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Forums - Politics Discussion - Alex Jones Claims Psychosis Made Him Believe SAndy Hook Shooting Was Staged

o_O.Q on 31 March 2019
collint0101 said:
o_O.Q said:

"being right leaning doesn't instantly mean you want to do away with all social programs."

that's a fair argument but i think when you consider the breath of the social programs the nazis introduced and maintained its pretty darn dishonest to state that they were not socialist

". As for Marxism in the communist manifesto the government Marx advocates for is a collective democracy with no true ruling class as everyone has equal say in the economic goals of the society."

ok lets say there is a minority that thinks pedophilia should be encouraged and they want to remove age of consent laws, do they have an equal say?

"ut a system of government officials and wealthy business owners at the top, clearly defined middle and lower classes with a slave class at the very bottom is basically as anti Marxist as you can get."

marxism is incoherent bullshit, if you disagree explain to me logically how the resources of a community will be regulated after the state is abolished

" Also in what ways did the Nazis control industries that did not have a direct impact on the military?"

" The Nazi government substituted conscious, over-all dfrection of the economy for the autonomy
of the market mechanism and subordinated the economic system to
a predetermined objective, the creation of a war machine. A vast
network of organizations was erected to embrace individuals, corporations, manufacturers, farmers, dealers, small business and large
business - in short, every factor of production, distribution, and
consumption. By dominating this organizational structure through
which orders could be issued to every businessman, and by insisting
upon strict obedience from all, the government obtained complete
control over the economy"

https://www.nber.org/chapters/c9476.pdf

"And finally a collective calling for a ban on abortion based on religious principles would be a socially conservative."

which is again irrelevant, you understand that a religious sect that advocates for the restriction of abortion can also practice socialism right?

or is your line of thinking "socialism is good" "conservatism is bad" therefore "socialism cannot be practiced where conservatism is also practiced"

"It was not State capitalism: the
government disclaimed any desire to own the means of production,
and in fact took steps to denationalize them. It was not socialism or
communism: private property and private profit still existed. The
Nazi system was, rather, a combination of some of the characteristics
of capitalism and a highly planned economy. Without in any way
destroying its class character"

that source literally makes the exact same point i was making earlier. The nazi economy was a combination of both socialist and capitalist principles. Government regulation with a defined class system, privatization with wealth redistribution. The Nazis were neither wholly socialist or capitalist they simply went with whatever gained them popular support which meant catering to both the capitalist business owners and the socialist working class.  

as for the regulation of resources in a Marxist economy under pure Marxism there would be no privately owned property with every member of the community having equal rights to whatever resources are available at the time with any restrictions being put in place by the collective government. its a Utopian system that assumes both unlimited resources and a complete lack of greed and corruption among any members of the community. That's why no form of socialism that's actually been put in place as a form of government is "true" socialism because its not something that can practically be implemented. 

" The nazi economy was a combination of both socialist and capitalist principles."

capitalism is defined as private ownership and control of the means of production, this was not possible under nazi germany

"By dominating this organizational structure through
which orders could be issued to every businessman, and by insisting
upon strict obedience from all, the government obtained complete
control over the economy""

if you have to follow orders which dictate what must happen with your business then you aren't in control of that business

"as for the regulation of resources in a Marxist economy under pure Marxism there would be no privately owned property with every member of the community having equal rights to whatever resources are available at the time with any restrictions being put in place by the collective government."

the collective government? aren't you aware that marxism is about abolishing government?

so tell me how would the resources be regulated then?

"its a Utopian system that assumes both unlimited resources and a complete lack of greed and corruption among any members of the community."

so basically its bullshit and concessions would have to be made to make it work practically which is what i've said from the beginning

"That's why no form of socialism that's actually been put in place as a form of government is "true" socialism because its not something that can practically be implemented. "

yes... which is what i've said



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o_O.Q on 31 March 2019
MrWayne said:
Some people in here really have to stop projecting their understanding of the political system in 21st century USA onto early 20th century Germany. Guys take a step back and stop using this incredible US centric lens to look at things, It doesn't serve you well. It's really not that difficult to find good and solid criticism of Socialism and Separation of powers within States is also a very interesting topic but a fruitful discussion can't emerge when some people use words in a completly different way.

This is really the most frustrating part, we already had this discussion about Nazis and Socialism a few times in the last year, I myself made a Thread about it, and there were the same 2-4 people with the same strange talking points, talking to them seems really pointless.

"but a fruitful discussion can't emerge when some people use words in a completly different way. "

if you could list some examples and elaborate on what you disagree with then i believe that would go a long way to actually adding something constructive to the conversation



MrWayne on 31 March 2019
o_O.Q said:
MrWayne said:
Some people in here really have to stop projecting their understanding of the political system in 21st century USA onto early 20th century Germany. Guys take a step back and stop using this incredible US centric lens to look at things, It doesn't serve you well. It's really not that difficult to find good and solid criticism of Socialism and Separation of powers within States is also a very interesting topic but a fruitful discussion can't emerge when some people use words in a completly different way.

This is really the most frustrating part, we already had this discussion about Nazis and Socialism a few times in the last year, I myself made a Thread about it, and there were the same 2-4 people with the same strange talking points, talking to them seems really pointless.

"but a fruitful discussion can't emerge when some people use words in a completly different way. "

if you could list some examples and elaborate on what you disagree with then i believe that would go a long way to actually adding something constructive to the conversation

We two already talked about it multiple times. lets use "Socialism" as a example, It seems to me when you used Socialism you're talking about the amount of State intervention in the economy. But such a definition is inappropriate to explain the Nazi terror or the problems of genuine socialism (USSR, China under Mao, GDR, Venezuela), because if you use modern America as the non-socialist standard country, 99% of all Countries and countries that ever existed would be in some ways socialist.



alabtrosMyster on 31 March 2019

I mean, I don't think he should be censored, hidden, or somehow made to shut up.... But for having seen a bit of his material, I admit he can be entertaining, and I have no problem believing he has some kind of psychosis (I don't think it ever ended as well).



Snoopy on 31 March 2019

This is part of the mainstream media fault because they all lie constantly and makes people come up with conspiracies and attaching themselves to it. We have no choice ,but to ignore what others tell us.



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Snoopy on 31 March 2019
RolStoppable said:
Snoopy said:
This is part of the mainstream media fault because they all lie constantly and makes people come up with conspiracies and attaching themselves to it. We have no choice ,but to ignore what others tell us.

Does this mean that you are willing to reconsider your position that the Green Bay Packers are communists?

They are communists, it's been proven. They attack America's team (Dallas Cowboys) and hurt us because they are a bunch of communists spreading their propaganda.



Jumpin on 31 March 2019

If you want to prove that the Nazi Empire was socialist, then point to a single example of where workers of non-Germanic/Aryan genetics (particularly Jewish or Slavic) owned the means of production.

Those who wish to prove they were fascist, point to examples where those of Germanic/Aryan blood owned the means of production in a hierarchical system.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Pemalite on 31 March 2019
Hiku said:

Left and right in different countries will differ from one another heavily. Many right wing parties in Europe are strict on gun control, and USA gun laws can come off as crazy to them. That doesn't mean those are left wing ideas to them.

There is some deviation. The USA for instance seems to be a big step over to the right compared to most European nations... So someone who is a "Centrist" could be left wing.

In the end though, the farther left or right you go, the more they are the same.

o_O.Q said:

which is completely irrelevant so i don't understand why you keep bringing this up, the point is that endocrine disruptors are harmful, we have examples of the harm they have caused to other animals and to us also

the information is all there on the internet 

It's not completely irrelevant, you have just missed the point... And the point is... That sexuality is a highly complex issue with a ton of genetic, environmental and social factors all being influence's.

The fact that encorine distruptors are harmful is NOT something I am arguing against, so why you continue to cling to that argument has me baffled. I actually agreed with you in my last post if you cared to read it?

o_O.Q said:

as i've said previously i never followed his content so i'm unaware of what his stances were on various issues, which is why i was depending on you and others to show evidence and so far i'm not seeing much

The evidence has been provided? So why are you ignoring it? You haven't even made a direct comment on the evidence, just focusing on frogs?

You don't get to whinge about the lack of evidence if you can't even recognize that its been provided to start with!

o_O.Q said:

what are you trying to imply here? that i'm against homosexuality? lol 

Those are your words, not mine.

o_O.Q said:

this has only been the case in recent history, the point i'm making is that you are trying to argue that the requirements for sustaining a healthy population throughout the course of history up until fairly recently meant that society had to hold homosexuality in contempt and i don't see how you can make that argument

for example, that's like saying that people driving cars have to hold people riding bikes in contempt

Clearly you do not have an understanding of Homosexuality or LGBTQI+ issues.
Homosexuals have been reproducing since life has existed on this planet.

Even a few thousand years ago when things were far more primitive for human beings, homosexuals were reproducing.

To assume it's a modern concept is highly disingenuous and you should probably do a little more research on the topic.

o_O.Q said:

you've been saying from the start that alex jones talking about how harmful endocrine disruptors are is a conspiracy theory

Again, I never once stated it wasn't harmful. Endocrine Disruptors itself is not a conspiracy theory, it actually exists.

What is a conspiracy theory is how Alex Jones is propagating the idea that the government is using that compound to infect various water ways to turn various amphibious species Homosexual. - There is zero evidence to support that... Hence why we can call it a conspiracy theory.


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Thread warning: Can we steer the topic away from Nazi's and back onto the issue of Alex Jones and the shooting. Cheers.



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