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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Phil Spencer Says Xbox Series X Games Aren't Being Held Back By Xbox One

LudicrousSpeed on 14 July 2020

Yeah you’re only proving my point. Also you already debunked yourself when it comes to Second Son FUD.



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Conina on 14 July 2020
goopy20 said:

Call me crazy but to me a generational leap isn't just a bump in graphics settings, framerate and resolution. It's about whole new experiences and immersion thanks to a leap in geometry, level design, ai, physics etc that wouldn't be possible on 7-year-old hardware. And the difference typically looks something like this.

Cheating with screenshots again?

Didn't know that Infamous 2 only was a 338p game.



DonFerrari on 14 July 2020
chakkra said:
DonFerrari said:

I find it very unlikely that the DLSS2 or any other technique upscaling an 720p image can look better than the same image in native resolution of 1080p or higher. Or do you mean having your system running to the limit to generate a 720p instead of a 1080p and then with the upscalling your result be better?

Still MS already have machine learning and similar technique, plus Sony have been using temporary reconstruction (not that much different) for a lot of PS4Pro titles.

The upscaling technique isn't superior to native, it is less hw expensive though. And with that power can be used to improve other aspects of image quality.

Actually, several tech journalists have been saying that DLSS 2.0 actually improves image quality when compared to native 4K. Like here for example: (go to 19:17)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggnvhFSrPGE

Will do a wait and see for the comparison being at the lower res image also having the other effects compatible or if the saved resources were used elsewhere.

I know that DF recently put a video of SM running 60fps with some advanced techniques and also showed some other games and they were full of artifacts.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

goopy20 on 14 July 2020
Conina said:
goopy20 said:

Call me crazy but to me a generational leap isn't just a bump in graphics settings, framerate and resolution. It's about whole new experiences and immersion thanks to a leap in geometry, level design, ai, physics etc that wouldn't be possible on 7-year-old hardware. And the difference typically looks something like this.

Cheating with screenshots again?

Didn't know that Infamous 2 only was a 338p game.

Resolution doesn't make much difference but here you go. 

Look guys we all know what a generational leap means when new consoles come out. We've seen it with every single console generations and I'm expecting to see it again next gen. Just 4k, 60fps and some higher graphics settings isn't that, though. We all know this so why would you defend all that nonsense that's coming out of Phil's mouth?



LudicrousSpeed on 14 July 2020

We sure do. And games like Ratchet, Hellblade, and Bright Memory looked like a generational jump to me.



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Conina on 14 July 2020
goopy20 said:

If you think this is a big enough upgrade to call it a generational leap, then fine. But to me you're still getting the same levels, npc's, physics and overall game experience on a 12Tflops RTX2080 as on a 1,3Tflops Series S.

A cut scene close-up of a game where even the slower hardware manages 4K... yeh, a perfect example!

Also the differences between lowest and highest can be quite big, even without changing the resolution.

Here is Tomb Raider Legend, both the PC version in 720p:



goopy20 on 14 July 2020
LudicrousSpeed said:
We sure do. And games like Ratchet, Hellblade, and Bright Memory looked like a generational jump to me.

We haven't seen Hellblade yet, so that one is hard to judge. Not sure why you would mention it, but yes Ratchet & Clank does look next gen. However, Bright Memory and anything else MS has shown so far aren't exactly games that'll push a RTX2080 to its limits. That's not my opinion, we can simply tell by looking at the requirements of the pc versions.

Its exactly like I been saying. MS is isn't about just the Series X and pushing its capabilities, they want everyone to be able to play their games. Which means pc gamers with low/average specs too. I didn't check them all but Scorn and Bright Memory are already listed on Steam and have something like a GTX660 as the minimum and a GTX970 as recommended requirements and there's no mention at all about SSD. 

https://store.steampowered.com/app/955050/Bright_Memory/

https://store.steampowered.com/app/698670/Scorn/



DonFerrari on 14 July 2020
zero129 said:
goopy20 said:

I dunno man. I honestly think you believe Infamous 2 on the ps3 would look like Infamous SS on the ps4 if they just dialed a graphics slider

If it was build for PS4 and scaled down like say Halo Inf is being done with Series x to XBONE. Then yes it could just like the Witcher image i showed you that you now seem to be ignoring but here once again here is even a bigger jump then Inf2 to second son

How the hell did they port the game to Xbox Original? xD.

Point being the is nothing in second son that couldnt of been scaled back to the ps3 as them witcher screens shots show.

If you want to strip everything from a game and call that "possible" then every game could be made to run on PS2, even if you then had to also accept loading screens where there wasn't one.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

goopy20 on 14 July 2020
zero129 said:
goopy20 said:

Because Epic wouldn't dare to show that demo running on a iphone in the first place. People would say the engine looks horrible and/or the iphone can't do graphics. So if Epic wanted to show off their engine and promote both the ps5 and the iphone at the same time, they would have had to take a middle ground where the demo would look good on both platforms.

It basically would have been a different demo entirely and on ps5 it would have looked a lot less impressive than what they've actually shown us, even if it would run at 8k and 2000fps. 

Dont be changing the goal post. You said yourself Epic could scale that demo to an Iphone (And they could) but it would look like shit.

So how would them having that demo running on say XB Lockhart at 1080P or 1440P using ms version of DLSS effect you in anyway?.

What will effect you clearly is if MS can release Series S for the 199-249 price range and by using their version of dlss have 3rd party games looking just as good as their ps5 and series x versions as we all know what parents low income gamers etc will go for.

Its like MS positioned them selfs perfect for this with Gamepass, Cross play now finally being a thing etc.

Means little johnny who wants to play the next exclusive gta or call of duty with his friends but his mom cant afford 449-499 ps5 but could afford a 199-249 series s will now be able to get in on the action. Add Gamepass and his got an instant library of 100's of new and classic games.

Because like I said, they wouldn't make that tech demo to begin with. They would make another demo that wouldn't look like shit on Lockhart, and Series X would just get an upscaled version of that. 

Think about it man. Its 4 vs 12Tflops... don't you think they could do a lot more with 12 Tflops if they targeted the same resolution? Sony could make a 30fps/1440p ps5 exclusive where all them Tflops can be used for overall fidelity and world building, while Series X practically has to do 4k/60fps else it won't work on Lockhart. If you don't see how that will hold Series X back then I don't know what to tell ya.



goopy20 on 14 July 2020
zero129 said:
goopy20 said:

I dunno man. I honestly think you believe Infamous 2 on the ps3 would look like Infamous SS on the ps4 if they just dialed a graphics slider

If it was build for PS4 and scaled down like say Halo Inf is being done with Series x to XBONE. Then yes it could just like the Witcher image i showed you that you now seem to be ignoring but here once again here is even a bigger jump then Inf2 to second son

How the hell did they port the game to Xbox Original? xD.

Point being the is nothing in second son that couldnt of been scaled back to the ps3 as them witcher screens shots show.

Sure buddy. How about porting Witcher 3 over to the Nokia 3000 with zero graphics?! It would just have a black screen with sound effects and they'd call it Witcher 3, the visually impaired edition. Anything is possible with your logic.