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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Manhunt 2 on Wii preview and Screens on IGN

HappySqurriel on 27 May 2007
windbane said:
 

I would not lump Saw in with those other movies.  It's not a horror movie.

What is the height of horror movies to you?   Friday the 13th (the first of which was also a murder mystery, believe it or not), Nightmare on Elm Street, and Halloween?  Because those probably defined the genre for awhile in America, and that's pretty much what the current horror movies are like.

Scream started the teen horror movie trend, and The Ring started the Japanese horror trend.  Do you prefer those paths?

My problem with horror movies is the cheap scare.  Most start off innocent, then have a nice fake scare (far too many bats and cats), then the gore starts with loud sounds to startle you.  That includes all paths I've mentioned.

Hitchcock, I'm told, did more suspense than horror, so I look forward to watching those.  I'm just not sure what kind of horror movie you prefer, because the genre has never been maybe what it could be.  Maybe you like The Exorcist?

Oh, and in my opinion, Manhunt was a great game for what it did, so you can disagree with my opinion but you can't tell me I'm wrong. 

 

First let us define horror, according to the <a href="http://www.horror.org/horror-is.htm">Horror Writers Association</a>

Webster's Collegiate Dictionary gives the primary definition of horror as "a painful and intense fear, dread, or dismay." It stands to reason then that "horror fiction" is fiction that elicits those emotions in the reader.

If we accept this definition, then horror can deal with the mundane or the supernatural, with the fantastic or the normal. It doesn't have to be full of ghosts, ghouls, and things to go bump in the night. Its only true requirement is that it elicit an emotional reaction that includes some aspect of fear or dread. Alice Sebold's The Lovely Bones is therefore just as much a horror novel as Stephen King's Salem's Lot. Tim LaHay's Left Behind series is just as full of horror as Dan Simmons' A Winter Haunting. By this definition, the best selling book of all time, the Bible, could easily be labeled horror, for where else can you find fallen angels, demonic possessions, and an apocalypse absolutely terrifying in its majesty all in one volume?

In his 1982 anthology Prime Evil, author Douglas Winter stated, "Horror is not a genre, like the mystery or science fiction or the western. It is not a kind of fiction, meant to be confined to the ghetto of a special shelf in libraries or bookstores. Horror is an emotion." He was correct and his words have become a rallying cry for the modern horror writer.

Saw is a horror movie and even IMDB has it listed as a horror movie. Anyways ...

The height of horror movies? <a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081505/">The Shining</a>, <a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078748/">Alien</a> and <a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0073195/">Jaws</a>. At the time movies like The Exorcist and Rosemary's Baby were very good horror movies but (because of how secular we are now) are not scary like they used to be.

Movies like Friday the 13th, Nightmare on Elmstreet, and Halloween are far (FAR) better versions of the same type of "Gorror" movies that are being created today; these movies are better mainly because they decided to develop motivations for the murder's actions, built interesting characters that you don't want to see die, and actually had a story line so there was a motivation beyond seeing graphic violence to keep watching the movie.

20 years from now people will still watch and talk about The Shining, Alien and Jaws but few people will have any memory of the current crop of crappy horror movies.



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windbane on 27 May 2007
HappySqurriel said:
windbane said:
 

I would not lump Saw in with those other movies. It's not a horror movie.

What is the height of horror movies to you? Friday the 13th (the first of which was also a murder mystery, believe it or not), Nightmare on Elm Street, and Halloween? Because those probably defined the genre for awhile in America, and that's pretty much what the current horror movies are like.

Scream started the teen horror movie trend, and The Ring started the Japanese horror trend. Do you prefer those paths?

My problem with horror movies is the cheap scare. Most start off innocent, then have a nice fake scare (far too many bats and cats), then the gore starts with loud sounds to startle you. That includes all paths I've mentioned.

Hitchcock, I'm told, did more suspense than horror, so I look forward to watching those. I'm just not sure what kind of horror movie you prefer, because the genre has never been maybe what it could be. Maybe you like The Exorcist?

Oh, and in my opinion, Manhunt was a great game for what it did, so you can disagree with my opinion but you can't tell me I'm wrong.

 

First let us define horror, according to the Horror Writers Association

Webster's Collegiate Dictionary gives the primary definition of horror as "a painful and intense fear, dread, or dismay." It stands to reason then that "horror fiction" is fiction that elicits those emotions in the reader.

If we accept this definition, then horror can deal with the mundane or the supernatural, with the fantastic or the normal. It doesn't have to be full of ghosts, ghouls, and things to go bump in the night. Its only true requirement is that it elicit an emotional reaction that includes some aspect of fear or dread. Alice Sebold's The Lovely Bones is therefore just as much a horror novel as Stephen King's Salem's Lot. Tim LaHay's Left Behind series is just as full of horror as Dan Simmons' A Winter Haunting. By this definition, the best selling book of all time, the Bible, could easily be labeled horror, for where else can you find fallen angels, demonic possessions, and an apocalypse absolutely terrifying in its majesty all in one volume?

In his 1982 anthology Prime Evil, author Douglas Winter stated, "Horror is not a genre, like the mystery or science fiction or the western. It is not a kind of fiction, meant to be confined to the ghetto of a special shelf in libraries or bookstores. Horror is an emotion." He was correct and his words have become a rallying cry for the modern horror writer.

Saw is a horror movie and even IMDB has it listed as a horror movie. Anyways ...

The height of horror movies? The Shining, Alien and Jaws. At the time movies like The Exorcist and Rosemary's Baby were very good horror movies but (because of how secular we are now) are not scary like they used to be.

Movies like Friday the 13th, Nightmare on Elmstreet, and Halloween are far (FAR) better versions of the same type of "Gorror" movies that are being created today; these movies are better mainly because they decided to develop motivations for the murder's actions, built interesting characters that you don't want to see die, and actually had a story line so there was a motivation beyond seeing graphic violence to keep watching the movie.

20 years from now people will still watch and talk about The Shining, Alien and Jaws but few people will have any memory of the current crop of crappy horror movies.


Wow. Here's what I just saw on IMDB for Saw:

Genre:

Crime / Horror / Mystery / Thriller

So yes, horror is listed, but is secondary and only part of the genre description.

I've seen The Shining, and it was good. Alien and Jaws...ok.

I think people will remember Scream and The Ring.



windbane on 27 May 2007
shams said:
windbane said:

Wow. I have even less faith in Wii owners now. To hear most of you guys completely reject this game is pretty sad. I played Manhunt 1 on the PS2 and it was a great game. It's basically a stealth game like MGS but instead of breaking necks you kill them in varied ways. The story in Manhunt 1 was actually good. There is a reason you are killing the badguys.

 

Oh come on. I'm having less and less faith in your posts.

I love horror movies - but I don't like gore movies. I make a real distinction between the two. I like "horror" games (RE, Silent Hill, etc..., but I detest "gore" games. I remember when "Soldier of Fortune II" (PC) came out, and was sickened watching people 'have fun' blowing the limbs from people off (incapacitated people lying on the ground - helpless).

I respect the rights of others to enjoy gore movies/games - and I expect them to respect my rights to NOT enjoy gore movies/games. If you don't like Jack Thompson, don't turn into him.

...

This isn't about "killing" badguys - this is about killing them in ultra-gory ways on purpose. Its the key hook to the game.

You won't see any of these death sequences in Halo3 - no guesses why... MS knows how many sales it would lose.

 


Did you play Manhunt 1? 



Gballzack on 28 May 2007

1. Saw is a horror movie. And to anyone who says otherwise: what are you retarded? Was there a PG version released where you were? 2. Manhunt 1 wasn't that good a game, it was a popular game. Doing any of the gory or cool things it advertised almost always resulted in you losing the game. 3. Just because you don't like gory/violent/horror games doesn't mean you have to bring it here and make it an issue for everyone. I don't like Puzzle games but I don't go into every Puzzle game thread and declare it a sin on the console it was released. 4. I'm sick and tired of people thinking the Wii is a family system and hearing every yokle on the steet say the same thing. We need more mature games and if that scares off a few grannies and kids then so be it.



KruzeS on 28 May 2007
windbane said:

Wow. Here's what I just saw on IMDB for Saw:

Genre:

Crime / Horror / Mystery / Thriller

So yes, horror is listed, but is secondary and only part of the genre description.

Am I missing something or are genres simply listed alphabetically?



Reality has a Nintendo bias.
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Narfer on 28 May 2007

First real violent game? Uhh, Godfather? I just got that game and it rocks, and the fighting controls are completly unbeatable on the Wii. Its great, almost too sickingly fun and twisted feeling.



A delayed game is good someday, a bad game is bad forever.

ckmlb on 28 May 2007
Narfer said:
First real violent game? Uhh, Godfather? I just got that game and it rocks, and the fighting controls are completly unbeatable on the Wii. Its great, almost too sickingly fun and twisted feeling.

I said first good violent game... not first or you can mention Red Steel lol



Thanks to Blacksaber for the sig!

windbane on 28 May 2007
KruzeS said:
windbane said:

Wow. Here's what I just saw on IMDB for Saw:

Genre:

Crime / Horror / Mystery / Thriller

So yes, horror is listed, but is secondary and only part of the genre description.

Am I missing something or are genres simply listed alphabetically?


Well, it's not a classic horror movie.  The whole point of the movie is finding out who the killer is and how he did it. That's a mystery.  A crime movie.  Thrills, yes, scares, yes, but just because a movie has disturbing images does not mean it's strictly or firstly horror.

The original Friday the 13th was a horror movie but also a murder mystery.  Saw is all about the mystery of the crimes, and less about direct killing like Friday the 13th.  I question whether a lot of you have even see Saw or played Manhunt. 



windbane on 28 May 2007
Gballzack said:
1. Saw is a horror movie. And to anyone who says otherwise: what are you retarded? Was there a PG version released where you were? 2. Manhunt 1 wasn't that good a game, it was a popular game. Doing any of the gory or cool things it advertised almost always resulted in you losing the game. 3. Just because you don't like gory/violent/horror games doesn't mean you have to bring it here and make it an issue for everyone. I don't like Puzzle games but I don't go into every Puzzle game thread and declare it a sin on the console it was released. 4. I'm sick and tired of people thinking the Wii is a family system and hearing every yokle on the steet say the same thing. We need more mature games and if that scares off a few grannies and kids then so be it.

1.  Read my post right above this.

2.  Manhunt didn't sell a million, so it couldn't have been that popular.  I think it was a good game with a good story.

3.  Well said.

4.  Well said. 



z64dan on 28 May 2007

I only own the Wii as far as next-gen systems go, and I really don't care that a game like Manhunt 2 is going to be released on the system... But Nintendo is going to regret this reaaaal bad when the news runs a special story showing a kid playing Manhunt on his "dangerous" new Wii system. It will show him pulling out testicles or whatever, and the newswoman will explain "how you can protect your own children!" and possibly show Jack Thompson (or whoever) saying something. And it IS different than the PS2 and PSP, where you just press buttons. Hopefully that won't happen, but it might.