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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Microsoft Has Put Themselves Back In The Game!

Runa216 said:
JWeinCom said:

Oy. This was clearly not going anywhere when I posted this 4 days ago and it still hasn't gone anywhere. 

Both sides have said their piece, and it doesn't seem like anything's changing. So time to move on. If Runa, Sales, or anyone else involved in this conversation want to continue, PMs. Just to be clear, probably going to start thread banning otherwise.



More on topic, (maybe) since people brought up Wasteland, I had a quick question about it. I really enjoyed Mario/Rabbids, and started playing Wasteland 3. But... I have mixed feelings. The post apocalypse vibe and humans going crazy and murdering each other is generally not what I like in a game. Which I guess is why I liked Mario/Rabbids more colorful approach to tactical shooting. Killing humans (at least when it's portrayed realistically) is generally a turn off to me in games.

So... is the gameplay worth it on its own if I'm not going to get fully into the story? Am I going to be constantly watching my party die gruesome deaths? Am I better off with something like X-Com?

This post wasn't here when I started my post. I'll leave it be. I really haven't had anything new to say for a few days, anyway. I just keep seeing the same cyclical, poorly-thought-out arguments. Bah, sorry. I'm out unless new information is brought to the table. 

Bruh how do you consistently throw these kinda statements out and miss the irony? 



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smroadkill15 said:
Runa216 said:

No, they really haven't, because of the second bolded part. The games aren't out yet. Some people expected Crackdown to be great, some people expected Sea of thieves to be great, some people expected Days Gone to be great, some people expected No Man's Sky to be great. Until the games are out, all the promises in the world mean nothing at all. Until the games are actually out, it's all hear-say, hope, and goodwill. They have no goodwill from me because, as I've stated dozens of times in this thread and others, they have not done anything to impress me over the past 10 years or so. 

Them buying all these companies is great, sure. It sounds good on paper, but time and time again they prove they can't create or maintain things. Hell, Halo was made by Bungie and was in development before Microsoft bought them out, then as soon as Bungie was gone the quality dipped. Bungie makes great Halo games, not Microsoft. Gears was Epic Games, not a Microsoft studio. It was essentially third party, and parts 4 and 5 have not been all that well recieved compared to the first three. Rare is a company I don't have to repeat since they've only done one worthwhile game in the past 10 years and that game was trashed at launch and took years to not completely suck. Nothing tells me that ANY of these promises matter. 

You can't just say 'they're doing everything right' without any actual data and numbers to back it up. They've messed up thoroughly and consistently over the past 10 years, and until they prove me and many others wrong, all their promises are empty. Until they actually start releasing games, all they have is goodwill from folks like you. They're doing the opposite of crying wolf. They keep declaring all manner of success and intent and not delivering; eventually, people gotta see through the smokescreen to see there's just a block of dry ice and no substance. It's all smoke and mirrors, no substance. Until proven, it's all hot air.

These are the 1st party games released this year. It's a pretty good year overall with really Bleeding Edge being the only mediocre title. Am I saying they have the best 1st party games this year? No, I would not say that, but it's not anything less than really good, with some titles be excellent. Then looking into next year and beyond, it's only going to get better. I'm not sure how anyone can think otherwise. I understand that you want to see them deliver quality games consistently, but I don't see how they couldn't with the 23 studios they have now, most being top-tier developers. 

Good games exclusive to Xbox and PC...

Gears Tactics
Tell Me Why
Microsoft Flight Simulator
Ori (Also on Switch)

Good, but PC only...

Age of Empires III

Still in early access...

Grounded

Also on PS4...

Minecraft Dungeons
Wasteland 3

Utter crap...

Battletoads
Bleeding Edge

GaaS Nonsense...

Halo Infinite

Actually looks good...

Avowed
Hellblade 2
Psychonauts 2

Probably PC Only...

Age of Empires 4

Yet Another Racing Game...

Forza

Could be good...

Fable
Everwild


Almost guaranteed to be crap...

State of Decay 3

But please keep pretending that everyone of these games is both amazing and exclusive to Xbox and PC. For real though dude. If you had come out with a reasonable list consisting of Fable, Everwild, Psychonaughts 2, Avowed, Hellblade 2, Gears Tactics, Tell Me Why, and MS Flight Sim your argument would have been a lot better. Throwing everything and the kitchen sink into your list just makes you look like a rube with no taste, or somebody that wants to ignore where these games are playable.

It's this sort of "Lets ignore the facts" marketing that I hate about MS. It has all the accuracy and nuance of a Republican attack ad.

Last edited by Cerebralbore101 - on 05 October 2020

ice said:
Runa216 said:

This post wasn't here when I started my post. I'll leave it be. I really haven't had anything new to say for a few days, anyway. I just keep seeing the same cyclical, poorly-thought-out arguments. Bah, sorry. I'm out unless new information is brought to the table. 

Bruh how do you consistently throw these kinda statements out and miss the irony? 

Right? Everyone has their opinion on games/consoles they like or dislike which is fine, but the problem is, he takes his elitist opinion as fact and anyone who disagrees with it is wrong and he needs to prove a point or something. Then when you bring up a game that is critically acclaimed ie Gears Tactics, Ori 2, Wasteland 3, etc. it's not as beloved, doesn't have lasting impact, or whatever made up criteria he can think of. 



ice said:
Runa216 said:

This post wasn't here when I started my post. I'll leave it be. I really haven't had anything new to say for a few days, anyway. I just keep seeing the same cyclical, poorly-thought-out arguments. Bah, sorry. I'm out unless new information is brought to the table. 

Bruh how do you consistently throw these kinda statements out and miss the irony? 

Seriously. Time to move on. You want to keep going in circles with Runa, PM them. 



RolStoppable said:
Runa216 said:
Has anyone stopped to think that maybe I'm saying the same thing over and over again because it's true and a realistic representation of the situation? If Xbox was doing great, it wouldn't be losing to the PS4 and Switch like 5:1 and 10:1 on a weekly basis. I'm part of the majority here, I'm just also the only one talking about it.

(...)

But whatever. You guys keep getting mad at me for being a realist. Call me cynical, treat me as the bad guy. sure, whatever. Not my fault you can't handle criticism. I've repeated myself because I feel the need to explain my very reasonable, rational position as something NOT just coming from a place of hate or bias but from analysis of existing data. but sure, anything you don't like is some deep-rooted campaign of hate.

Virtually everyone has probably thought about that. This week's poll is strongly trending in the direction that you are clearly in the minority:

https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread/243506/your-lifetime-sales-expectations-for-xbox-series-xs/1/

The majority expects Microsoft's new console to sell at least 10m better than the Xbox One, so that's widespread agreement on an upwards trend for Microsoft.

Your post here also highlights the major flaw in your analysis: You are entirely focused on current weekly sales and base your conclusions on them. This same kind of error was committed by a large chunk of VGC users when it came to evaluating Switch's prospects; because the Wii U sold badly (much worse than the Xbox One), a lot of people concluded that the following generation would be even worse for Nintendo. But that's not how it works for video game console generations. One must look much more at the actions of a manufacturer that are done in preparation for a new generation than at the sales performance of the current generation, and what Microsoft has been doing with the Xbox Series X|S is a lot more competent than what they had done with the Xbox One leading up to its launch.

That's why Microsoft has put themselves back in the game. It's a foregone conclusion that Microsoft won't win this generation either, but that's not what this thread is about. It's about being a lot more competitive than what they've been in the past seven years. And they are.

I've seen the moderator's post, but I'd be surprised if suddenly VGC prohibited on-topic discussion just because it might not go anywhere. I've brought new information to the table, namely that you, Runa, are definitely not part of the majority on this site, but rather the exact opposite is the case and that would be why you are the only one taking that side in this discussion. It's not because others who think alike chose to be silent, it's because those others don't exist.

Not suddenly. It's happened to me several times in the past. 

By all means discuss what you think about Microsoft's first party lineup. In fact, I encourage you to do so, and 90% of what you said was fine. But no need to keep addressing it to Runa. Leave it open. Try to get new people in on the conversation.



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JWeinCom said:
ice said:

Bruh how do you consistently throw these kinda statements out and miss the irony? 

Seriously. Time to move on. You want to keep going in circles with Runa, PM them. 

Nah but Runa can claim he didn’t see your post and continue to take jabs at people. That’s how you win an argument tho amirite? Just sayin 



I don't really see what Runa has done wrong in this thread. Disagreeing with people isn't a crime.



Cerebralbore101 said:


But please keep pretending that everyone of these games is both amazing and exclusive to Xbox/PC. For real though dude. If you had come out with a reasonable list consisting of Fable, Everwild, Psychonaughts 2, Avowed, Hellblade 2, Gears Tactics, Tell Me Why, and MS Flight Sim your argument would have been a lot better. Throwing everything and the kitchen sink into your list just makes you look like a rube with no taste, or somebody that wants to ignore where these games are playable.

I never said every game Xbox has coming out is amazing. I didn't say 2020 was amazing. There will be duds here and there, but the whole point of that post was to prove Xbox is making the right moves going into next gen, and this year was a taste of what's to come.



Runa216 said:
Has anyone stopped to think that maybe I'm saying the same thing over and over again because it's true and a realistic representation of the situation?

Hmm......

hmmm .....

wait actually ... 

Yeah, no. 



ice said:
JWeinCom said:

Seriously. Time to move on. You want to keep going in circles with Runa, PM them. 

Nah but Runa can claim he didn’t see your post and continue to take jabs at people. That’s how you win an argument tho amirite? Just sayin 

They posted two minutes after my post. Based on the timing and length of the post I think the claim checks out. Runa's actions are theirs, yours are yours, and we're looking at both. Got questions about how mods are doing things in general or me in particular, PM me, or CGI. Same to anyone else. The topic was quickly becoming centered upon one user's behavior. Trying to focus it back on the topic. 

As someone who's played none of Microsoft's first party games but just got Gamepass, what do you recommend?

RolStoppable said:
JWeinCom said:

Seriously. Time to move on. You want to keep going in circles with Runa, PM them. 

To directly answer your image: You are on track to get there.

I mean, it was only this past weekend that the US Election thread went through a very similar constellation and you didn't settle it by calling it a tie. Instead the disruptive force got thread-banned for disrespectful discourse and repeated willful ignorance. It's a bit puzzling that this thread is handled differently, especially because of August's message to the Xbox community by the head mod that moderation in Xbox topics is supposed to get better.

Why would the Xbox community have to settle for a tie here when pretty much all the reasonable arguments clearly favor them? Your approach here is essentially robbing them of a win, spicing it up by holding up a shield for Runa.

Yes, this post will inevitably come across as needlessly combative, but stay focused and think about the US Election thread and this one. Ask yourself if you are applying consistency to your moderation. I like you as a moderator because you remain very active as a poster and try to keep discussions under control before things begin to escalate too much, but in this instance here you are clearly performing below your average.

As you know, I'm always happy to discuss my actions, just not in threads. So you can PM me. Not 100% sure on what you're referring to in that thread, but if it's what I think it is, I think the situation's very different, and warrants handling it differently. And also, I'm not the only one involved in monitoring this topic, or the US Presidential Thread. Both times, there is input from several people, and how to best handle this is being discussed now. So, it's not just my decision, and I don't have the luxury to do what I want when I want.

As for the on topic part... I don't think I'm declaring this a tie, or robbing people of a win. I can do things as a mod, but declaring winners in an argument is not one of them. I'm not sure what a win in this context would mean. Winning requires a judge or one side to admit they're wrong. We don't have a judge, and after about a week or so, I don't think Runa is changing their stance. I don't know what kind of win you were hoping for, but I don't think it was going to happen. I think it's pretty clear that the majority of the people in this thread disagreed and thought their arguments were pretty bad. You can add me to that list. As I see it, there was already a clear victor. Sometimes on the internet, all you could do is leave satisfied that you made your point. 

Last edited by JWeinCom - on 05 October 2020