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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Next gen PS5/XB1SX sales ratio will look the same as this gen's. Huge changes in console marketshare require huge changes in the industry.

LudicrousSpeed said:
HollyGamer said:

Many fans want Xbox series X sell a lot and minimize the sales  ratio, but in reality Microsoft and Xbox Division does not care.

Microsoft are not selling hardware , they are selling service (gamepass & Xcloud) 

So temper your expectation on Xbox hardware sales, we might see an even smaller number on Xbox console this time. 

What we might see and hear a lot will be a subscription number from Microsoft , they will brag and brag the number a lot in the near future. trust me 

Woah, you're saying MS will rely on selling subscriptions, and will then boast about those subscriptions? Not much of a limb you're walking out on there.

Also, they are selling hardware. The most powerful console ever, in fact. And they're also selling services. They don't care if you don't buy an XSX, yet. Obviously once the launch window is over and its no longer only the hardcore gamers buying new hardware, they'll want you to buy new Xbox hardware.

Yes they are selling hardware , are you satisfied with the answer.

They care subscription more. It's obvious from gamepass alone. I bet it's hard for you to understand. 



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eva01beserk said:
Pok87 said:

There are several reasons:

- more and better exclusive games
- Gamepass
- similar console price at the start (Xbox One was 100$ more expensive than PS4)
- Xbox will no longer be a weaker console
- better marketing

Ps5 will still sell better, but the difference will not be so colossal.

More and better exclusives? MS has adquire studios for years now and all only mini games have releases aside for the big 3. People keep saying just wait for years. Nothing points to them outputing quality games just more quantity. I think after the July event is the last time they can say lets wait.

Gamepass is not a bad offer. But also indicates that they are uneilling to offer quality games. If they do it will be like one a year and a bunch of Indy games or it just would not be worth it.

Similar prices could help.

Being weaker is not an issue. Being weaker and more expensive was the issue with the x1. The same reason the x1x dint take off. Its definetly stronger than the pro but it was also pricier. It also lacks games.

Better marketing? Sounds like a preference thing. If you like what they Re showing your gona think its better. Just look at the reception the small anouncememts from Sony get. They drown out any positivity MS message may have. 

What studios have they bought?

Obsidian - was working on Outer Worlds when they were bought. Are now working on Grounded and Outer Worlds DLC, plus a new RPG, maybe another Pillars of Eternity. Games take years to make. They were bought less than two years ago.

Ninja Theory - was working on VR games and Bleeding Edge when bought. Those are all released. Now working on Hellblade and other projects. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Playground - was working on Horizon 4 (the best racer this gen) when bought, are now working on two projects. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Compulsion - was working on We Happy Few when they were bought. A small studio, they finished DLC for that game and are working on a new game now. Not another We Happy Few. Games take years to make, especially for a smaller studio like this, and they were bought less than two years ago.

inXile - was working on Bards Tale IV and Wasteland when they were bought. Bards Tale is out, Wasteland saw a clear huge influx of money in its production and is coming out in a couple months. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Undead Labs - was working on State of Decay 2 when they were bought. Have been releasing loads of free content and updates for the game since release. They're opening a new studio in New Orleans and are working on new projects. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Double Fine - was working on Psychonauts 2 and Rad when they were bought, Rad is out and Psychonauts 2 is coming presumably in 2020. Games take years to make, they were bought less than one year ago.

In what reality should these studios have big games out already? You say "mini games" in a negative way yet what else could these studios be making in such a short time since being bought? So you want big AAA games in one or two years from studios who were all already knee deep in development on games when they were bought? That's not how reality works lol.

Also again with the GamePass quantity over quality nonsense. This year on GamePass I have had available:

Plague Tale (83)
Ori 2 (90)
Indivisible (82, not that I would play it)
Ninja Gaiden 2 (81)
KH 3 (80)
Two Point Hospital (82)
Yakuza 0 (85)
FF XV (83)
Streets of Rage 4 (82)
RDR2 (97)
Gears Tactics (81)
Nier (90)

Among many many other games including PC titles. Plus we'll get Wasteland 3, Psychonauts, Halo Infinite, Forza 8 if it launches this year, Minecraft Dungeons, etc etc and others. Your opinion of how GamePass works is laughably incorrect. Not to mention ignorant. Plus how exactly do you think they'll sell a service where they load it with one good game and a bunch of "indie" stuff lol. Doesn't make any sense.

It doesn't take any effort to see the games coming to GamePass. Ignorance is no excuse.



HollyGamer said:
LudicrousSpeed said:

Woah, you're saying MS will rely on selling subscriptions, and will then boast about those subscriptions? Not much of a limb you're walking out on there.

Also, they are selling hardware. The most powerful console ever, in fact. And they're also selling services. They don't care if you don't buy an XSX, yet. Obviously once the launch window is over and its no longer only the hardcore gamers buying new hardware, they'll want you to buy new Xbox hardware.

Yes they are selling hardware , are you satisfied with the answer.

They care subscription more. It's obvious from gamepass alone. I bet it's hard for you to understand. 

Of course they care about subscriptions more. They are a company looking to make money. Sony cares a ton about PS+ subscriptions, too. Nintendo loves those Switch online service subscriptions. But hardware is still important. Papa Phil has said repeatedly it will be at least a decade minimum before we move away from consoles. Do you foresee them supporting 360 and Xbone in 2030 lol



LudicrousSpeed said:
HollyGamer said:

Yes they are selling hardware , are you satisfied with the answer.

They care subscription more. It's obvious from gamepass alone. I bet it's hard for you to understand. 

Of course they care about subscriptions more. They are a company looking to make money. Sony cares a ton about PS+ subscriptions, too. Nintendo loves those Switch online service subscriptions. But hardware is still important. Papa Phil has said repeatedly it will be at least a decade minimum before we move away from consoles. Do you foresee them supporting 360 and Xbone in 2030 lol

XCloud  and PC  will be their focus in coming year. 



LudicrousSpeed said:
eva01beserk said:

More and better exclusives? MS has adquire studios for years now and all only mini games have releases aside for the big 3. People keep saying just wait for years. Nothing points to them outputing quality games just more quantity. I think after the July event is the last time they can say lets wait.

Gamepass is not a bad offer. But also indicates that they are uneilling to offer quality games. If they do it will be like one a year and a bunch of Indy games or it just would not be worth it.

Similar prices could help.

Being weaker is not an issue. Being weaker and more expensive was the issue with the x1. The same reason the x1x dint take off. Its definetly stronger than the pro but it was also pricier. It also lacks games.

Better marketing? Sounds like a preference thing. If you like what they Re showing your gona think its better. Just look at the reception the small anouncememts from Sony get. They drown out any positivity MS message may have. 

What studios have they bought?

Obsidian - was working on Outer Worlds when they were bought. Are now working on Grounded and Outer Worlds DLC, plus a new RPG, maybe another Pillars of Eternity. Games take years to make. They were bought less than two years ago.

Ninja Theory - was working on VR games and Bleeding Edge when bought. Those are all released. Now working on Hellblade and other projects. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Playground - was working on Horizon 4 (the best racer this gen) when bought, are now working on two projects. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Compulsion - was working on We Happy Few when they were bought. A small studio, they finished DLC for that game and are working on a new game now. Not another We Happy Few. Games take years to make, especially for a smaller studio like this, and they were bought less than two years ago.

inXile - was working on Bards Tale IV and Wasteland when they were bought. Bards Tale is out, Wasteland saw a clear huge influx of money in its production and is coming out in a couple months. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Undead Labs - was working on State of Decay 2 when they were bought. Have been releasing loads of free content and updates for the game since release. They're opening a new studio in New Orleans and are working on new projects. Games take years to make, they were bought less than two years ago.

Double Fine - was working on Psychonauts 2 and Rad when they were bought, Rad is out and Psychonauts 2 is coming presumably in 2020. Games take years to make, they were bought less than one year ago.

In what reality should these studios have big games out already? You say "mini games" in a negative way yet what else could these studios be making in such a short time since being bought? So you want big AAA games in one or two years from studios who were all already knee deep in development on games when they were bought? That's not how reality works lol.

Also again with the GamePass quantity over quality nonsense. This year on GamePass I have had available:

Plague Tale (83)
Ori 2 (90)
Indivisible (82, not that I would play it)
Ninja Gaiden 2 (81)
KH 3 (80)
Two Point Hospital (82)
Yakuza 0 (85)
FF XV (83)
Streets of Rage 4 (82)
RDR2 (97)
Gears Tactics (81)
Nier (90)

Among many many other games including PC titles. Plus we'll get Wasteland 3, Psychonauts, Halo Infinite, Forza 8 if it launches this year, Minecraft Dungeons, etc etc and others. Your opinion of how GamePass works is laughably incorrect. Not to mention ignorant. Plus how exactly do you think they'll sell a service where they load it with one good game and a bunch of "indie" stuff lol. Doesn't make any sense.

It doesn't take any effort to see the games coming to GamePass. Ignorance is no excuse.

I think he was just talking about microsoft's first party quantity over quality Gamepass strategy. Obviously Gamepass is a fantastic deal, and one that Sony needs to emulate ASAP! At least with all the 3rd party goodness.



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derpysquirtle64 said:
Runa216 said:
I was going to write up another reply to Rol and Sales person, but I realized...their revisionist history is at odds with reality and no amount of arguing is going to make them concede the point. I don't expect them to agree with me, but If we're not even adhering to the same flow of time and see history from a completely different perspective than what is real, then there's no way this can be a fruitful discussion.

Rol, your assertion that 'exclusives' are the least important of the factors you listed is just so wrong I don't even know where to start.

Sales, your revisionist history where you're passing the buck and saying 'nuh uh, what you say Xbox does...well Sony does it' is also not really in line with what really happened or how history went. I also need to point out that my example of Rare was simply the progenitor to the problem Microsoft has. they acquire studios and do nothing with them. They did it with Rare and have not changed their tone ever since then. when was the last time a Microsoft helmed studio made something as epic and groundbreaking as Banjo Kazooie? When was the last time we had high quality middle-tier exclusives on Xbox? we just haven't in ages. That's my point.

Seriously, get with reality. I get that you have your preferences - we all do - but you can't just disregard everything about history in order to fuel your faulty narrative. Regardless of personal preferences, the sales history of these two companies speak a wholly different story than the one you're trying to tell.

If you think that 'exclusives' are the most important thing in PS vs Xbox rivalry, would you be willing to bet that PS5 will flop if the rumour about it having way more inferior exclusive games lineup than Xbox Series X proves to be true? For some reason, I don't think so.

I'm interested in the rumor.



Pok87 said:
eva01beserk said:

So you are basically saying that MS will expand the market. Care to give a reason? As nothing suggest at the moment that will happen. Things could change after their first party line up is anounced. But as it stands it looks like MS is exiting the console space for cloud services. 

There are several reasons:

- more and better exclusive games
- Gamepass
- similar console price at the start (Xbox One was 100$ more expensive than PS4)
- Xbox will no longer be a weaker console
- better marketing

Ps5 will still sell better, but the difference will not be so colossal.

The same goes for Sony.

-bigger budget for first party than the beginning of this gen.

-PS NOW(greatley improved)

-more cheap product cost 

-Performance advantage outside of  the Tflops(This is very ivery mportant.)

-better marketing

-backward compatibility feature (that was not on the PS4 gen.)

-more bigger install base in current gen.(Owners are likely to choose the PS5.)

-Entering the PC market (They will get a big profit.)

The leap from PS4 to PS5 will be bigger than the improvement from XBOX ONE to Series X.

Last edited by Oneeee-Chan!!! - on 16 May 2020

Oneeee-Chan!!! said:
derpysquirtle64 said:

If you think that 'exclusives' are the most important thing in PS vs Xbox rivalry, would you be willing to bet that PS5 will flop if the rumour about it having way more inferior exclusive games lineup than Xbox Series X proves to be true? For some reason, I don't think so.

I'm interested in the rumor.

There is no 'rumour'. That's not what a rumour is. a rumour is unverified information, not a prediction based on literally no data. something internal like 'Sony doesn't have much planned for the first year' is not a 'rumour', it's a combination of hearsay and prediction. There's absolutely no way to know if the PS5's first year will be good or not until it comes out, and it's not like Sony 'plans' on having a shitty exclusive lineup. 

by no means is what Derpysquirtle saying by any means a 'rumour', it's just him taking shit out of context and twisting it to be something it's not. IT's a prediction, not a rumour. There's no 'hard data' being leaked or shared, just conjecture that, what they've heard indicates to whoever started this 'rumour' that Microsoft's exclusives sound better or there are more. 

But again, even if the Xbox has a better first year, the reality is that Sony has always had its best years in mid-late gen, so it's too early to assert anything until I'd say at least 2025 or something. 

just empty wishes and biased expectations. 



My Console Library:

PS5, Switch, XSX

PS4, PS3, PS2, PS1, WiiU, Wii, GCN, N64 SNES, XBO, 360

3DS, DS, GBA, Vita, PSP, Android

Oneeee-Chan!!! said:
derpysquirtle64 said:

If you think that 'exclusives' are the most important thing in PS vs Xbox rivalry, would you be willing to bet that PS5 will flop if the rumour about it having way more inferior exclusive games lineup than Xbox Series X proves to be true? For some reason, I don't think so.

I'm interested in the rumor.

Runa216 said:
Oneeee-Chan!!! said:

I'm interested in the rumor.

There is no 'rumour'. That's not what a rumour is. a rumour is unverified information, not a prediction based on literally no data. something internal like 'Sony doesn't have much planned for the first year' is not a 'rumour', it's a combination of hearsay and prediction. There's absolutely no way to know if the PS5's first year will be good or not until it comes out, and it's not like Sony 'plans' on having a shitty exclusive lineup. 

by no means is what Derpysquirtle saying by any means a 'rumour', it's just him taking shit out of context and twisting it to be something it's not. IT's a prediction, not a rumour. There's no 'hard data' being leaked or shared, just conjecture that, what they've heard indicates to whoever started this 'rumour' that Microsoft's exclusives sound better or there are more. 

But again, even if the Xbox has a better first year, the reality is that Sony has always had its best years in mid-late gen, so it's too early to assert anything until I'd say at least 2025 or something. 

just empty wishes and biased expectations. 

No, it's not a prediction when it comes from a game journalist who has been working in the industry for at least 15 years (probably more than that) and 100% has some sources in the industry. It's called a rumour. Do you also dismiss something that Jason Schreier comes up with as a "prediction" when it does not suit your agenda? If you want a source, here it goes, if you can understand Russian, you can hear it around the end of the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hvCYLbERP8

It's also not the first time he mentions it in his videos, but I can't find the other one. I think I need to correct myself here a bit because the term "exclusive launch lineup" I used is a bit not correct. I think he means Sony's own first party studios not having that much at launch compared to MS owns. They can still moneyhat third parties like they always do and as you can see it's already happening with game like Godfall and Quantum Error.

If you need a proof of credibility of the source, here is the video dated 4 Dec 2019 where he claims that Horizon Zero Dawn is coming to PC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8msXoUTndg

And here is the Kotaku article with Jason Schreier bringing this up dated 16 Jan 2020, 1.5 months later:

https://kotaku.com/sources-horizon-zero-dawn-is-coming-to-pc-1841043569



 

derpysquirtle64 said:
Oneeee-Chan!!! said:

I'm interested in the rumor.

Runa216 said:

There is no 'rumour'. That's not what a rumour is. a rumour is unverified information, not a prediction based on literally no data. something internal like 'Sony doesn't have much planned for the first year' is not a 'rumour', it's a combination of hearsay and prediction. There's absolutely no way to know if the PS5's first year will be good or not until it comes out, and it's not like Sony 'plans' on having a shitty exclusive lineup. 

by no means is what Derpysquirtle saying by any means a 'rumour', it's just him taking shit out of context and twisting it to be something it's not. IT's a prediction, not a rumour. There's no 'hard data' being leaked or shared, just conjecture that, what they've heard indicates to whoever started this 'rumour' that Microsoft's exclusives sound better or there are more. 

But again, even if the Xbox has a better first year, the reality is that Sony has always had its best years in mid-late gen, so it's too early to assert anything until I'd say at least 2025 or something. 

just empty wishes and biased expectations. 

No, it's not a prediction when it comes from a game journalist who has been working in the industry for at least 15 years (probably more than that) and 100% has some sources in the industry. It's called a rumour. Do you also dismiss something that Jason Schreier comes up with as a "prediction" when it does not suit your agenda? If you want a source, here it goes, if you can understand Russian, you can hear it around the end of the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hvCYLbERP8

It's also not the first time he mentions it in his videos, but I can't find the other one. I think I need to correct myself here a bit because the term "exclusive launch lineup" I used is a bit not correct. I think he means Sony's own first party studios not having that much at launch compared to MS owns. They can still moneyhat third parties like they always do and as you can see it's already happening with game like Godfall and Quantum Error.

If you need a proof of credibility of the source, here is the video dated 4 Dec 2019 where he claims that Horizon Zero Dawn is coming to PC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8msXoUTndg

And here is the Kotaku article with Jason Schreier bringing this up dated 16 Jan 2020, 1.5 months later:

https://kotaku.com/sources-horizon-zero-dawn-is-coming-to-pc-1841043569



When Jason reports on HZD coming to PC, and other things that he is frequently right about he is reporting factual things. Reporting that he personally thinks XB2's launch lineup looks better than PS5's isn't a fact. It's his opinion. And if he's simply reporting that a headcount of XB2 vs PS5 launch titles has XB2 with way more launch titles, that fails to take individual game quality into account. XB2 could have five mediocre games and they'd all be overshadowed by a single PS5 exclusive such as HZD2. 

Not to mention that these XB2 launch titles will also be coming to XB1X and XB1. GoT or TLoU part 2 ported to PS5 would counter those games easily. 

Last edited by Cerebralbore101 - on 16 May 2020