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Forums - General Discussion - "Leaving Neverland": Do you think Michael Jackson is Innocent?


Thriller and Invincible or Bad and Dangerous

Good guy, wrongly accused 55 51.89%
Talented Bad guy 28 26.42%
A little of both. 23 21.70%
foodfather said:
Anyone who followed the original case knows that these characters, especially Wade Wilson is a tool. He claimed he was innocent at first and even attended MJ's televised memorial. The maid on the doc is also someone who was fired for steeling from the Neverland.

Yes, MJ is very odd and probably attracted to children but is not the monster they are making him out to be. Especially based on this doc. Its a joke.

Victims routinely lie for their abusers, whether its sexual abuse or physical abuse. Especially young children, in many cases they’re groomed to worship and depend on their abusers. It’s no surprise whatsoever that one or more of these kids would have said MJ was doing nothing wrong. He trained them to do so.

Hell, watch Abducted In Plain Sight on Netflix. It’s about a girl who was groomed by a sexual predator and was twice kidnapped by this dude. Both times she stuck up for him, lied for him, and wanted to go back to him. The dude befriended both parents to gain a ridiculous amount of access to the girl, who was 12 at the time I think. She would have said anything to keep her abuser out of trouble.

Theres no rational reason to believe MJ was anything other than a piece of shit pedophile after you see or read about the documentary, read what the FBI found in his houses in the early 90’s and 00’s and just by observing his fucking behavior back then. He wasn’t even trying to hide it.

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Xxain said:
The only thing out of that Documentary that has me considering the idea that I should try to consider the possibility that MJ did not cool things is one of the guys has been in mental health therapy for coping with self hatred and refuses to speak to his mother(who is also in mental health therapy) for letting him stay at neverland unsupervised. That cant be faked for this long.

I'd recommend to read my post above as well, but we can do terrible things to our own psychology through worry, inner thoughts, and the actions resulting. It is never primarily the events themselves that cause the mental distress, no matter how warranted, but how we perceive the events. It is the mind that generates the confusion and chaos of the psychological aftermath. It is possible that the questioning and family situations at the time of these suspicions may have led to confusion in the child as well as the mother, in an effect that spiraled out of control. The fact that both of them have had mental health therapy is telling of how they handled the "possibility" (real or not) of the situation.  A child's entire world is affected and even defined by parents and what they are introduced to during the developmental years.  The mother's worry and upset, even though she was not present, probably had a profound influence on the child, immediately and over time.  The trauma of being put through the rigors of the "possibility" of an event can be just as impactful and damaging as the event itself, causing long term psychological effects. 

When I was a little child, 6 or 7, I saw Beetlejuice and the scene where Michael Keaton grabbed his crotch and said, "Nice F***in Model."  I immediately turned around and repeated it to my family.  Then I went to school and repeated it to classmates in the cafeteria. Luckily no teachers saw me, but because a big deal wasn't made over it, I never knew I was cussing.  I didn't know that grabbing my crotch like that was inappropriate either; I simply thought it was a funny action/moment in the movie. I only repeated the action that one day, but if they had made a big deal about it, then I may have all kinds of psychological issues surrounding cussing, grabbing my crotch, repeating things I see on TV, etc.  I may have developed an obsession with or strong  subconscious aversion to any one of those activities to help reconcile the importance of the event and the associated distress in my mind, even to the point of acting irrationally out of context for situations that I may have linked to those concepts along the way.  Maybe even building to the point of hate or violence depending on the severity and nature of the discipline response.

Also to this effect, it is actually more likely that the child would not want to speak to the mother because of the distress "she" directly caused him than for a decision she made that led to distress she didn't know about.  The distress is what would create the distaste to talk to his mother, but the child/parent relationship is so complex with many situations that any one, especially an indirect one, taking supreme precedence over the others is unlikely, unless there were a running thread of distaste throughout them all that cannot be overlooked, i.e. her method of parenting, overly emphasizing the situation to the point of distress, not being a source of comfort when it is expected, constantly denying the situation happened when it did, etc. The fact that he refuses to talk to her is actually more evidence that there was strong distress sourced from her and not the situation, at least in some form. 

Last edited by zygote - on 14 March 2019

I changed my mind about wanting to get involved in this.

Last edited by COKTOE - on 14 March 2019

- "If you have the heart of a true winner, you can always get more pissed off than some other asshole."

I'm not sure, but I did think it was funny how one of Razorfist's (The Rageaholic) recent videos used the "the man is dead" excuse as a way to argue for sympathy against defamers when he made like an entire John McCain rant like right after he died.

He's as innocent as OJ Simpson.

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He probably done it.

Hiku said:

My memory of details are hazy, but I seem to recall at least one party admitting they made things up in order to get money.
He seemed like he could have been a very kind person. Though I don't know what to think, and grown men wanting to spend that much time with kids is suspicious and I don't think parents should allow unsupervised visits no matter who it is.

I haven't seen the latest documentary, but since he is dead, I think no matter what the truth is, his art should still live on as it's been such a strong inspiration and influence on countless people.

3sexty said: 

The one boy and prob one of the more recent ones to becone close to MJ and to this day still close to MJ's family had this to say when pressed about the accusations. If you read his history and his relationship to Michael it certainly appears more like a love affair.the way Michael befriended the parents to gain access to the child seemed frightfully similar to all the other stories. 

“I don’t wish to say too much about it, but I will say Michael in many ways was very innocent. But you can’t expect everybody to have the same view on everything. […] To him certain things was natural and completely innocent, things that not necessarily all people would view the same way.”

– Omer Bhatti towards Elle (a norwegian magazine)

Sounds to me like he is referring to how Michael would have the kids at his amusement park and sleepovers.
Those are the things people find suspicious, for good reason.

You sure could be right there. It is a very vague statement though and leaves alot to interpretation. 

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LudicrousSpeed said:

Theres no rational reason to believe MJ was anything other than a piece of shit pedophile after you see or read about the documentary, read what the FBI found in his houses in the early 90’s and 00’s and just by observing his fucking behavior back then. He wasn’t even trying to hide it.

The FBI found found nothing in 300 pages of documents on him. 

As was the case with Brett Kavanaugh, the issue is not whether we believe him to be innocent or not, but whether there is proof that he is guilty. That is all that matters, and cleary there is not and has never been been any since he was never found guilty in a court of law. To come after him now, now that he's dead and can't defend himself, is just sickening. When I read the simpsons creators explain why they've decided to ban the Michael Jackson episode because of this, it's absolutely disgusting. They have been aware of what the accusations are and have never had issues with it. And now it's all "Oh, we believe he's guilty, so we're banning the episode". Rather, they profited off of him as much as they could during his life, and now they see this as a way to get a "second bang" for their buck by throwing him under the bus, hoping it'll satisfy and please the bloodthirsty lefties who believe accusations without proof should be enough to ruin a person's reputation and win them their favors.

Those who are ready to condemn Jackson now had better hope no one they love meets the same fate. If someone they know and love has something similar happen to them, I hope the guilt of knowing that they contributed to creating such a world by blindly believing "victims" and by not asking for proof will haunt them until they die.

My take has always been this: I find it highly dubious that MJ ever had sex with anyone, any grown ass woman (or man), let alone some little kid. I think he was a "FREAK", yes, absolutely. His dad fucked him up psychologically big time, and he felt SO strongly that he was robbed of having a childhood, that when he grew up, had his own money and was independent of his pops finally, he was determined, in his head, to make up for that. MJ was always a big kid. Psychologically, emotionally, etc., he acted like a kid.

Does that PRECLUDE him from molesting kids? No. Is it POSSIBLE that he did? Of course. But do I believe he did? No, I don't, and never have. This documentary is highly dubious. The two main figures in it testified in court, UNDER OATH, in favor of Jackson, against other alleged victims, claiming he was innocent. There is a quote from Robson after Jackson's death in 2009, praising the shit out of him and claiming he'll never forget him or the positive impact he had. Then come 2013, these two guys file a joint lawsuit against the Jackson Estate, for $1.5 billion. Because yeah, it's TOTALLY not about money. Now they do this smut documentary by HBO, which everyone and their fucking brother decides "YUP, it's proof! NO WAY these guys are faking." Right.

At the end of the day, people are going to believe what they want to believe, full stop.