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Forums - Sony Discussion - Sources: AMD Has Created Navi FOR Sony’s PlayStation 5.

CGI-Quality said:
HollyGamer said:

History repeated again, when Uncharted 2 and the last of us was announce back then nobody believe it was running on PS3. Also it's not a PC games so it has a lot of trick and technique in there to make it happens. Consoles developer are good at optimization and good at building engine for specific device , especially SONY world wide studios. 

I do get the skepticism, but Sony's companies have a proven track record. As far as tricks are concerned, plenty of PC games apply them, just not to the degree that it has to be done on consoles.

Also after building all this good will, if Sony were to anounce something was runing on a PS4 then we later found out it was a lie and it was actualy running on a PS5 that would do a lot of damage to their public image.



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DakonBlackblade said:
CGI-Quality said:

I do get the skepticism, but Sony's companies have a proven track record. As far as tricks are concerned, plenty of PC games apply them, just not to the degree that it has to be done on consoles.

Also after building all this good will, if Sony were to anounce something was runing on a PS4 then we later found out it was a lie and it was actualy running on a PS5 that would do a lot of damage to their public image.

It's a lesson they learned from the PS3 Era. They released a lot of vids targeting what they thought the PS3 was capable of, but most fell short, Motorstorm being the most obvious one, as it looked more like a late gen PS4 game. They got a lot of flack for it and ever since then they have made sure to use in-game or in-engine footage. 



HollyGamer said:
Watch digital foundry on how Xbox solution by optimizing their TDP by soldering their APU close to the power source

I think you may have misconstrued Digital Foundries statements.
The physical distance from the power source isn't going to make a whole lot of difference in how efficient the power delivery is, there is a difference of course, because the laws of physics does indeed come into play, but it's nothing meaningful when we are talking about consoles.

The efficiency gains comes from how it's integrated.


HollyGamer said:
Agree flop are flop but Nvidia and AMD are different , most AMD GPU tend to have bigger TF then Nvidia but Nvidia is more efficient, so if we want to compare the TF between Nvidia and AMD GPU then we use that rule of thiumb, for example GTX 1070 6,5 TF are comparable to RX Vega 56 9 TF on Vega 56. 

Nope. Flops are identical regardless if it is nVidia or AMD.
Here is the kicker... AMD's GPU's are optimized for different workloads than nVidia, hence the discrepancy.
If you have a very compute-centric workload, such as Asynchronous Compute, AMD GPU's really start to show what they are capable of and will often beat their nVidia counterparts, which is why during the Cryptocurrency craze AMD's GPU's were highly sought after.

Unfortunately, games are NOT purely reliant on compute and thus flops, games actually do need texturing, geometry and so on you know.

The other take away is... That flops are a theoretical ceiling that is typically unachievable in the real world anyway, hence why it's extremely bad to use it in comparisons... As it's almost as useful as using "bits" to compare a platforms capabilities.

HollyGamer said:
It's cost more but it will be tackled by next gen memory that will have wider memory bus (GDDR6)

Consoles are cost sensitive devices. 256-bit paths are generally the best price/performance.

HollyGamer said:

Yes , every chip cost more, but then is a nutural for every generation they added more RAM

And they typically take advantage of higher density chips.


HollyGamer said:
That's why i am expecting price around 500 USD to 550 USD  which is fine, (Xbox One X sold alot whit this price)

I am thinking the goal is  $400 USD for the initial consoles with more expensive "Premium" consoles coming later.
Sony won big with that $400 USD price point.


HollyGamer said:

why would SONY will be using the same price method if Xbox One X can be popular in 500 USD price range, is and also SONY can just close their marginal profit for one year , until each of component becoming cheaper.

The Xbox One X is marketed towards different demographics than the base Xbox One or Playstation 4, which is something to keep in mind.

The Playstation 4 Pro and Xbox One X sold well because they were targeting gamers who wanted something better than the base consoles.
Once those markets have been saturated, you can bet that sales will slow down.


HollyGamer said:


Most article point out that Navi will start a transition to a new architecture, but i am sure they will have some similarities from old architecture 

Nope. Navi is still Graphics Core Next with a few new features and enhanced scaling.
Next Gen comes after it.

HollyGamer said:


Agree, that's why PS5 will follow the same route

Which is why I don't believe it will have either 12GB of 24GB. It will likely be 16GB or if they can get a good deal on DRAM... (But still unlikely) 32GB.

HollyGamer said:


then they increase it to 384 if it need to

It's not just a simple case of increasing the memory bus, there is a ton of caveats to that which I alluded to prior...
And the other factor that needs to be considered is that the next-gen base consoles need to hit low price points, especially with deep discounting later in the platforms life, which a 384-bit memory bus would actually hamper.

Otter said:
I mean pt II does look like what we would expect from early next gen titles but people said the same about pt I when it was released at the end of the PS3s life, Tomb Raider and GTA V didn't look like they could run on 360 hardware but they did. ND of all people isn't going to do a big E3 showcase for the PS4 and run it on PS5 hardware without acknowledging it lol. This is just the benefits of end of life software (assuming it launches summer/fall 2019).

I was actually not surprised with what they achieved with GTA 5 on last generation hardware, it certainly looks last-gen with the visuals...



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

CGI-Quality said: Why not go nuts? Simple. Costs. Unless you're okay with another PS3, then sure. Have at it.

PS3 is an example of going nuts in wrong direction. Better console=longer lifetime etc.



Seems plausible rumour, but still rumour...



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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KingofTrolls said:
CGI-Quality said: Why not go nuts? Simple. Costs. Unless you're okay with another PS3, then sure. Have at it.

PS3 is an example of going nuts in wrong direction. Better console=longer lifetime etc.

Well the competition would still launch something new mid cycle of your "better console" that would be more powerfull than it, leaving you with a machine that was somewhat overpriced troughout its early years that is not the best in the market anymore. The strategy that seens to work best is to release a console that is "powerfull enought" while holding back on the costs as much as possible.



LipeJJ said:
Maybe we just "saw " PS5 in action. I mean, The Last of Us 2 looked unbelievably above anything else in the conference. And no, not even Ghost of Tsushima comes close (but to the fair that's an open world game). Maybe they showed PS5's version, I don't know, it doesn't even has a release date yet. Either way, I'm totally impressed.

The Last of Us 2 doesn't look way better than God of War and Uncharted 4. God of War still looks more impressive to me as its characters have high polygon counts like the dragon. TLOU 2 does have good animations. It doesn't look like a generational leap over current PS4 exclusives.

Ghost of Tsushima impressed me more with its visuals.



CGI-Quality said:
GOWTLOZ said:

The Last of Us 2 doesn't look way better than God of War and Uncharted 4. 

Eh, I agree with Lipe. TLOU Pt II is visually ahead of all games I've seen on consoles by some distance. The environments are unmatched and the character models have a life to them that other games just don't match either.

Ghosts of Tsushima was certainly one of the most impressive games I've ever seen, but better looking than TLOU Pt II? Nah.

It might be ahead but nothing like a generation ahead. Kratos has 300k polygons in GOW and Ellie doesn't seem to have that much more. The vegetation looks like Uncharted 4 with more density and detail. It looks like they optimised it better than Uncharted 4 but it belongs to the same platform.

Ghost of Tsushima might look better to me because of the art style and depth of field. It looks like CGI. TLOU 2 gameplay doesn't. The TLOU 2 cutscene does look amazing but comparing the gameplay GOT looks better.



CGI-Quality said:
GOWTLOZ said:

It might be ahead but nothing like a generation ahead. Kratos has 300k polygons in GOW and Ellie doesn't seem to have that much more. The vegetation looks like Uncharted 4 with more density and detail. It looks like they optimised it better than Uncharted 4 but it belongs to the same platform.

Ghost of Tsushima might look better to me because of the art style and depth of field. It looks like CGI. TLOU 2 gameplay doesn't. The TLOU 2 cutscene does look amazing but comparing the gameplay GOT looks better.

The vegetation is vastly improved over Uncharted 4. It's not slight at all and even Digital Foundry couldn't believe it was current gen. Then again, they said the same about Tsushima, so there is that.

As for "looking CGI", both of those games had a near prerendered look. As far as detail, TLOU Pt II simply takes it.

It looks fundamentally on the same plane as Uncharted 4. Its not like the leap from Uncharted 3 to 4. Its definitely not far ahead of God of War so I see it as possible on a PS4 Pro. It could be that ND is taking advantage of PS4 Pro more than resolution and that some of these effect wouldn't be on PS4.



CGI-Quality said:
GOWTLOZ said:

It looks fundamentally on the same plane as Uncharted 4. Its not like the leap from Uncharted 3 to 4. Its definitely not far ahead of God of War so I see it as possible on a PS4 Pro. It could be that ND is taking advantage of PS4 Pro more than resolution and that some of these effect wouldn't be on PS4.

Nah, it looks a good few steps ahead of Uncharted 4. No question about that. It is every bit as much a step up as one would expect. Besides, Uncharted 3 to 4 is irrelevant because I didn't say anything about a generational difference, but it definitely does things on the PS4 that no game has. 

Yea i don't expect last of us 2 to look like the E3 trailer, it will be downgraded on ps4/ps4 pro. especially the lighting, like god of war was. PS5 version will hopefully match those graphics.

Last edited by quickrick - on 16 June 2018