judges dropping charges or not pressing them in the first place, and corporations supporting their violent acts. What kind of damage have the proud boys actually done to this country? Meanwhile what kinds of terrorism and damage have violent antifa thugs done to this country? I would like personally like Trump to go Theodore Roosevelt on Antifa because they are the greatest threat to this country. No, right wing terrorism are not the greatest terrorist threat nor are they the one's committing crimes disproportionately. The greatest threats are from the left and from the deep state in our government (who I believe was behind the Las Vegas shooting).

The argument is that this whole story is a non-issue and that calling people cultists over that fact is just intellectual dishonesty. Even if this tax data is real there's nothing here that is illegal. However, there are real issues Americans should care about and debate. We have real problems with taxes. Maybe even some that we could agree on when it comes to corporations. Distractions and social marxist propaganda doesn't change the facts. We have to get our country back as Americans because right now we are in crisis. 

Yep. You are part of that cult. 

I'm not afraid to criticize Trump. I have in the past when there was something worth criticizing (one example being when he was going to bomb Syria). You gaslight with a meaningless comment. When someone hears the word cultist in no context they think of someone like you.



NightlyPoe said:
Machiavellian said:

Isn't this the reason why he is being audited.  The IRS wants to know if he actually is doing it legally.  The president is already being investigated for Tax fraud and a few other money crimes and those investigations are waiting for him to leave office.

Being audited by the IRS is a few steps short of being accused of tax fraud.  If it's just tax lawyers arguing over whether a line of the tax code should have applied or not, which I believe is the case, then it's a fairly mundane process.

My first statement was towards yours that said he was doing his taxes legally that is why I stated he is under audit for just that purpose.  The tax fraud cause is separate since its deals on a state level but shows that there may be criminal offense.  Also depending on the tax Audit, he could be prosecuted for tax fraud if he is not able to justify his tax documents.  The assumption you made is that Trump taxes are all done legally but we actually do not if that is true.  Also you are making assumptions that only a line is out of whack which neither of us has a clue to if that is correct.  The thing is if he is found in tax fraud on a state level, he probably will go federal as well. There is a lot still going on to make any assumption at this point in time.



FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:
OTBWY said:

A lot of talk that can be said with less. I don't want to wade through shit to get to the nugget.

Wrong. You have only proven your confirmation bias by adding your own interpretation and putting that above the facts. 

Nope. I mean, aside from him showing that he has no moral compass and a fraud, much like his cult followers have a moral compass that's ossified and or simple lack one, it's pretty clear that he's been doing a lot of fraudulent shit to enrich himself and pay as little tax as possible by noting stuff as expenses that aren't. He is doing tax evasion. Aside from that, he takes money from foreign entities. And the great part about this is, there still stuff coming in. It's not even the end of it lol.

You have no moral compass at all. You keep saying things, but you're still lying. Stop lying.

The point I was making can be made simpler without using the term deep state. Alternatively I could say our taxes are mismanaged at an extreme degree that does not benefit the taxpayers in a proportion for what is put into it by those same taxpayers. That being said the deep state is a real thing. Russia. Russia. Russia. Except Trump was never prosecuted by Mueller over Russia because they found nothing. Right now we are dealing with massive voter fraud attempts at levels we have never seen before. See: Project Veritas. Look at the Republicans that are coming out against Trump. The literal swamp like McCain's wife, ex-CIA agents, neoconservatives, let alone all of the Obama leftovers. I'm worried about real issues like this, but I feel confident Trump will fight no matter what is thrown at him. No one should be upset about this tax news because it's ridiculously overblown compared to real things going on.

You used the word deep state, and now you step back from it. Now that's weak. 

Step back from it and then I didn't. I clarified it in an easy to explain manner. If I stepped back your next paragraph wouldn't exist as a reply to something I said.


Also, they DID say that Russia interfered, you can't simply wish that away. There was a final report that concluded 3 years of investigation from a commitee that: Found that the Russian government had engaged in an "extensive campaign" to sabotage the election in favor of Trump, which included assistance from some members of Trump's own advisers.

How did Russia sabotage the election for Trump? Provide evidence. There was nothing in the investigation that would ever hold up in court or could be considered proof of anything like that happening. Which is why Trump faced no charges. The deep state created the Steele Dossier as it has not been corroborated and put Michael Flynn through a serious of witch hunts which they should be charged for. I elected Trump in Pennsylvania and the people who flipped swing states were already tired of Obama and wanted Trump because of his campaign promises. Nothing more complicated than that. No one was tricked into voting for Trump because of something Russia did.

Project Veritas is a right wing hatchet job bullshit operation by a creepy douchebag named O'Keefe that doctors and edits his footage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QNg94HZKP8

They edit videos so they are watchable and not many, many hours long compared to the source material. Debunk the following video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWK56l2VaLY


Anyway, you do believe in a deep state. And that's believing in ghosts. You believe in ghosts.

McMaster said that there is a faction of people in the White House working to undermine the President in an interview with 60 minutes. That is a scratch to the surface. I'm not going to go in depth with a peabrainlet in regards to the deep state. It's a massive wall of text undertaking, and you're completely intellectually dishonest so I would have to hope it would be worth it for the couple of other people who might end up reading my posts. I probably have and will expand upon this in other political threads anyway.

Here's just a basic article featuring what one unethical deep state agent is up to: Meet Norm Eisen

The article above is from a right wing news site, but is also heavily sourced with evidence in detail. Feel free to debunk the evidence. 

Many democrats are in power right now via congress, courts, and executive branch including the White House (some of which are Obama leftovers). Corrupt government officials are still a problem to this country no matter what level they are at so Trump being president wouldn't dissolve that. Hunter Biden's scandals are a far more concrete example of corruption than this flimsy tax return data. Considering Trump is running against Joe Biden and Hunter's actions were not isolated away from Joe it's not a whataboutism, but actual relevant counterpoints.

This is a side step. Trump is in power and this is about him and his tax evasion. Try to keep your mental gymnastics focused on Trump please.

Nope, not a side step. Biden is Trump's competition and the hypocrisy is not lost.

I replied because saying we are a cult is a blatant gaslight. This is overblowing something which might not be true and proves no illegal activity. The initial comment was not meaningful, but I shut down disruptive noise.

Nah, you replied cause I insulted you.

No, I replied because saying we are a cult is a blatant gaslight.

Where's the argument? First I'm not afraid to be called xenophobic because I'm mixed raced. More importantly the term xenophobia only exists as a subversive ad hominem for social marxists to psyop people against thinking for themselves. Nothing I said was xenophobic. It was true. Maybe try having an argument instead of resorting to social marxist gaslight attempts. It shows you are weak. Try debating stronger.

Mixed race people can't be racist? Hell, you could be part Irish or Italian. I don't care. You support a xenophobe and that kind of makes it easy to conclude it as such. Easy.

Also *social maxist gaslight attempts* *psyop* Fucking kek.

Using xenophobe ad hominem as an argument is a blatant social marxist gaslight tactics. You made no points. Simple as.


Truth is I have worked directly with legal and illegal immigrants for many years and looked into the leftist talking points and their studies regarding the subject. In personal experience I've seen some migrants get paid under the table so they will still receive welfare and other benefits (while getting the maximum amount on the books masking the illegality of the situation). Meaning they get some amount of money on the books so they qualify for free healthcare or tax refunds, but getting anything over that amount in cash. I've also seen some co-workers brazen enough to brag about crimes they got away with including drunk driving or reckless behavior (one instance was a young co-worker about 17/18 who thought it was funny he was riding bike across lanes against oncoming traffic and getting out of the way last minute). These are crimes where they put other people's lives at risk and they are proud they get off the hook because of guilt tripping a judge or cop about their family or keeping their job. This is how they explained they got out of it. Removing my personal anecdotes from the situation we can look at bogus claims from journalists. We are told there is only maybe 10, 12, 15 million illegal aliens. That number has been around and used by the left for decades. They want us to believe the number has never gone up. Truth is there has to be something like 25-50 million illegal aliens in addition to countless anchor babies abusing a loophole which was never designed for that purpose. When it comes to the money they add to the economy they take almost all of it back themselves through welfare and a lot of it even leaves the country. The American workers they supplant are not benefiting in any way, but instead seeing lower wages due to artificial competition. The only American people who see any benefit from these workers are the business owners and the corporations. Trump has made improvements on this front. A lot of the problem has been a lack of enforcement of laws which already exist specifically by corrupt government officials namely the democrats. 

I mean, aside from your personal experience meaning shit, most of this anti immigration stance can be chopped down to xenophobia and great replacement conspiracy. That's how it works with right wingers, they hide their power levels. Trust me, the further he tries to argue this point the more it will come to this. That always happens with reactionary proto-fashies.

Talk about mental gymnastics. This is just baseless accusations when you can't make an argument against mine.

We have corrupt attorney generals at state levels dropping charges on hundreds of criminals who committed violent acts of rioting including repeat offenders, antifa terrorists, and the violent parts of black lives matter. The left represent the pressures from the top and bottom against the middle, against Americans who did things the right way for generations. Crooks at the top and crooks at the bottom who then use their group privileges and drag other African Americans into their BLM cause through grifting. We should care about how our government spends its money. We should also care that we have too much illegal and legal immigration. After all we have very racist policies such as affirmative action and racial quotas which supplant equal opportunity. Universities and colleges are discriminating on race despite massive federal funding. This has to stop. Democrats want to look the other way and only some in the Trump presidency even have the balls to fight it.

Right wing terrorism is the number one terrorist threat in America. They kill the most Americans. By far. How many deaths did Antifa (which is not even an org) and BLM cause? What do you have to say about that?

This is an obvious lie and everyone knows it's a lie. BLM and Antifa are the groups burning down buildings, shouting in people's front yard, drinking people's drinks while they eat dinner, trying to reclaim criminals as innocent. The media won't report of a black male kneeling on a white baby in what was an obvious hate crime. These groups have the benefit of fake news lying to the American people, corrupt judges dropping charges or not pressing them in the first place, and corporations supporting their violent acts. What kind of damage have the proud boys actually done to this country? Meanwhile what kinds of terrorism and damage have violent antifa thugs done to this country? I would like personally like Trump to go Theodore Roosevelt on Antifa because they are the greatest threat to this country. No, right wing terrorism are not the greatest terrorist threat nor are they the one's committing crimes disproportionately. The greatest threats are from the left and from the deep state in our government (who I believe was behind the Las Vegas shooting).

The argument is that this whole story is a non-issue and that calling people cultists over that fact is just intellectual dishonesty. Even if this tax data is real there's nothing here that is illegal. However, there are real issues Americans should care about and debate. We have real problems with taxes. Maybe even some that we could agree on when it comes to corporations. Distractions and social marxist propaganda doesn't change the facts. We have to get our country back as Americans because right now we are in crisis. 

Yep. You are part of that cult. 

I'm not afraid to criticize Trump. I have in the past when there was something worth criticizing (one example being when he was going to bomb Syria). You gaslight with a meaningless comment. When someone hears the word cultist in no context they think of someone like you.

Yeah i'm not going to respond to this giant mess full of right wing fashy propaganda, defending project veritas and throwing out 13 50 that's easily debunked. It will never stop. So instead I will address others reading this shit. Don't give a liar more time. The right in the US is a death cult and I hope Trump loses for everyones sake, so we can rid ourselves from nutjobs with racist proto-fascist propaganda and ideas that will lead to death.