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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Xbox Series X: The Most Powerful and Compatible Next Gen System

Captain_Yuri said:
Dante9 said:
The most powerful system ever to be held back by its previous gen counterparts.

BC is the pitch of the man who has no confidence in bringing new and exciting games.

So... Since the Ps5 is also getting BC... Does this mean that Nintendo is the only company that has any confidence?

Well, the WiiU had full BC, failed. Switch ditched BC, running away success :p



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SvennoJ said:

Oddly, I notice the lod changes and rough textures a lot more on the XBox One X side. But true, zoomed in, sitting 2 feet away from my laptop pixel screen, it's a big difference. I never thought RDR looked bad on a 1080p projector hanging back on my couch. It's like cleaning up the movie grain and changing the fps of movies to 120hz with interpolation to turn in into a more stable picture, yet not looking balanced anymore.

It's great to have but why spend so much time on it. Doesn't BC on XBox require a recompile of all games which get downloaded when you insert the old disc? Lot of effort for a feature few use and doesn't give you any guarantees that it will keep working (relying on servers again)

I still have my old ps3 hooked up, not for games, it's a great blu-ray player! I always have the intention to play the games I missed (or left unopened on the shelf) at the start of a new gen. Never get to it lol.

Microsoft doesn't have the source code for most games, so they aren't recompiling.

Rather... They are using a mix of approaches like emulation, repackaging, binary translation, virtualization and abstraction, hence why they can emulate Xbox 360 games on such anemic jaguar CPU cores when a PC needs a Ryzen class CPU.

The Xbox One hardware also features support for things like the Xbox 360 texture format standards, which shows that Microsoft was planning Backwards compat before the Xbox One launched.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

SvennoJ said:

It's great to have but why spend so much time on it. Doesn't BC on XBox require a recompile of all games which get downloaded when you insert the old disc? Lot of effort for a feature few use and doesn't give you any guarantees that it will keep working (relying on servers again)

No, MS doesn't have the source code for non-first party games so there is no recompilation possible. The disc insert is basically a copyright move and fires a few component downloads if they are needed. Components would be the X360 os rewritten for X64 (MS does have the source for both of those, obviously), an abstraction layer that translates all x360 os calls to XBox1 os calls, an abstraction layer that expands the os calls (improve visuals if possible), and last but not least a crossassembly of the entire x360 game code. Most of those things can be done automatically, while a small part (which takes the brunt of manual labour and time) has to be done manually for each game. As self-modifying code is forbidden on consoles, the chances are high that your final product will actually work once all the "minefields" are cleared and there are no copyright problems lurking.



SvennoJ said:
Captain_Yuri said:

So... Since the Ps5 is also getting BC... Does this mean that Nintendo is the only company that has any confidence?

Well, the WiiU had full BC, failed. Switch ditched BC, running away success :p

Wow you may have just found the secret sauce to winning a generation!



                  

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Pemalite said:

Microsoft doesn't have the source code for most games, so they aren't recompiling.

Rather... They are using a mix of approaches like emulation, repackaging, binary translation, virtualization and abstraction, hence why they can emulate Xbox 360 games on such anemic jaguar CPU cores when a PC needs a Ryzen class CPU.

The Xbox One hardware also features support for things like the Xbox 360 texture format standards, which shows that Microsoft was planning Backwards compat before the Xbox One launched.

Semantics, recompiling the binary source. Anyway, sounds like a lot of work and effort for a little used function.

It doesn't matter in the end. I doubt the same people working on BC would have been pumping out AAA exclusives instead. It's a great feature, just not one that gets me excited for a new generation. It's really only good for the first year drought, focusing on eliminating that would be better imo.



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SvennoJ said:
Captain_Yuri said:

So... Since the Ps5 is also getting BC... Does this mean that Nintendo is the only company that has any confidence?

Well, the WiiU had full BC, failed. Switch ditched BC, running away success :p

We have 10 or more evidence that BC doesn't gives significant extra sales, and 0 evidence that it does. But for some reason we have to believe it will.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

SvennoJ said:
Pemalite said:

Microsoft doesn't have the source code for most games, so they aren't recompiling.

Rather... They are using a mix of approaches like emulation, repackaging, binary translation, virtualization and abstraction, hence why they can emulate Xbox 360 games on such anemic jaguar CPU cores when a PC needs a Ryzen class CPU.

The Xbox One hardware also features support for things like the Xbox 360 texture format standards, which shows that Microsoft was planning Backwards compat before the Xbox One launched.

Semantics, recompiling the binary source. Anyway, sounds like a lot of work and effort for a little used function.

It doesn't matter in the end. I doubt the same people working on BC would have been pumping out AAA exclusives instead. It's a great feature, just not one that gets me excited for a new generation. It's really only good for the first year drought, focusing on eliminating that would be better imo.

I know that if I were to pay 500 USD on a new console to play the games I already can on my system I would rather save that money and also wait for a pricecut and new games I'm interested in the new system.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
SvennoJ said:

Well, the WiiU had full BC, failed. Switch ditched BC, running away success :p

We have 10 or more evidence that BC doesn't gives significant extra sales, and 0 evidence that it does. But for some reason we have to believe it will.

it probably doesn't provide sales but it is a service, you know things that benefit the buyer? probably not



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

Join the Prediction League http://www.vgchartz.com/predictions

Instead of seeking to convince others, we can be open to changing our own minds, and seek out information that contradicts our own steadfast point of view. Maybe it’ll turn out that those who disagree with you actually have a solid grasp of the facts. There’s a slight possibility that, after all, you’re the one who’s wrong.

kirby007 said:
DonFerrari said:

We have 10 or more evidence that BC doesn't gives significant extra sales, and 0 evidence that it does. But for some reason we have to believe it will.

it probably doesn't provide sales but it is a service, you know things that benefit the buyer? probably not

Snore.... Have already praised the service and that XSX seems to have a much better implementation than PS5 still that doesn't invalidate the claim of sales impact.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
SvennoJ said:

Semantics, recompiling the binary source. Anyway, sounds like a lot of work and effort for a little used function.

It doesn't matter in the end. I doubt the same people working on BC would have been pumping out AAA exclusives instead. It's a great feature, just not one that gets me excited for a new generation. It's really only good for the first year drought, focusing on eliminating that would be better imo.

I know that if I were to pay 500 USD on a new console to play the games I already can on my system I would rather save that money and also wait for a pricecut and new games I'm interested in the new system.

But PSVR with ultra short loading screens!!! Can't wait to plug my PSVR into the ps5 and insta play my digital PSVR library :)
Looking at my gaming habits, loading times are a huge part of what game I will chose to play. I hate waiting, especially with a headset on.

Of course I'm much more excited about new VR games made for ps5 and psvr 2.0, but I doubt we'll see (m)any first year(s).