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Forums - Gaming Discussion - PUBG, Fortnite and More Reportedly Banned in China, with Some Developers Responding

 

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Total:29
Darwinianevolution said:
This kind of stuff makes me worried about Epic making their own store. It might seem unrelated, but considering Epic is owned by Tencent, and they are deeply in bed with the Chinese gobernment, this kind of censorship could be also seen in the West if they become big enough.

Hm. I didn't even realize that. It seems they only own 40% of Epic, and, quoting Tim Sweeny:  "Tencent otherwise has very little control on the creative output of Epic Games". I wouldn't worry too much.



- "If you have the heart of a true winner, you can always get more pissed off than some other asshole."

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COKTOE said:
Darwinianevolution said:
This kind of stuff makes me worried about Epic making their own store. It might seem unrelated, but considering Epic is owned by Tencent, and they are deeply in bed with the Chinese gobernment, this kind of censorship could be also seen in the West if they become big enough.

Hm. I didn't even realize that. It seems they only own 40% of Epic, and, quoting Tim Sweeny:  "Tencent otherwise has very little control on the creative output of Epic Games". I wouldn't worry too much.

Well, Tencent has enough money to outright buy them whole, and a lot to gain if the Epic store ever becomes the second biggest PC platform in the world. And once that happens, they can slowly but surely subvert it.



You know it deserves the GOTY.

Come join The 2018 Obscure Game Monthly Review Thread.

It is ironic that "being aware of your surroundings" did not make you aware of your own nationalism ... 

Eagle367 said:

I disagree. You probably don't know the relationship between Pakistan and US but I've lived it. The US used Pakistan like a tissue with it's war against the USSR and then threw Pakistan away. Again they needed Pakistan in the "war against terror" and again threw Pakistan away like a used tissue. The US never considered Pakistan as an allyaand only as a tool to be used. But Pakistan never learned it's lesson and kept trying to form a functioning relationship. Now Pakistan is tired. Because Pakistan has lost 1000s of times more than it's gained with trying to make a partnership with the US. We've lost in lives and in money. The measely aid given is easily lost considering how much money we've lost. And the US never wanted a resolution to the Afghanistan war because only the US military complex gained from it. Profit is all the motive for them. US was never "adult supervision" The US was a parasite and a leech to the middle East. And I agree Pakistan should only rely on itself and not other nations whether US or China.

Just because you've "lived" in conflict does not make you an authority regarding the factual events and what exactly was documented. The US did not even participate in the Soviet-Afghan War so your statement that the "US used Pakistan" is patently false since they've NEVER entered into the conflict. The US has only asked to to cooperate with Pakistan ONCE and when they do it, Pakistan is the one who backstabs the US along with NATO allies since your nation was likely the one harbouring vile war criminals like Osama Bin Laden ... 

Here's what representatives of the NATO allies had to say ...

Julia Gillard (former PM of Australia): "bin Laden "absolutely" had a support network in Pakistan" ...

Alan Juppe (former foreign minister of France): "I find it a little difficult to imagine that the presence of someone like bin Laden in a big compound in a relatively small town, even if located at 80 km from the center of Islamabad, could go completely unnoticed" ... 

David Cameron (former PM of UK): "The fact that Bin Laden was living in a large house in a populated area suggests that he must have had a support network in Pakistan" ... 

What do you have to say in defense of your nation for acting in bad faith while NATO allied forces were busting their asses in Afghanistan against terrorist groups who being sheltered in Pakistan ? It's not just the US who doubts Pakistan but the same applies to the other NATO allies ... 

The US allied with Pakistan once and never again will they ever have to put up with the bullcrap they served to them since it was Pakistan who actively tried to jeopardize diplomatic ties but again keep up the propaganda about how the US somehow kept continuously being involved in your nation's armed disputes. As far as the US aid is concerned, Pakistan is directly reimbursed whereas the US has spent trillions which dwarfs whatever contributions Pakistan made to the cause all the while they are still paying them. You think Pakistan is the only one with severe losses ? 

"only the US military complex gained from it. Profit is all the motive for them", the same could be said of any country especially in Pakistan's case of supporting terrorist groups in India and Afghanistan. Considering that the US didn't actively harbour terrorist groups behind their allies, I'd say they were definitely the ones with adult supervision when compared to Pakistan ...

Eagle367 said:

But the relationship between Pakistan and China is a unique one. You see Pakistan was doing really good in the 60s before the Afghanistan mess, and formation of Bangladesh and all that. While China was not doing so hot. Pakistan was the first one to help China and also one of thevery few who fought for China to be included in the UN. Now China is a huge beast and at least to Pakistan, wants to help the country that helped it in it's time of need. China might be using that relationship to it's advantage, I don't know since I am not Chinese leadership. 

The relationship between Pakistan and China is not at all special but were in fact mostly neutral. As far as I can see Pakistan was never "doing really good" ever since it first gained independence. If having no golden ages, no social progress, and tons of conflicts with India are classified as "doing really good" then your bar is set very low especially when leading up to Operation Searchlight ... (thank lord Bangladesh fought for it's own independence against the tyranny of Pakistan's military dictatorship) 

I don't think you understand a whole lot about China in general. It was actually the US who was a staunch supporter of China being included as a permanent member of the UN security council just before the chinese civil war. However, after the civil war it was contested in which of China's governments would be recognized to be the one to represent the UN since the nation was politically divided. China doesn't have any friends judging by the past record with it's neighbors so don't expect them to be friends either with Pakistan ... 

The vietnamese see them as an invader of their waters, russians faced a political break up with them, South Korea's pride of reunification was destroyed by them, North Korea is just plain annoying them, India has become wary of their occupation of Tibet, and they still have less than ideal relations with Japan ... 

Eagle367 said: 

The entire point though is that Pakistan cannot trust US because US will constantly betray us like they always have. Because the US does not respect smaller nations and their right to sovereignty and does not want partnerships but rather wants countries to bow down to them. China  has a more nuance approach and our businessmen. The US I'm sure would've destroyed Pakistan like it did Iraq, Afghanistan and so many others if we didn't have nukes.

Again, the US has only cooperated once with Pakistan ... 

If you think that the US does not respect a smaller nation's sovereignty and that China is somehow better in this regard then you're highly misinformed, LOL. Considering Pakistan has taken loans from China that they themselves can not likely finance to build the trading routes, Pakistan will soon realize they fell into a debt trap as they helplessly watch chinese state owned enterprises seize Pakistan's trading routes as a collateral. China's violated the sovereignty of other nations for much less as we see in the waters of South East Asia ... 

Had the UN not been created which originated in the US there would've been no political pressure to start a decolonization or independence movements. Would you have preferred the territory of Pakistan be under the rule of the British Raj instead ? 

The US can still destroy Pakistan if it wanted to because it's potential nuclear arsenal still doesn't provide enough long range capabilities to reach any major western powers ... 

Eagle367 said: 

Pakistan is reaching a breaking point where the military is not as strong as it once was and is desperately trying to maintain it's power, Pakistan is realising it cannot trust western powers because they will betray us and Pakistan has to be smart about China and CPEC. If it somehow manages to survive it's military gone mad, China's sly business tactics and the pressure of the Americans on the international stage, we will come out stronger than ever. We can make Gwadar a really big thing and if we start ruling our military instead of the military ruling us, we can treat Balochistan and all other provinces with respect and may rise up to be what was envisioned by our founding father. But on the flip side we might crash and burn and have to wait decades for another opportunity to rise up. I don't tjint Pakistan as a nation will end anytime soon, but the time is approaching for Pakistan to make it or break it.

Pakistan is indeed desperate since they feel the need to develop nuclear weapons but it didn't have much power to begin with ... 

Without support of western powers, Pakistan is becoming more isolated than ever just like North Korea did in the past which means an easy target for China. It's other neighbors such as Afghanistan or India doesn't like them and nearly nobody likes trading with Pakistan. One has to seriously wonder if it was worth it for Pakistan to pillage the US and it's allies in exchange for being geopolitically isolated ... 



StriderKiwi said:
Another reason why censorship and communism doesnt belong in *any* civilization.

There, fixed that for you.  



Eagle367 said:

<snip> if it's a principle thing, than I understand why you wouldn't wanna go there.

Why would anybody that values human freedom go to (and spend money in) a place so oppressive?  It is bad enough dealing with western PC culture.  But, in the west its just people bitching and whining.  In some eastern and middle eastern places government enforces ridiculous social conservative, and ridiculous ultra-left economic BS at the point of a gun.  Fuck those places.  Don't put your stamp of approval on them by vacationing there.  



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China considers gaming addiction a very serious problem, but trying solving it by prohibitionism is a dog chasing its own tail, as a repressed society worsens psychological conditions that favour addictions of any kind. This doesn't rule out that even in a free society it's always advisable to do what's possible to keep vulnerable minds away from things that favour addictions, and growing kids and youngest teens are still vulnerable even if they have all they need to stay totally sane and become sane adults, so even the most liberal nations do it for alcohol, tobacco and most drugs, even prescription ones, and gambling, it's a logical consequence to do it for some games that are deliberately designed to create addiction more than entertainment. But China government exceeds what would be reasonable, yes, Fortnite caused very strong addiction in a small but anyway worrying percentage of kids, but most of them already were either more vulnerable than average or neglected, or excessively repressed or pampered by their parents, the correct and most effective policy isn't to ban it completely, but both classifying it suitable to an older audience than kids and take better and wider measures to protect kids, chasing each single potentially addictive game won't ever be effective, and in the long term it will cost more than for example creating public structures and/or incentivise private ones that help vulnerable children doing more sport and exercise and having a better social life, that is proven to be one of the best ways to prevent and cure addictions.
China censorship trying to control the sexual life of adult citizens is just totalitarianism OTOH.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_addiction_in_China

Last edited by Alby_da_Wolf - on 16 December 2018

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fatslob-:O said:

It is ironic that "being aware of your surroundings" did not make you aware of your own nationalism ... 

Eagle367 said:

I disagree. You probably don't know the relationship between Pakistan and US but I've lived it. The US used Pakistan like a tissue with it's war against the USSR and then threw Pakistan away. Again they needed Pakistan in the "war against terror" and again threw Pakistan away like a used tissue. The US never considered Pakistan as an allyaand only as a tool to be used. But Pakistan never learned it's lesson and kept trying to form a functioning relationship. Now Pakistan is tired. Because Pakistan has lost 1000s of times more than it's gained with trying to make a partnership with the US. We've lost in lives and in money. The measely aid given is easily lost considering how much money we've lost. And the US never wanted a resolution to the Afghanistan war because only the US military complex gained from it. Profit is all the motive for them. US was never "adult supervision" The US was a parasite and a leech to the middle East. And I agree Pakistan should only rely on itself and not other nations whether US or China.

Just because you've "lived" in conflict does not make you an authority regarding the factual events and what exactly was documented. The US did not even participate in the Soviet-Afghan War so your statement that the "US used Pakistan" is patently false since they've NEVER entered into the conflict. The US has only asked to to cooperate with Pakistan ONCE and when they do it, Pakistan is the one who backstabs the US along with NATO allies since your nation was likely the one harbouring vile war criminals like Osama Bin Laden ... 

Here's what representatives of the NATO allies had to say ...

Julia Gillard (former PM of Australia): "bin Laden "absolutely" had a support network in Pakistan" ...

Alan Juppe (former foreign minister of France): "I find it a little difficult to imagine that the presence of someone like bin Laden in a big compound in a relatively small town, even if located at 80 km from the center of Islamabad, could go completely unnoticed" ... 

David Cameron (former PM of UK): "The fact that Bin Laden was living in a large house in a populated area suggests that he must have had a support network in Pakistan" ... 

What do you have to say in defense of your nation for acting in bad faith while NATO allied forces were busting their asses in Afghanistan against terrorist groups who being sheltered in Pakistan ? It's not just the US who doubts Pakistan but the same applies to the other NATO allies ... 

The US allied with Pakistan once and never again will they ever have to put up with the bullcrap they served to them since it was Pakistan who actively tried to jeopardize diplomatic ties but again keep up the propaganda about how the US somehow kept continuously being involved in your nation's armed disputes. As far as the US aid is concerned, Pakistan is directly reimbursed whereas the US has spent trillions which dwarfs whatever contributions Pakistan made to the cause all the while they are still paying them. You think Pakistan is the only one with severe losses ? 

"only the US military complex gained from it. Profit is all the motive for them", the same could be said of any country especially in Pakistan's case of supporting terrorist groups in India and Afghanistan. Considering that the US didn't actively harbour terrorist groups behind their allies, I'd say they were definitely the ones with adult supervision when compared to Pakistan ...

Eagle367 said:

But the relationship between Pakistan and China is a unique one. You see Pakistan was doing really good in the 60s before the Afghanistan mess, and formation of Bangladesh and all that. While China was not doing so hot. Pakistan was the first one to help China and also one of thevery few who fought for China to be included in the UN. Now China is a huge beast and at least to Pakistan, wants to help the country that helped it in it's time of need. China might be using that relationship to it's advantage, I don't know since I am not Chinese leadership. 

The relationship between Pakistan and China is not at all special but were in fact mostly neutral. As far as I can see Pakistan was never "doing really good" ever since it first gained independence. If having no golden ages, no social progress, and tons of conflicts with India are classified as "doing really good" then your bar is set very low especially when leading up to Operation Searchlight ... (thank lord Bangladesh fought for it's own independence against the tyranny of Pakistan's military dictatorship) 

I don't think you understand a whole lot about China in general. It was actually the US who was a staunch supporter of China being included as a permanent member of the UN security council just before the chinese civil war. However, after the civil war it was contested in which of China's governments would be recognized to be the one to represent the UN since the nation was politically divided. China doesn't have any friends judging by the past record with it's neighbors so don't expect them to be friends either with Pakistan ... 

The vietnamese see them as an invader of their waters, russians faced a political break up with them, South Korea's pride of reunification was destroyed by them, North Korea is just plain annoying them, India has become wary of their occupation of Tibet, and they still have less than ideal relations with Japan ... 

Eagle367 said: 

The entire point though is that Pakistan cannot trust US because US will constantly betray us like they always have. Because the US does not respect smaller nations and their right to sovereignty and does not want partnerships but rather wants countries to bow down to them. China  has a more nuance approach and our businessmen. The US I'm sure would've destroyed Pakistan like it did Iraq, Afghanistan and so many others if we didn't have nukes.

Again, the US has only cooperated once with Pakistan ... 

If you think that the US does not respect a smaller nation's sovereignty and that China is somehow better in this regard then you're highly misinformed, LOL. Considering Pakistan has taken loans from China that they themselves can not likely finance to build the trading routes, Pakistan will soon realize they fell into a debt trap as they helplessly watch chinese state owned enterprises seize Pakistan's trading routes as a collateral. China's violated the sovereignty of other nations for much less as we see in the waters of South East Asia ... 

Had the UN not been created which originated in the US there would've been no political pressure to start a decolonization or independence movements. Would you have preferred the territory of Pakistan be under the rule of the British Raj instead ? 

The US can still destroy Pakistan if it wanted to because it's potential nuclear arsenal still doesn't provide enough long range capabilities to reach any major western powers ... 

Eagle367 said: 

Pakistan is reaching a breaking point where the military is not as strong as it once was and is desperately trying to maintain it's power, Pakistan is realising it cannot trust western powers because they will betray us and Pakistan has to be smart about China and CPEC. If it somehow manages to survive it's military gone mad, China's sly business tactics and the pressure of the Americans on the international stage, we will come out stronger than ever. We can make Gwadar a really big thing and if we start ruling our military instead of the military ruling us, we can treat Balochistan and all other provinces with respect and may rise up to be what was envisioned by our founding father. But on the flip side we might crash and burn and have to wait decades for another opportunity to rise up. I don't tjint Pakistan as a nation will end anytime soon, but the time is approaching for Pakistan to make it or break it.

Pakistan is indeed desperate since they feel the need to develop nuclear weapons but it didn't have much power to begin with ... 

Without support of western powers, Pakistan is becoming more isolated than ever just like North Korea did in the past which means an easy target for China. It's other neighbors such as Afghanistan or India doesn't like them and nearly nobody likes trading with Pakistan. One has to seriously wonder if it was worth it for Pakistan to pillage the US and it's allies in exchange for being geopolitically isolated ... 

You clearly don't know anything about Pakistan's history. Nor do you seem to care to do your research. You can easily find online when Pakistan's growth in the 1969s was higher than all of it's neighbours and one of the highest in the region. Also how Pakistan helped China in the 1960s. And how Pakistan and US trained the mujahideen later becoming the Taliban to fight the Soviets. How US then stopped supporting Pakistan right after. How again US came to Pakistan after 9/11 and is now blaming Pakistan for it's own failures. Why would you even trust India or NATO in this. It's like asking the US about Russians. Indians hate Pakistan as a reality so of course they will be negative. And NATO was throughly embarrassed on Afghanistan and won't take the blame on themselves so they choose Pakistan, the easiest target. You have a problem with Usama bin Ladin in Pakistan near a complex? How the hell did some terrorists gain so much control as to attack the pentagon, world trade center and another flight all in one go. The US military, which is the best in the world, can show incompetence but pakistan can't? The very idea that LL your sources are western is what's wrong with your whole view point. Read what other nations who are not allowed with either the US or Pakistan in any meaningful way say about this. The west has a bias against Pakistan that much is obvious. Why shoul believe other narratives when I have my own experiences? Pakistan has suffered more than you can imagine from the tragedies and I, at least am not calling my government and army innocent in any capacity whatsoever. But I am not going to tolerate lies that portray that Pakistan is all evil and all the blame goes to Pakistan. The US has backstabbed Pakistan a couple of times and the very fact that you think Pakistan and the US only worked together once shows your ignorance. You have no idea and have done no research whatsoever. You only have a biased propaganda based view of the situation. 

You need to check your bias. It's showing heavy. And you think the US has not harboured terrorists at all? That's a big fat lie. And the fact that you view one side as all good and the other side as all bad just shows that western propaganda is working on you. Just read books by Pakistani authors for once. Or even historians rather than politicians. Also it's no use talking to someone who sees you, your people and your country as an evil entity. That means they are in no way trying to learn things and have a constructibe debate but rather put down any viewpoints that the other side is presenting. Same with how your view of China is rotten. You can learn some pretty incredible things that Chinese and pakostanisare doing if you let go of this one dimensional view of the world.

Is Pakistan innocent? No. Is China innocent? No. Is the US or Afghanistan innocent? No. Is NATO innocent? No. Is India? No

Is the US pure intentioned? Hell No! Is Pakistan pure intentioned? Hell No! Is anyone pure intentioned in this? Don't know, maybe the people living there who only want peace. 

Is Pakistan the most to blame? Not in my opinion.

Is the US the most to blame? In my informed opinion, yes. The US is the biggest player and the one who started it. They trianed Usama bin Ladin. They trained what became Taliban. They intentionally or unintentionally did things which resulted in the creation of daesh. They might've lost trillions, but their military complex made a lot of cash. No other country did. They've lost the least in terms of actual human life while have killed a lot of innocents. They breach borders and have killed innocent Pakistanis in drone strikes. They still have the least to lose other than their dignity and respect. 



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also

VAMatt said:
Eagle367 said:

if it's a principle thing, than I understand why you wouldn't wanna go there.

Why would anybody that values human freedom go to (and spend money in) a place so oppressive?  It is bad enough dealing with western PC culture.  But, in the west its just people bitching and whining.  In some eastern and middle eastern places government enforces ridiculous social conservative, and ridiculous ultra-left economic BS at the point of a gun.  Fuck those places.  Don't put your stamp of approval on them by vacationing there.  

By going to the US, UK, France, Germany, Canada etc, I indirectly fund their militaries which have killed a lot of innocents in my country and the neighbours of my country. And my funds contribute in that in some way, shape or form. If I was looking at things this way, I by principle should not go to these countries and they include Saudi Arabia which funds terrorists as well. And for me it is morally more acceptable to go to China than to the US. But then what about my own country? We have to face it that if we start thinking that way, almost all countries are doing shitty things somewhere in the world. Just because you can't see it and create an image of innocence, like Canada, doesn't mean it doesn't exist



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also

They said it's about gore and sex etc., but if you look at the games then it's clearly about addiction in my opinion.

About the capitalist/communits discussion: they try to achieve their socialist goals (like fighting poverty or making education available) with capitalist means and they're more successful with that than any other country before (I mean at a faster rate). Of course it won't end as a communist society because that's just an idealistic dream and the powerful don't intend to give their power away.

Last edited by episteme - on 16 December 2018

Eagle367 said:
VAMatt said:

Why would anybody that values human freedom go to (and spend money in) a place so oppressive?  It is bad enough dealing with western PC culture.  But, in the west its just people bitching and whining.  In some eastern and middle eastern places government enforces ridiculous social conservative, and ridiculous ultra-left economic BS at the point of a gun.  Fuck those places.  Don't put your stamp of approval on them by vacationing there.  

By going to the US, UK, France, Germany, Canada etc, I indirectly fund their militaries which have killed a lot of innocents in my country and the neighbours of my country. And my funds contribute in that in some way, shape or form. If I was looking at things this way, I by principle should not go to these countries and they include Saudi Arabia which funds terrorists as well. And for me it is morally more acceptable to go to China than to the US. But then what about my own country? We have to face it that if we start thinking that way, almost all countries are doing shitty things somewhere in the world. Just because you can't see it and create an image of innocence, like Canada, doesn't mean it doesn't exist

I agree with most of that.  But, because the evils done by different countries very, the ways to avoid putting your stamp on those evils also vary.  In the US, a tourist should not go on tours of military vessels, visit war memorials, try to avoid paying taxes to the federal government (which is easy for tourists), etc.  In China, one should not even enter their ridiculous surveillance state.  By doing so, you're consenting to it.