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Forums - Politics Discussion - Elon Musk to take on the media? Can "Pravda" work?

 

Can Pravda work?

Yes. 7 26.92%
 
No. 14 53.85%
 
Maybe, I haven't thought much about into it. 5 19.23%
 
Other/comments/middle America... 0 0%
 
Total:26
Aeolus451 said:
Teeqoz said:
Why would you trust the public any more than you trust the media? I mean, the idea sounds good in theory, but how on earth would you make it work?

Also, while the idea seems good, his (presumed from what he wrote) motivation for this rant is petty. Complaining about the media reporting accidents related to Teslas autopilot feature? Sure, maybe automotive accidents don't really belong on national news, but there has been a lot of public interest in autonomous vehicles lately, and Tesla isn't the only one under scrutiny...

I love the work Musk does with SpaceX, Tesla, OpenAI and more, but sometimes I wonder wether he's a huge jerk underneath, or at least rather immature. He threw a similar hissy fit at the last Tesla investor conference call when some of the analyst questions were becoming difficult (difficult as in trying to find out how Tesla plans to solve its cash situation).

I think it's supposed to work like Wikipedia with sourcing or metacritic with reviews. If journalists or news organizations routinely report false or heavily biased information, they should be rated negatively for it. 

So you'll need a team of a bunch of moderators, similar to wikipedia, to decide what is fair criticism and what's not. Seems like you'll just shift (some) of the potential abuse away from the media themselves, and over to this organisation deciding what is a reputabe outlet and what isn't. I hardly see how that's a positive - you'll centralize power over to one organization, and the more you centralize power, the easier it falls into the wrong hands.



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Teeqoz said:
Aeolus451 said:

I think it's supposed to work like Wikipedia with sourcing or metacritic with reviews. If journalists or news organizations routinely report false or heavily biased information, they should be rated negatively for it. 

So you'll need a team of a bunch of moderators, similar to wikipedia, to decide what is fair criticism and what's not. Seems like you'll just shift (some) of the potential abuse away from the media themselves, and over to this organisation deciding what is a reputabe outlet and what isn't. I hardly see how that's a positive - you'll centralize power over to one organization, and the more you centralize power, the easier it falls into the wrong hands.

There's a ratingsystem for everything except one for the media and if its a loose ratingsystem like metacritic is then i think there will be more positives than negatives.

Everything can fall in the wrong hands but that does not mean it cannot exist,like the media itself exists .And yes in on other ratingsites the numbers are pretty spot on,like metacritic the awful games get awful ratings.And if this moves journalists in being more honest from the start and im sure they will do that if the particular site gets popular then its allready a big win for us, the consumers .



Immersiveunreality said:
Teeqoz said:

So you'll need a team of a bunch of moderators, similar to wikipedia, to decide what is fair criticism and what's not. Seems like you'll just shift (some) of the potential abuse away from the media themselves, and over to this organisation deciding what is a reputabe outlet and what isn't. I hardly see how that's a positive - you'll centralize power over to one organization, and the more you centralize power, the easier it falls into the wrong hands.

There's a ratingsystem for everything except one for the media and if its a loose ratingsystem like metacritic is then i think there will be more positives than negatives.

Everything can fall in the wrong hands but that does not mean it cannot exist,like the media itself exists .And yes in on other ratingsites the numbers are pretty spot on,like metacritic the awful games get awful ratings.And if this moves journalists in being more honest from the start and im sure they will do that if the particular site gets popular then its allready a big win for us, the consumers .

Good response. Saved me the trouble.



Immersiveunreality said: There's a ratingsystem for everything except one for the media and if its a loose ratingsystem like metacritic is then i think there will be more positives than negatives.

Everything can fall in the wrong hands but that does not mean it cannot exist,like the media itself exists .And yes in on other ratingsites the numbers are pretty spot on,like metacritic the awful games get awful ratings.And if this moves journalists in being more honest from the start and im sure they will do that if the particular site gets popular then its allready a big win for us, the consumers .

Rating systems for things like movies and games is purely subjective, so it kinda works (though plenty of those don't work well either).  Ratings for whether media is accurate and honest is not subjective, people suffer massively from confirmation bias when it comes to media so what you would get is not a rating system for their quality or accuracy, but one for their popularity where their views align which is exactly what you don't want.



nanarchy said:
Immersiveunreality said: There's a ratingsystem for everything except one for the media and if its a loose ratingsystem like metacritic is then i think there will be more positives than negatives.

Everything can fall in the wrong hands but that does not mean it cannot exist,like the media itself exists .And yes in on other ratingsites the numbers are pretty spot on,like metacritic the awful games get awful ratings.And if this moves journalists in being more honest from the start and im sure they will do that if the particular site gets popular then its allready a big win for us, the consumers .

Rating systems for things like movies and games is purely subjective, so it kinda works (though plenty of those don't work well either).  Ratings for whether media is accurate and honest is not subjective, people suffer massively from confirmation bias when it comes to media so what you would get is not a rating system for their quality or accuracy, but one for their popularity where their views align which is exactly what you don't want.

Most people do not mind politics when reading articles heck most people dont want to care or know a thing about politics themselves, offcourse there will be people with a bias but really its a small percentage .

And movies and games can suffer from the same like you see with Star Wars.



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Immersiveunreality said:
nanarchy said:

Rating systems for things like movies and games is purely subjective, so it kinda works (though plenty of those don't work well either).  Ratings for whether media is accurate and honest is not subjective, people suffer massively from confirmation bias when it comes to media so what you would get is not a rating system for their quality or accuracy, but one for their popularity where their views align which is exactly what you don't want.

Most people do not mind politics when reading articles heck most people dont want to care or know a thing about politics themselves, offcourse there will be people with a bias but really its a small percentage .

And movies and games can suffer from the same like you see with Star Wars.

confirmation bias is NOT really small, the majority of people suffer from it, most unknowingly. People generally read content they agree with. This is a well understood phenomenon, people that agree with something are generally not capable of objectively evaluating it. Yes only a small percentage might be intentionally screwing with the ratings, they are not the problem, the problem is the majority that will be unknowingly screwing with it due to confirmation bias.

have a read, not the best article, but it does explain some of the problems quite well. https://www.theguardian.com/media-network/media-network-blog/2014/may/13/internet-confirmation-bias

Last edited by nanarchy - on 03 June 2018

nanarchy said:
Immersiveunreality said:

Most people do not mind politics when reading articles heck most people dont want to care or know a thing about politics themselves, offcourse there will be people with a bias but really its a small percentage .

And movies and games can suffer from the same like you see with Star Wars.

confirmation bias is NOT really small, the majority of people suffer from it, most unknowingly. People generally read content they agree with. This is a well understood phenomenon, people that agree with something are generally not capable of objectively evaluating it. Yes only a small percentage might be intentionally screwing with the ratings, they are not the problem, the problem is the majority that will be unknowingly screwing with it due to confirmation bias.

have a read, not the best article, but it does explain some of the problems quite well. https://www.theguardian.com/media-network/media-network-blog/2014/may/13/internet-confirmation-bias

I will give it a read, it looks like to be alot of guessing and opinions  and mostly i rather read scientific articles about this.

Thanks for sharing , you will get a pm about what i think of it in the next days.



Immersiveunreality said:
nanarchy said:

confirmation bias is NOT really small, the majority of people suffer from it, most unknowingly. People generally read content they agree with. This is a well understood phenomenon, people that agree with something are generally not capable of objectively evaluating it. Yes only a small percentage might be intentionally screwing with the ratings, they are not the problem, the problem is the majority that will be unknowingly screwing with it due to confirmation bias.

have a read, not the best article, but it does explain some of the problems quite well. https://www.theguardian.com/media-network/media-network-blog/2014/may/13/internet-confirmation-bias

I will give it a read, it looks like to be alot of guessing and opinions  and mostly i rather read scientific articles about this.

Thanks for sharing , you will get a pm about what i think of it in the next days.

then try some of these or try searching for some yourself, it is not a new concept and is well researched.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/terms/confirmation_bias.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

http://psy2.ucsd.edu/~mckenzie/nickersonConfirmationBias.pdf



Immersiveunreality said:
Teeqoz said:

So you'll need a team of a bunch of moderators, similar to wikipedia, to decide what is fair criticism and what's not. Seems like you'll just shift (some) of the potential abuse away from the media themselves, and over to this organisation deciding what is a reputabe outlet and what isn't. I hardly see how that's a positive - you'll centralize power over to one organization, and the more you centralize power, the easier it falls into the wrong hands.

There's a ratingsystem for everything except one for the media and if its a loose ratingsystem like metacritic is then i think there will be more positives than negatives.

Everything can fall in the wrong hands but that does not mean it cannot exist,like the media itself exists .And yes in on other ratingsites the numbers are pretty spot on,like metacritic the awful games get awful ratings.And if this moves journalists in being more honest from the start and im sure they will do that if the particular site gets popular then its allready a big win for us, the consumers .

User reviews on Metacritic are notoriously ridiculous, and the accuracy of an article isn't something subjective where everyone's opinion could be considered as valid. Facts are facts wether people disagree or not. You don't decide what is factual and what isn't based on popular vote. 

EDIT: But hey, I'm not opposed to him trying, I just don't see it actually solving the problem he wants to tackle.

Last edited by Teeqoz - on 05 June 2018

I haven't much thought about it so I'd say yes it's a good idea but I'd have to see how that goes when it is implemented.

But we do have the general public scoring pretty much everything else, from video games on meta critic to movies on rotten tomatoes. From restaurants on Yelp or whatever that website is called to other professionals across different trades so why not score journalists?

Perhaps it won't be a totally impartial endeavor and people will certainly politicize their votes but as a counter-weight to the power of the news media it could be a good thing, democratically speaking.

Last edited by CrazyGamer2017 - on 05 June 2018