I choose...

Wii U 32 28.83%
 
N64 79 71.17%
 
Total:111
bigtakilla said:
Doctor_MG said:

The Wii U had some good games, but I think people really over value it with rose-colored glasses. Between 2012 and 2017 the top games (rating wise) for the Wii U are:
-Breath of the Wild
-Super Mario 3D World
-Super Smash Bros Wii U
-Rayman Legends
-Bayonetta 2
-Windwaker HD
-Guacamelee
-Skylanders Swap Force
-Axiom Verge
-Deus Ex: Human Revolution

For the N64 the top rated games were:
-Ocarina of Time
-Perfect Dark
-007: Goldeneye
-Majoras Mask
-Super Mario 64
-Paper Mario
-Banjo Kazooie
-Wave Race 64
-Conkers Bad Fur Day
-Mario Tennis

I mean, just by comparing those lists I see a lot more Nintendo mainstay quality titles, and games that are still being mentioned even to this day. Meanwhile, two of the Wii U top games are indies (nothing wrong with indies just not big titles), one is a remaster, and one of them is a port of a "last gen" game.

You want to talk about rose colored glasses, then talk about games like Conker, 007, and Perfect Dark? Game ratings are fine, but which series do you think is going to last longer, 007 or Splatoon, Conkers or Xenoblade, Banjo or Bayonetta? Two of these aren't even on the "top 10" list, but does anyone who didn't live through the N64 era even know what a Conker, Banjo, or 007 is? I doubt it, nor will they likely ever care.

I could be wrong, but I don't think you are going to find a lot of  Wii U games in many top 50 game lists over the next 50 days here.  I personally have 3 Wii U games in my top 50 and two of them are Zelda remakes.  The N64 is well represented in my top 10.  For the games you listed I played 007 for hundreds of hours back in the day while I've played Splatoon maybe 10 hours.  Conker was a fine game nothing special, while I tried playing the first two Xenoblade games but just couldn't get into them, the camera system and controls bug me.  Banjo was incredible while Bayonetta I played the demo years ago and thought it was alright I might get it one day.



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Jumpin said:
siebensus4 said:

Completely disagree. The N64 games looked polygonal, blurry and ugly – even back in the 90's (just like PS1, which was basically a SNES with CDs). It was the first 3D generation and they should have stayed with 2D during this time. First when DC/PS2/GameCube arrived, 3D games looked decent.

Your argument that Wii U always looked a gen behind is ridiculous. Which comparable PS4 game looks better than Mario Kart 8? Tropical Freeze is even one of the best looking 2D platformers to date. Of course you can make scripted scenes that look impressive, but which need many GB space (I look at you TLOU), but that's not the way to make fun games with gameplay focus.

I believe that many Wii U games will be fun to watch and play in 20 years, while N64 games aged very very bad. It was just too early for 3D.

In case of legacy for the video game industry, the N64 clearly wins with 3D camera control, analog stick, rumble and 3D game design like in Mario 64 and OOT. The Wii U gamepad wasn't that revolutionary for games Nintendo may has hoped.

The Wii U wasn't even fun to play 5 years ago.

But in all seriousness, you might want to rethink your first paragraph, and I'm going to tell you why:

Saying something like N64 wasn't good enough for 3D, so it should have done 2D is about the same as saying NES wasn't good enough for 2D, so it should have done text adventures.

You can't skip the first half a decade in 3D console gaming and expect to be at Dreamcast level. Much of what made 3D games great was invented during the N64 and PSX generations: this is not just from a mechanical and design perspective, but also from an animation, texturing, and modelling perspective. Some stuff stuck around (Nintendo still uses scrolling textures to this day), other stuff didn't (Pre-rendered textures and single stick aiming isn't often used anymore), but at least devs got to see how it all worked on the market over 5 years. 3D engineers, animators, and artists grew in skill and quality throughout the generation.

Relativity is everything: when then N64 came out, its graphics were mindblowing to most gamers. Waverace 64, looks pretty crap today, but people were going nuts over that one.

I recall being quite impressed with GE007's graphics when I first played it. While the game looks and plays very outdated today, when it first came out, it felt extremely cutting edge, so much so that it was hailed as the best game of that year, and it was up against massive releases such as Final Fantasy 7. Goldeneye sold 8 million copies, and it wasn't some massively marketed game that was shoved down everyone's throat like DKC, Mario, and Zelda. Instead, GE007 was a sleeper hit that released to very minimal fanfare, but gamers LOVED it, and it became the biggest sleeper hit success story until the Just Dance series about a decade later.

Mario Kart 64 is another success story as it replaced the very popular original Mario Kart as the game of choice to play in the franchise. At first glance, that may seem obvious; sequel replaces original? But Mario Kart Cube and Mario Kart Advance both failed to supplant Mario Kart 64 as the primary Kart game. While Mario Kart DS became a serious challenger (and sold WAY better in the end), it wasn't until the monstrously successful Mario Kart Wii came out that we had a clear preferred successor to Mario Kart 64. As a note on Mario Kart Wii, it's not only the best selling unbundled console game in history when considering only single platform sales, but the game sold 40,000 units last quarter, more than 11 years after release, and 7 years after its generation concluded. Yeah, Mario Kart 64 was supplanted itself, but it took four games and one of the biggest success stories in video game history to do it.

I do remember people trashing the N64s graphics. There was Wave Race, Mario 64, and even OOT, but there's no doubt where the game industry decided it wanted to go (at least until technology improved).

Also, it's hard to argue that N64 games are the worst aged games of all time.



rapsuperstar31 said:
bigtakilla said:

You want to talk about rose colored glasses, then talk about games like Conker, 007, and Perfect Dark? Game ratings are fine, but which series do you think is going to last longer, 007 or Splatoon, Conkers or Xenoblade, Banjo or Bayonetta? Two of these aren't even on the "top 10" list, but does anyone who didn't live through the N64 era even know what a Conker, Banjo, or 007 is? I doubt it, nor will they likely ever care.

I could be wrong, but I don't think you are going to find a lot of  Wii U games in many top 50 game lists over the next 50 days here.  I personally have 3 Wii U games in my top 50 and two of them are Zelda remakes.  The N64 is well represented in my top 10.  For the games you listed I played 007 for hundreds of hours back in the day while I've played Splatoon maybe 10 hours.  Conker was a fine game nothing special, while I tried playing the first two Xenoblade games but just couldn't get into them, the camera system and controls bug me.  Banjo was incredible while Bayonetta I played the demo years ago and thought it was alright I might get it one day.

Okay, your top 50 games are your top 50 games. I'd have a few (to include Bayo 2, Mario 3d World, XCX which would be my #1 game of all time, Windwaker HD, and even the poorly received Fatal Frame V, BOTW wouldn't make it because I haven't played it). As far as N64 games go, it would be Paper Mario, OOT and Mario 64, and those would only make the top 50 based on how I felt about the games at the time, I can't throw them in now and enjoy them in nearly the same capacity, but I honestly I do think top 50s should be based on how they effected us on release, so they would make it. 



Jumpin said:
siebensus4 said:

Completely disagree. The N64 games looked polygonal, blurry and ugly – even back in the 90's (just like PS1, which was basically a SNES with CDs). It was the first 3D generation and they should have stayed with 2D during this time. First when DC/PS2/GameCube arrived, 3D games looked decent.

Your argument that Wii U always looked a gen behind is ridiculous. Which comparable PS4 game looks better than Mario Kart 8? Tropical Freeze is even one of the best looking 2D platformers to date. Of course you can make scripted scenes that look impressive, but which need many GB space (I look at you TLOU), but that's not the way to make fun games with gameplay focus.

I believe that many Wii U games will be fun to watch and play in 20 years, while N64 games aged very very bad. It was just too early for 3D.

In case of legacy for the video game industry, the N64 clearly wins with 3D camera control, analog stick, rumble and 3D game design like in Mario 64 and OOT. The Wii U gamepad wasn't that revolutionary for games Nintendo may has hoped.

The Wii U wasn't even fun to play 5 years ago.

But in all seriousness, you might want to rethink your first paragraph, and I'm going to tell you why:

Saying something like N64 wasn't good enough for 3D, so it should have done 2D is about the same as saying NES wasn't good enough for 2D, so it should have done text adventures.

You can't skip the first half a decade in 3D console gaming and expect to be at Dreamcast level. Much of what made 3D games great was invented during the N64 and PSX generations: this is not just from a mechanical and design perspective, but also from an animation, texturing, and modelling perspective. Some stuff stuck around (Nintendo still uses scrolling textures to this day), other stuff didn't (Pre-rendered textures and single stick aiming isn't often used anymore), but at least devs got to see how it all worked on the market over 5 years. 3D engineers, animators, and artists grew in skill and quality throughout the generation.

Relativity is everything: when then N64 came out, its graphics were mindblowing to most gamers. Waverace 64, looks pretty crap today, but people were going nuts over that one.

I recall being quite impressed with GE007's graphics when I first played it. While the game looks and plays very outdated today, when it first came out, it felt extremely cutting edge, so much so that it was hailed as the best game of that year, and it was up against massive releases such as Final Fantasy 7. Goldeneye sold 8 million copies, and it wasn't some massively marketed game that was shoved down everyone's throat like DKC, Mario, and Zelda. Instead, GE007 was a sleeper hit that released to very minimal fanfare, but gamers LOVED it, and it became the biggest sleeper hit success story until the Just Dance series about a decade later.

Mario Kart 64 is another success story as it replaced the very popular original Mario Kart as the game of choice to play in the franchise. At first glance, that may seem obvious; sequel replaces original? But Mario Kart Cube and Mario Kart Advance both failed to supplant Mario Kart 64 as the primary Kart game. While Mario Kart DS became a serious challenger (and sold WAY better in the end), it wasn't until the monstrously successful Mario Kart Wii came out that we had a clear preferred successor to Mario Kart 64. As a note on Mario Kart Wii, it's not only the best selling unbundled console game in history when considering only single platform sales, but the game sold 40,000 units last quarter, more than 11 years after release, and 7 years after its generation concluded. Yeah, Mario Kart 64 was supplanted itself, but it took four games and one of the biggest success stories in video game history to do it.


The Wii U is already mostly talked about as one of the worst main line consoles ever. We are talking about Consoles and the N64 will forever be remembered for how it got 3d right, and its games will forever be in top 10-20 ATG list. The Wii U has nothing on that level except BotW which most people would have played in the Switch. By 2035 no one will talk about it, people will still be talking about how the N64 advanced gaming with its library of revolutionary titles .



bigtakilla said:
rapsuperstar31 said:

I could be wrong, but I don't think you are going to find a lot of  Wii U games in many top 50 game lists over the next 50 days here.  I personally have 3 Wii U games in my top 50 and two of them are Zelda remakes.  The N64 is well represented in my top 10.  For the games you listed I played 007 for hundreds of hours back in the day while I've played Splatoon maybe 10 hours.  Conker was a fine game nothing special, while I tried playing the first two Xenoblade games but just couldn't get into them, the camera system and controls bug me.  Banjo was incredible while Bayonetta I played the demo years ago and thought it was alright I might get it one day.

Okay, your top 50 games are your top 50 games. I'd have a few (to include Bayo 2, Mario 3d World, XCX which would be my #1 game of all time, Windwaker HD, and even the poorly received Fatal Frame V, BOTW wouldn't make it because I haven't played it). As far as N64 games go, it would be Paper Mario, OOT and Mario 64, and those would only make the top 50 based on how I felt about the games at the time, I can't throw them in now and enjoy them in nearly the same capacity, but I honestly I do think top 50s should be based on how they effected us on release, so they would make it. 

Most people won't and don't have XCX in their top 100 games list. I guarantee OoT will be in the top 10 every time. You have a personal preference for the WiiU which is understandable, but for a vast majority of people and critics the N64 was and will always be the better system. It's games were also better (much better) at the time of their release. 



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I'm one of the few that do have XCX high up on my list, perhaps even ahead of any N64 game (though, not ahead of some PSX games - such as Xenogears). But to me, that's a diamond in the rough. The next most interesting thing to me on Wii U was the port of Earthbound. Mario Kart 8 didn't interest me much on Wii U and I hardly touched it (I played both Mario Kart 7 and Mario Kart Wii significantly more after getting MK8), but with the Switch core features Mario Kart 8 DX has become one of my most played games of all time. I simply wasn't a fan of the Wii U as a console. You could say I liked XCX in spite of it being on Wii U.

But the N64 had Goldeneye 007, Banjo Kazooie, Wrestlemania 2000, Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, Ogre Battle 64, and other games that I had a fantastic time with. While N64 is a console I generally consider negatively, it's still my favourite of the three I consider to be the bad ones (Gamecube, N64, and Wii U). Wii U had XCX and a controller that doesn't cramp my hands to use, and that at least puts it above Gamecube for me.

Last edited by Jumpin - on 12 November 2019

I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

bigtakilla said:

I do remember people trashing the N64s graphics. There was Wave Race, Mario 64, and even OOT, but there's no doubt where the game industry decided it wanted to go (at least until technology improved).

Also, it's hard to argue that N64 games are the worst aged games of all time.

I don't know who was trashing the N64's graphics when it's graphics were much better than the competition at the time. You can guess which picture is from the PS1 and which is from the N64. Also, I wouldn't say the N64 has poorly aged games. Super Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time are still incredibly fun to play. In fact, the majority of it's first and second party library is. With the biggest exceptions being Goldeneye and Perfect Dark due to their incredibly awkward control schemes.