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Forums - Gaming - Update: Jade Raymond joins Google as Vice President | Rumor: Google's gaming console details leaked, possible controller design revealed via patent

OTBWY on 11 March 2019
thismeintiel said:
OTBWY said:

Sorry but that is some janky logic. In the 3D era, our left stick is the primary control option for movement. You thumb should be on it most of the time. But because how it was placed on the PS controller, was due to keeping with the formfactor, not because they thought it was super clever. Many games on the PS1 still used the d-pad prominently cause you know, the PS! first came with a controller with no sticks. We however came to find out that offset works best because we developed upon already great left thumb stick up controllers. The camera movement in all this is secondary, as many games still have facebuttons as primary controls (meaning it should be level with your left stick). The only way you can make the argument that the left and both right stick are primary is if you are talking about fps games, which in all honesty is an inferior experience on console anyway, but the dualshock makes it all the more uncomfortable with the wide reach of your thumb and your index fingers on the triggers, hence crabclaw.

And this is what I was talking about when I said reaching for excuses to defend the offset sticks. If it really is that much of a stretch for you to reach them on a DS4, you must have exceptionally small hands. My hands aren't very large and when grip the DS4, my thumbs rest comfortably between the Dpad/face buttons and the thumbsticks. I barely have to move them to reach h what I need to hit. It's comfortable to play for hours with it.

Dante9 said: 
The controller thing is about what you have gotten used to. Defending offset just for the sake of offset doesn't make any sense. Our hands are symmetrical, not asymmetrical. If you're fine with the position of one stick, then obviously you should be fine with the other stick being on the same level, unless you have two different hands.

Exactly.

You know what you're doing right. I mean, you're being very hypocritical when you think people are making excuses to justify their choice of controller layout. I can say the same thing. All you guys do is excuse the bad dualshock layout, which was bad from inception. And now that you're used to it, you defend it. Also, let me tell that with any type of hand, the dualshock gets to most uncomfortable when play long hours on end. You can not deny that, and people who read this know it is true but are not willing to admit it. Also, how nice is it that with the DS's stick placement your thumbs can touch if you have big hands.



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DonFerrari on 11 March 2019
killeryoshis said:
I hope that the controller isn't final. Symmetry duel sticks are terrible for modern games. Also, Google entering the console race would be interesting. I feel like it will just split the Sony-Microsoft market share more though. Nintendo is so different that they are much harder to take sales from. If Google does good enough they could split sales enough that the Switch wins Generation 9 no problem. That would be funny to see.

Anyway, I will wait until it is announced to see if they actually will join the race. Google grabbing Sega as a pseudo 1st party is excellent. They had the 2nd best 1st party support ever in the history of the industry. Also, Sega's games are very Nintendo- like and can take some sales from them.

Please explain how the symmetry dual stick are terrible when in the last 5-10 years most GOTYs have been on Playstation without any issue due to the controller?

Manlytears said:
OTBWY said:

Sorry but, I like my thumbs on the things we use most. A stick on the left and face buttons of the right. So offset is the way to go. The dualshock is crabclaw, so if you like that I think you're blatantly biased against humans.

Both options of analog stick work great, but, imho, Dualshock symmetrical desing got one major advantage in games. The possibility of using the Claw grip technique on the D-pad, i realy like to use it while playing games like dark souls, monster hunter or any other game that need quick access to d-pad. On such games the offset stick realy fell like a major flaw.

Never had to use claw grip once, and I have some thousand trophies over several hundred games played on PS since PS1.

thismeintiel said:
OTBWY said:

Sorry but that is some janky logic. In the 3D era, our left stick is the primary control option for movement. You thumb should be on it most of the time. But because how it was placed on the PS controller, was due to keeping with the formfactor, not because they thought it was super clever. Many games on the PS1 still used the d-pad prominently cause you know, the PS! first came with a controller with no sticks. We however came to find out that offset works best because we developed upon already great left thumb stick up controllers. The camera movement in all this is secondary, as many games still have facebuttons as primary controls (meaning it should be level with your left stick). The only way you can make the argument that the left and both right stick are primary is if you are talking about fps games, which in all honesty is an inferior experience on console anyway, but the dualshock makes it all the more uncomfortable with the wide reach of your thumb and your index fingers on the triggers, hence crabclaw.

And this is what I was talking about when I said reaching for excuses to defend the offset sticks. If it really is that much of a stretch for you to reach them on a DS4, you must have exceptionally small hands. My hands aren't very large and when grip the DS4, my thumbs rest comfortably between the Dpad/face buttons and the thumbsticks. I barely have to move them to reach h what I need to hit. It's comfortable to play for hours with it.

Dante9 said: 
The controller thing is about what you have gotten used to. Defending offset just for the sake of offset doesn't make any sense. Our hands are symmetrical, not asymmetrical. If you're fine with the position of one stick, then obviously you should be fine with the other stick being on the same level, unless you have two different hands.

Exactly.

My hands aren't big and I never had any issue on fastly changing my finger from analog to d-pad (well I rarely even need to use it anyway) nor I never felt umconfortable playing with DS. Due to low playtime when I get an Xbox controller I'm a little off and of course when getting back to DS3 it feels strange after using DS4 for 5 years... but also is strange to hold PS2, PS1, Genesis or any other controller since I haven't played them for ages.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

RaptorChrist on 11 March 2019

Sony didn't originally have analog sticks on the PS1 controller. Didn't Sony add them because the N64 came out and they needed to be competitive in that space? I dunno. That would mean that the only reason they aren't offset is because they retained the same controller layout they always had from the beginning.

BraLod, I am calling you out for your nonsense. You pretty much said that the only reason other companies don't have analog sticks that are symmetrical is because Sony did it first and they would be copying. I think you and I both know that's just nonsense. In your argument you even implied that symmetrical sticks are superior as though it wasn't up for debate, despite the majority feeling the opposite.

In fact, I don't think it's a total stretch of the imagination to picture a world where Sony actually switches to an offset controller layout down the road. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on such a travesty.



DonFerrari on 11 March 2019
OTBWY said:
thismeintiel said:

And this is what I was talking about when I said reaching for excuses to defend the offset sticks. If it really is that much of a stretch for you to reach them on a DS4, you must have exceptionally small hands. My hands aren't very large and when grip the DS4, my thumbs rest comfortably between the Dpad/face buttons and the thumbsticks. I barely have to move them to reach h what I need to hit. It's comfortable to play for hours with it.

Exactly.

You know what you're doing right. I mean, you're being very hypocritical when you think people are making excuses to justify their choice of controller layout. I can say the same thing. All you guys do is excuse the bad dualshock layout, which was bad from inception. And now that you're used to it, you defend it. Also, let me tell that with any type of hand, the dualshock gets to most uncomfortable when play long hours on end. You can not deny that, and people who read this know it is true but are not willing to admit it. Also, how nice is it that with the DS's stick placement your thumbs can touch if you have big hands.

It isn't unusual for me to play for 16h on a day, with pause just for food and piss. Never got tired and I'm 5'6" so my hand isn't very big.

And from all we know X360 controller was the one considered good for big hands and DS3 for small hands.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari on 11 March 2019
RaptorChrist said:
Sony didn't originally have analog sticks on the PS1 controller. Didn't Sony add them because the N64 came out and they needed to be competitive in that space? I dunno. That would mean that the only reason they aren't offset is because they retained the same controller layout they always had from the beginning.

BraLod, I am calling you out for your nonsense. You pretty much said that the only reason other companies don't have analog sticks that are symmetrical is because Sony did it first and they would be copying. I think you and I both know that's just nonsense. In your argument you even implied that symmetrical sticks are superior as though it wasn't up for debate, despite the majority feeling the opposite.

In fact, I don't think it's a total stretch of the imagination to picture a world where Sony actually switches to an offset controller layout down the road. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on such a travesty.

8 months from release of N64 to release of dual analog on PS1. It would hardly be due to the success of N64.

Sure the original controller likely looked like SNES due to Sony PS being due to Nintendo fucking they over on a partnership and they likely rushing and keeping same design.

Considering they had to not only develop the controller but also games supporting it, for me it seems more like they were going on that direction anyway. Also if they were copying Nintendo they wouldn't have used 2 analogs.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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Manlytears on 11 March 2019
OTBWY said:
thismeintiel said:

And this is what I was talking about when I said reaching for excuses to defend the offset sticks. If it really is that much of a stretch for you to reach them on a DS4, you must have exceptionally small hands. My hands aren't very large and when grip the DS4, my thumbs rest comfortably between the Dpad/face buttons and the thumbsticks. I barely have to move them to reach h what I need to hit. It's comfortable to play for hours with it.

Exactly.

You know what you're doing right. I mean, you're being very hypocritical when you think people are making excuses to justify their choice of controller layout. I can say the same thing. All you guys do is excuse the bad dualshock layout, which was bad from inception. And now that you're used to it, you defend it. Also, let me tell that with any type of hand, the dualshock gets to most uncomfortable when play long hours on end. You can not deny that, and people who read this know it is true but are not willing to admit it. Also, how nice is it that with the DS's stick placement your thumbs can touch if you have big hands.

Whit all due respect, the level of arrogance on this statement is just.... damn!!! You insist that offset is the best and symmetrical is wrong! Why not accept that both are good!? Why not accept that there are people that feel better whit symmetrical?

I even bring up the "claw technique" that, imho, is great for use on games like nioh, dark souls and monster Hunter, something that is impossible to do on Offset controller! Why can't you accept opinions that are different from yours? People here are accepting that Offset works well, and it's all about preferences, but you insist in saying symmetrical is bad and doens't work! Tha's very arrogant way to put things.

Last edited by Manlytears - on 11 March 2019

Manlytears on 11 March 2019

Manlytears said:

Both options of analog stick work great, but, imho, Dualshock symmetrical desing got one major advantage in games. The possibility of using the Claw grip technique on the D-pad, i realy like to use it while playing games like dark souls, monster hunter or any other game that need quick access to d-pad. On such games the offset stick realy fell like a major flaw.

Never had to use claw grip once, and I have some thousand trophies over several hundred games played on PS since PS1.

you should try, I consider the technique very convenient and, with practice, the movement becomes very natural to do things like changing weapons and selecting items. it's one of the things I like in symmetrical controls, just make a regular grip and slide your index finger into the dpad when needed.



RingoGaSuki on 11 March 2019

I mean, it looks better than Ouya, but that is a loooooooow bar to clear. Even with Sega exclusives, the only thing that would interest me is Super Monkey Ball and that isn't worth the price of a console



Manlytears on 11 March 2019
shikamaru317 said:
Intrinsic said:
Lol... google console.

This is going to be a tegra powered android box. That has pre installd aps to connect to google streamin services and that ships with a controller. Kinda the same way we have a Fire TV cube. This will be a much more powerful chromecast box. The exclusives they aremaking (if they are) is just there way to get people to actually sign up to their service, kinda like netflix/prime originals.

The Streaming Box is a separate box called Project Yeti. Project Metallurgy is a line of actual consoles they have been working on according to leakers, the strongest of which is more powerful than Xbox One X. The current plan seems to be for the Yeti Streaming Box and Metallurgy Titanium console to release alongside each other. That being said, while Titanium is an actual console, it is supposedly the an all-digital console with no disc drive. 

About GPU, any leaks about Nvidia or AMD involved in the project? 



Eagle367 on 11 March 2019

Just a note, the renders are made by some guy on twitter. Only the black and white outlines are accurate. So the colours, buttons, dimensions all can be different



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also