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Biggerboat1 said:
EricHiggin said:

They said, "So then why does his administration have revolving door employment when other administrations did not?" Are you saying the threshold for too much turnover is literally tied to Trump? Show me where I said anything close to previous Presidents didn't fire anybody. My point with the links was to specifically show that previous Presidents did in fact do their fair share of firing. Trump firing more in a shorter amount of time doesn't mean other administrations didn't have what you would consider rotating doors at that point in time. That's like asking why does the majority of the population think the world is round when previous generations knew it was flat? I dunno, maybe because things changed between then and now and have to be taken into account.

Nobody seems to be care about that though. Saying Jeff has fired a tonne from his many giant warehouses but grandpa fired way less from the small original back in the day, doesn't make any sense if the amount of employees isn't equal and society has changed. More complexity leads to more problems. Just like all of Jeff's msm and social media problems that his grandpa didn't have. When he grew up he was just another small business and those things didn't even exist.

I think the obvious way to interpret Trump having 'revolving door employment' is that the turnover is high relative to the norm of previous Presidents - it's really not that difficult...

Neither is pissing into the wind, but simply taking a few evident things into account would quickly reveal, aimlessly doing just that would be quite foolish.

Bofferbrauer2 said:
EricHiggin said:

They said, "So then why does his administration have revolving door employment when other administrations did not?" Are you saying the threshold for too much turnover is literally tied to Trump? Show me where I said anything close to previous Presidents didn't fire anybody. My point with the links was to specifically show that previous Presidents did in fact do their fair share of firing. Trump firing more in a shorter amount of time doesn't mean other administrations didn't have what you would consider rotating doors at that point in time. That's like asking why does the majority of the population think the world is round when previous generations knew it was flat? I dunno, maybe because things changed between then and now and have to be taken into account.

Nobody seems to be care about that though. Saying Jeff has fired a tonne from his many giant warehouses but grandpa fired way less from the small original back in the day, doesn't make any sense if the amount of employees isn't equal and society has changed. More complexity leads to more problems. Just like all of Jeff's msm and social media problems that his grandpa didn't have. When he grew up he was just another small business and those things didn't even exist.

Seriously, you're missing all context here.

Again, nobody is saying that other presidents didn't have sometimes high turnovers. But as far as I know, none of them even came close to Trump's turnover rates. That's the context you seem to miss all the time, that Trumps turnover is very high when compared to other presidents in the past.

Your entire last segment just highlights that you missed the entire context. You compare to corporations and say that there haven't been many firings in the white house compared to that. We compare apples to apples, meaning US presidents from the past to Trump, not some random bad corporation boss to Trump in office as US president.

If I'm missing something it's not the expressed context. Some are. 

Apples to apples? You missed the point. How large was the Gov when it started compared to now? Much bigger Gov, in a time of promoted victimhood and (legal) retaliation, more problems? How much of an issue was the media for the Gov when it started compared to now? Much more (opinionated) media, instantly broadcasting worldwide, more problems? 

The climate is much worse today then it's ever been, did you know that? - Sure, everyone knows that, but what's your point? - Don't you want to know why it's changing and what's causing it? - Why would you ask that? That wouldn't be an apples to apples comparison anymore now then would it?



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EricHiggin said:
Biggerboat1 said:

I think the obvious way to interpret Trump having 'revolving door employment' is that the turnover is high relative to the norm of previous Presidents - it's really not that difficult...

Neither is pissing into the wind, but simply taking a few evident things into account would quickly reveal, aimlessly doing just that would be quite foolish.

Bofferbrauer2 said:

Seriously, you're missing all context here.

Again, nobody is saying that other presidents didn't have sometimes high turnovers. But as far as I know, none of them even came close to Trump's turnover rates. That's the context you seem to miss all the time, that Trumps turnover is very high when compared to other presidents in the past.

Your entire last segment just highlights that you missed the entire context. You compare to corporations and say that there haven't been many firings in the white house compared to that. We compare apples to apples, meaning US presidents from the past to Trump, not some random bad corporation boss to Trump in office as US president.

If I'm missing something it's not the expressed context. Some are. 

Apples to apples? You missed the point. How large was the Gov when it started compared to now? Much bigger Gov, in a time of promoted victimhood and (legal) retaliation, more problems? How much of an issue was the media for the Gov when it started compared to now? Much more (opinionated) media, instantly broadcasting worldwide, more problems? 

The climate is much worse today then it's ever been, did you know that? - Sure, everyone knows that, but what's your point? - Don't you want to know why it's changing and what's causing it? - Why would you ask that? That wouldn't be an apples to apples comparison anymore now then would it?

Bold 1 :

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here to be honest... You're agreeing that interpreting the revolving door comment isn't difficult (yet you failed to do so), and neither is pissing into the wind... Why is it foolish to note that Trump's staff turnover is extremely high in comparison to previous Presidents? Do you have a better comparison?

Bold 2 : 

So then why not just look at recent Presidents? The gulf is still there... So your point is?

And, yes, the climate is terrible at the moment, you don't think a big part of that is due to Trump's own behaviour? Part of being an effective President is knowing how to present yourself and communicate in a way which results in the best perception... Trump deliberately goes out of his way to be divisive, so pretending that he's some innocent bistander is ridiculous!

Let's get specific, in your opinion - what percentage of the high turnover would you say is Trump's fault?



SpokenTruth said:

On to other topics....Trump told border patrol agents to break immigration law last Friday (4/6/19) and to lie to the judges about immigration information.  Patrol agent supervision advised those agents they would still be held accountable to the law if they violated it.  Today, Trump said he would pardon any border patrol agents and the Customs and Border Protection Commissioner if they violated the law as he suggested they do.

Ladies and gentlemen, the President of the United States of America just advised agents to violate the Constitution and would pardon them if they were indicted on said violations. This should concern us all.

I personally cannot wait if Trump tries to pull that move.  I do not believe Trump understands that if he were to cross the line and lose the support of the GOP, all hell would break loose.  Crossing the line of telling and having employees break the law and ignore the constitution probably would be where the GOP would leave him in huge droves.  

On a second note, I wonder if Munchin is willing to go to jail for Trump.  At some point, he will have to release Trump tax return to congress and if he doesn't he gets a nice fine and five years in Jail.  I wonder if Trump will pardon him as well because that would be glorious.  You really could not write this stuff up.



Biggerboat1 said:

It almost makes me wonder whether you're actually just a very discreet troll - who keeps it toned down enough to stay under the radar.

At some point in time, everyone comes to the same conclusions.  As you continue to argue points you will find that no matter the evidence presented, there are some people who just love to pull peoples chain.



EricHiggin said:

Machiavellian said:

Who said its not truthful.  Basically you have about 3 books out there from different people.  When all is said and done, its their word over Trumps even though some of the books has quotes from other people within the administration.  Most reasonable people who has followed this administration would have a hard time believing anything coming from Trump since he has a hard time with the truth.  There is no reason to not believe these people because multiple people inside the administration have said the same thing.  If you only believe what Trump says then I would have to believe you have a Messiah complex.

As to your second paragraph, you still throwing out words that has nothing to do with what I stated.  I said top positions. You know, the ones that need the President approval so you can stop with the every single hire nonsense. Lets just limit the scope to the Cabinet positions which is the ones he personally put his signature on.  As always you totally ignore Trump personal statement that he only hires the best people.  I know, its just another thing you can ignore from Trump since it doesn't fit with your defense.

Who said it is? What portion of those books are direct quotes? What portion of the book needs to be truthful to make the entire thing completely factual? There's only room for one Messiah and it's not Trump.

Just because Trump hires the best people, doesn't mean they meet his standards. Good enough for now until I can find someone better is sometimes necessary when you have as much to do and as much responsibility as he has, not to mention the constant negative media coverage, warranted and not. You can't just leave positions open for extended periods and expect to make worthy progress, even if that progress you make is less than you would like it to be.

You just called the books fiction.  As to the rest of the sentence, yeah, ok, sounds like a lot of waffling going on.

Lol at bolded.  I never seen someone waffle as much as you. You would have been better off not saying anything on that point.  Really, we all know it was just another hyperbolic statement from Trump but you actually are trying to justify it.  Lol, you bring a smile to my face during these conversations as you try to justify every dumb statement from Trump.  

Interesting enough, I was reading some psychology books and came across the Dunning-Kruger effect.  I should have know they would have a condition for Trump already spelled out.

Anyway this should be fun.  As we continue this conversation, I will bring up more dumb hyperbolic statements from Trump and you can have the fun of finding ways to justify them.



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Machiavellian said:
EricHiggin said:

Who said it is? What portion of those books are direct quotes? What portion of the book needs to be truthful to make the entire thing completely factual? There's only room for one Messiah and it's not Trump.

Just because Trump hires the best people, doesn't mean they meet his standards. Good enough for now until I can find someone better is sometimes necessary when you have as much to do and as much responsibility as he has, not to mention the constant negative media coverage, warranted and not. You can't just leave positions open for extended periods and expect to make worthy progress, even if that progress you make is less than you would like it to be.

You just called the books fiction.  As to the rest of the sentence, yeah, ok, sounds like a lot of waffling going on.

Lol at bolded.  I never seen someone waffle as much as you. You would have been better off not saying anything on that point.  Really, we all know it was just another hyperbolic statement from Trump but you actually are trying to justify it.  Lol, you bring a smile to my face during these conversations as you try to justify every dumb statement from Trump.  

Interesting enough, I was reading some psychology books and came across the Dunning-Kruger effect.  I should have know they would have a condition for Trump already spelled out.

Anyway this should be fun.  As we continue this conversation, I will bring up more dumb hyperbolic statements from Trump and you can have the fun of finding ways to justify them.

No i do not think that is the condition you could attach to Trump.

The man has skills but poorly political and diplomatic skills,i do think his problem is that he thinks he can use his businessman experience in the White house and that it would translate in being a good president.



Pete Buttigieg is officially running for President. 



I've been reading the Andre Yang platform and listening to his interviews. I think he is the best choice for 2020 to save this country. https://www.yang2020.com/policies/
#YangGang2020;



Biggerboat1 said:
EricHiggin said:

Neither is pissing into the wind, but simply taking a few evident things into account would quickly reveal, aimlessly doing just that would be quite foolish.

If I'm missing something it's not the expressed context. Some are. 

Apples to apples? You missed the point. How large was the Gov when it started compared to now? Much bigger Gov, in a time of promoted victimhood and (legal) retaliation, more problems? How much of an issue was the media for the Gov when it started compared to now? Much more (opinionated) media, instantly broadcasting worldwide, more problems? 

The climate is much worse today then it's ever been, did you know that? - Sure, everyone knows that, but what's your point? - Don't you want to know why it's changing and what's causing it? - Why would you ask that? That wouldn't be an apples to apples comparison anymore now then would it?

Bold 1 :

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here to be honest... You're agreeing that interpreting the revolving door comment isn't difficult (yet you failed to do so), and neither is pissing into the wind... Why is it foolish to note that Trump's staff turnover is extremely high in comparison to previous Presidents? Do you have a better comparison?

Bold 2 : 

So then why not just look at recent Presidents? The gulf is still there... So your point is?

And, yes, the climate is terrible at the moment, you don't think a big part of that is due to Trump's own behaviour? Part of being an effective President is knowing how to present yourself and communicate in a way which results in the best perception... Trump deliberately goes out of his way to be divisive, so pretending that he's some innocent bistander is ridiculous!

Let's get specific, in your opinion - what percentage of the high turnover would you say is Trump's fault?

I'm saying if you didn't think about the fact that the wind was blowing, and in what direction, pissing into the wind would get you covered in urine. Who wouldn't take the wind and it's direction into account? Who's mindlessly ok with drenching themselves in piss? Just looking at Trumps turnover rate vs other Presidents doesn't take anything else into account, and to assume Trump is mindlessly hiring and firing people just to pass the time would be foolish.

Based on your apples to apples argument, all people would have to argue climate change is a difference in temperature, that's it. No CO2 levels, no ocean levels, just temperature. Who's going to agree climate change is definitely a problem if you can't use causes to back it up? Who's going to be able to agree why Trump is firing so many people if all we can look at is the turnover rate and that's it?

The same if not a somewhat lesser percentage than previous administrations due to the extra complexity that exists today.

Machiavellian said:
EricHiggin said:

Who said it is? What portion of those books are direct quotes? What portion of the book needs to be truthful to make the entire thing completely factual? There's only room for one Messiah and it's not Trump.

Just because Trump hires the best people, doesn't mean they meet his standards. Good enough for now until I can find someone better is sometimes necessary when you have as much to do and as much responsibility as he has, not to mention the constant negative media coverage, warranted and not. You can't just leave positions open for extended periods and expect to make worthy progress, even if that progress you make is less than you would like it to be.

You just called the books fiction.  As to the rest of the sentence, yeah, ok, sounds like a lot of waffling going on.

Lol at bolded.  I never seen someone waffle as much as you. You would have been better off not saying anything on that point.  Really, we all know it was just another hyperbolic statement from Trump but you actually are trying to justify it.  Lol, you bring a smile to my face during these conversations as you try to justify every dumb statement from Trump.  

Interesting enough, I was reading some psychology books and came across the Dunning-Kruger effect.  I should have know they would have a condition for Trump already spelled out.

Anyway this should be fun.  As we continue this conversation, I will bring up more dumb hyperbolic statements from Trump and you can have the fun of finding ways to justify them.

I just asked a question like you did. I eat waffles for breakfast.

So your saying it's not possible for a person to have higher standards than the available people they're able to hire in a given amount of time? Then why are we bothering to try and get to Mars? Might as well just lower our standards to the moon because we know we can achieve that apparently. What kind of idiot would even dare strive for Mars... Are they idiots?

The irony of the DK effect, is that those who point out others who suffer from it, may very well have it backwards, and not know it.

Your right, this is fun.



jason1637 said:
I've been reading the Andre Yang platform and listening to his interviews. I think he is the best choice for 2020 to save this country. https://www.yang2020.com/policies/
#YangGang2020;

I'm a little confused, isn't Andrew Yang running on, amongst other things, universal basic income?

And, if I remember correctly, your stance was that people shouldn't rely on handouts, but instead should 'get better jobs' and 'try harder'...?

Isn't there a bit of inconsistency there?