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Forums - Sony - Unreal Engine 5 Announced + PS5 Demo

Zoombael said:
Machiavellian said:

What is being disputed by Tim quote.  Is it that they played the demo as a video or that they ran the demo on a Laptop PC and produced the results they stated.  Also this doesn't look like some random engineer but someone who was doing a demonstration of the UE5 tech and explaining to the the crowd what type of hardware can be used to run the same demo with results.  I did not see or here Tim disputing the translation only the playing of the demo.

?

To clarify. I don't really doubt the UE5 demo would run on high end pc hardware. But it is a new graphics engine, first time demonstration on new next gen console hardware. This premise on itself should make people curious how equivalent hardware would fair. To the minute detail. Where the FPS constant? Was RT active? Other things? But here we are, people who weigh vague words the same as a watchable real time demo. 

Hey, actually, i got the demo on my computer, and i run it at 1080p25FPS. Facts.

The reason I asking the question I am is that first this is a Epic employee demonstrating the UE5 demo.  Just because he is in China doesn't automatically make him some offhand engineer talking above his pay grade.  If anything, if they are demoing the UE5 engine, then they would have access to run it on any machine they want.  I did not see anything from Tim disputing those points so when I see people dismissing what the presenter stated, I wonder if they are keeping an open mind.  There is no reason for the presenter to lie in this scenario since it would not benefit Epic at all.  Also I believe China focus would be more PC base so giving the audience a more real world understanding of the performance of today's hard within UE5 would be their main purpose.

For PC gamers, this sounds great as they may not have to purchase another SSD and can keep their current highend Graphics cards.  



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Machiavellian said:
DonFerrari said:

But a deal that the demo they were working together with Sony to be in the hand of another team using it on notebook at the same time and using that to take jabs at Sony?

Why would you believe that Epic and Sony had a legal deal.  Meaning that something on the level of a paid deal.  Just because Epic US showed the demo running on the PS5 doesn't mean other regions have the same goal.  The real goal of UE5 demo period is to sell UE5 to developers.  In China, demoing on the PS5 probably isn't a selling point but doing so on a PC is.  Evidently the demo can be run on PC and Probably XSX but that was not the aim of US Epic.

See what drkohler said. Sometimes it impress me that people on VGC seem to have 0 experience on corporate life.

drkohler said:
Machiavellian said:

Why would you believe that Epic and Sony had a legal deal? 

Of course there is a legal deal involved. Actually more than one, at least three.

First one: Sony engineers are forbidden to talk what they are working on to outsiders

Second one: Epic engineers are are forbidden to talk what they are working on to outsiders.

Third one: (this one usually is pretty complex) Neither Sony nor Epic engineers working on this project are allowed to talk about "other stuff" outside of the project.

(From my own experience working in cross-company projects).

Same thing on my company, to protect company IP you have very heavy deals on it, including as you said if you are working on a project involving Sony you aren't to spread information or have access to information from MS side or even talk about it with anyone outside the team and that if you have received information outside of what you have access you have to disclose to the legal team to take actions. So anyone that do leaks are breaking heavy contracts and if discovered could get big fines.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Machiavellian said:
Zoombael said:

?

To clarify. I don't really doubt the UE5 demo would run on high end pc hardware. But it is a new graphics engine, first time demonstration on new next gen console hardware. This premise on itself should make people curious how equivalent hardware would fair. To the minute detail. Where the FPS constant? Was RT active? Other things? But here we are, people who weigh vague words the same as a watchable real time demo. 

Hey, actually, i got the demo on my computer, and i run it at 1080p25FPS. Facts.

The reason I asking the question I am is that first this is a Epic employee demonstrating the UE5 demo.  Just because he is in China doesn't automatically make him some offhand engineer talking above his pay grade.  If anything, if they are demoing the UE5 engine, then they would have access to run it on any machine they want.  I did not see anything from Tim disputing those points so when I see people dismissing what the presenter stated, I wonder if they are keeping an open mind.  There is no reason for the presenter to lie in this scenario since it would not benefit Epic at all.  Also I believe China focus would be more PC base so giving the audience a more real world understanding of the performance of today's hard within UE5 would be their main purpose.

For PC gamers, this sounds great as they may not have to purchase another SSD and can keep their current highend Graphics cards.  

You are missing the point entirely, no one is questioning whether the UE5 engine will be scalable and run across multiple platforms. They even mentioned cell phones would be able to run a version of it. So, can it be run on PC, etc? Yes! Will it run the same as it did on PS5? No! Why? The SSD and massive I/O speeds they have access to stream such high resolution assets which can't be done on other hardware.

The only relevant point here is that some people extrapolated the video running off some laptop in China, to that meaning the demo was running off of that laptop. Even more, using that as a proof it was somehow running better than on the PS5, when Tim Sweeney confirmed it was the video of the PS5 output :D. That's just priceless in of itself.

And yeah, for PC games, surely we'll need to forget running certain games off the HDD, they simply will not be playable there if they are made to take advantage of what we've seen on the UE5 demo. PC gpus are definitely not going to be the bottleneck in any way shape or form, the I/O will be.



DonFerrari said:
Machiavellian said:

Why would you believe that Epic and Sony had a legal deal.  Meaning that something on the level of a paid deal.  Just because Epic US showed the demo running on the PS5 doesn't mean other regions have the same goal.  The real goal of UE5 demo period is to sell UE5 to developers.  In China, demoing on the PS5 probably isn't a selling point but doing so on a PC is.  Evidently the demo can be run on PC and Probably XSX but that was not the aim of US Epic.

See what drkohler said. Sometimes it impress me that people on VGC seem to have 0 experience on corporate life.

drkohler said:

Of course there is a legal deal involved. Actually more than one, at least three.

First one: Sony engineers are forbidden to talk what they are working on to outsiders

Second one: Epic engineers are are forbidden to talk what they are working on to outsiders.

Third one: (this one usually is pretty complex) Neither Sony nor Epic engineers working on this project are allowed to talk about "other stuff" outside of the project.

(From my own experience working in cross-company projects).

Same thing on my company, to protect company IP you have very heavy deals on it, including as you said if you are working on a project involving Sony you aren't to spread information or have access to information from MS side or even talk about it with anyone outside the team and that if you have received information outside of what you have access you have to disclose to the legal team to take actions. So anyone that do leaks are breaking heavy contracts and if discovered could get big fines.

The key is that we have absolutely no ideal of any agreement and can really only speculate. Even if there is an agreement, we have no ideal the terms and if its big or small.  The only thing we have is 2 separate presentations.  



setsunatenshi said:
Machiavellian said:

The reason I asking the question I am is that first this is a Epic employee demonstrating the UE5 demo.  Just because he is in China doesn't automatically make him some offhand engineer talking above his pay grade.  If anything, if they are demoing the UE5 engine, then they would have access to run it on any machine they want.  I did not see anything from Tim disputing those points so when I see people dismissing what the presenter stated, I wonder if they are keeping an open mind.  There is no reason for the presenter to lie in this scenario since it would not benefit Epic at all.  Also I believe China focus would be more PC base so giving the audience a more real world understanding of the performance of today's hard within UE5 would be their main purpose.

For PC gamers, this sounds great as they may not have to purchase another SSD and can keep their current highend Graphics cards.  

You are missing the point entirely, no one is questioning whether the UE5 engine will be scalable and run across multiple platforms. They even mentioned cell phones would be able to run a version of it. So, can it be run on PC, etc? Yes! Will it run the same as it did on PS5? No! Why? The SSD and massive I/O speeds they have access to stream such high resolution assets which can't be done on other hardware.

The only relevant point here is that some people extrapolated the video running off some laptop in China, to that meaning the demo was running off of that laptop. Even more, using that as a proof it was somehow running better than on the PS5, when Tim Sweeney confirmed it was the video of the PS5 output :D. That's just priceless in of itself.

And yeah, for PC games, surely we'll need to forget running certain games off the HDD, they simply will not be playable there if they are made to take advantage of what we've seen on the UE5 demo. PC gpus are definitely not going to be the bottleneck in any way shape or form, the I/O will be.

Actually I am not missing the point at all.  The presenter interpretations stated it can run just fine without the PS5 GOD tier SSD.  As I asked earlier, are we questioning the statement made by the presenter who works for Epic or just the playback of the demo.

As to your second paragraph, that tweet from Tim only seem to point to the presentation of the demo shone not the words from the presenter translations.  There isn't enough info in that tweet to infer anything beyond that.  

I actually doubt the I/O will be a big problem for PCs because an increase in RAM would be a better solution.  THe key for consoles is that they have limited ram, no expandability and thus fixed which means they are more dependent on SDD solution then a PC probably 3 years from now.



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Machiavellian said:
setsunatenshi said:

You are missing the point entirely, no one is questioning whether the UE5 engine will be scalable and run across multiple platforms. They even mentioned cell phones would be able to run a version of it. So, can it be run on PC, etc? Yes! Will it run the same as it did on PS5? No! Why? The SSD and massive I/O speeds they have access to stream such high resolution assets which can't be done on other hardware.

The only relevant point here is that some people extrapolated the video running off some laptop in China, to that meaning the demo was running off of that laptop. Even more, using that as a proof it was somehow running better than on the PS5, when Tim Sweeney confirmed it was the video of the PS5 output :D. That's just priceless in of itself.

And yeah, for PC games, surely we'll need to forget running certain games off the HDD, they simply will not be playable there if they are made to take advantage of what we've seen on the UE5 demo. PC gpus are definitely not going to be the bottleneck in any way shape or form, the I/O will be.

Actually I am not missing the point at all.  The presenter interpretations stated it can run just fine without the PS5 GOD tier SSD.  As I asked earlier, are we questioning the statement made by the presenter who works for Epic or just the playback of the demo.

As to your second paragraph, that tweet from Tim only seem to point to the presentation of the demo shone not the words from the presenter translations.  There isn't enough info in that tweet to infer anything beyond that.  

I actually doubt the I/O will be a big problem for PCs because an increase in RAM would be a better solution.  THe key for consoles is that they have limited ram, no expandability and thus fixed which means they are more dependent on SDD solution then a PC probably 3 years from now.

Maybe you should look at the original presentation once again and hear it straight from the man himself, the engine is scalable across multiple platforms, including mobiles. So obviously, it will run "just fine", but what just fine means is what's being discussed here. Instead of streaming 8k textures, would 4k be fine? would 2k be fine? Would we offset the lower resolution with DLSS? Concessions will be made to run best at whatever available hardware you have.

I think it's pretty disingenuous to assume throwing more RAM would be a good solution to the problem. PCs are not limited necessarily by costs, so you'll always have the option to brute force your way out of most issues. There's no way you'll have all the in game assets stored on RAM, especially when we're talking big open world games available to use at any time, especially when these assets are extremely high quality (like the ones the demo was pulling). A game that would allow some sort of high speed moving through the game world would still need to have very fast I/O to populate the world without loading times and pop-in.

Most times the simplest answer is just the correct one, some games will require a mandatory high speed drive, otherwise they just won't be playable, period (or playable with a massive performance hit).





Digitalfoundry confirms UE5 demo was running better on a laptop in China.



34 years playing games.

 

Teriol said:

Digitalfoundry confirms UE5 demo was running better on a laptop in China.

are you trolling at this point?? this was a video of the ps5 demo being played

i hope that was a troll post, otherwise the level of stupid there is off the charts



Teriol said:

Digitalfoundry confirms UE5 demo was running better on a laptop in China.

As I mentioned earlier, many machines will outclass the PS5 on day 1.

That's not what this SDD is about. It's a much bigger deal to developers than it is to gamers.