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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Zelda BotW Sells over 8.2mil by Dec 31st! (Sell thru 7.5mil)

Such high and pretty sales



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

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Vini256 said:

BotW is a good base for a future Zelda game but there's a ton of stuff that should be improved imo, and it needs to add back at least some of the old things back for me to consider returning to the franchise (Dungeons, title screen, main menu music, rupees/hearts when cutting grass, green tunic at the start of the game again, proper credits/staff roll music, etc).

This is very sad. Most of your requirements are either really irrelevant or really obsolete. I mean, I see no reason why you couldn't enjoy a Zelda game just because you don't have a green tunic, or because you don't get hearts by cutting grass (which is far inferior to the current system in every way), never mind not having proper credits music - as if you were going to even know what the credits are like for 99% of your experience.

It's not that I don't agree with some of these. I would like some proper staff roll music and a proper title screen or whatever, but those are not the kind of thing that will ever make or break a game for me, I don't see why they would be for anyone. 'Proper dungeons' is a fair complaint and one that's been everywhere really, but I do think people give the Divine Beasts and the Shrines far too little credit for what they do - they might have easier puzzles than previous games, but the only reason for that is because the puzzles are far more intuitive this time and usually require clever thinking rather than exhaustive trial and error. It's not that previous games didn't have good puzzles, but Breath of the Wild's approach is far more interesting with how it makes you think around the game mechanics and physics and allow you to work with both the tools that are given to you and the tools you already have - the DLC dungeon is definitely the best example of this, some of the puzzles on it are incredibly mind-bending, and I'd say it's actually one of the best dungeons in Zelda history (though I'd also put BotW's Hyrule Castle up there and maybe even Naboris too, so clearly I have a higher opinion on these than most people).

If anything I think a lot of the dungeons in previous games are really overrated. Of course there were several good ones and some great ones and all, but I think people jump too quickly on the hate bandwagon for BotW's dungeons without realizing that previous games always had a few terrible ones in between the good. Ocarina of Time had Dodongo's Cavern and Jabu-Jabu's Belly. Majora's Mask had Snowhead Temple. Wind Waker had everything. Twilight Princess had Forest Temple, Goron Mines and City in the Sky. Really out of the 3D Zeldas the only one I'd say doesn't have a bad dungeon is Skyward Sword, and arguably I think Breath of the Wild doesn't either, though Ruta and Medoh aren't exactly very good.



Can you guys make a prediction when zelda botw and mario oddyssey cross 10 million each ?



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mZuzek said:

This is very sad. Most of your requirements are either really irrelevant or really obsolete. I mean, I see no reason why you couldn't enjoy a Zelda game just because you don't have a green tunic, or because you don't get hearts by cutting grass (which is far inferior to the current system in every way), never mind not having proper credits music - as if you were going to even know what the credits are like for 99% of your experience.

I actually have a list of the "big stuff" I'd like changed that I had made for a thread that was going to be about how I'd improve the BotW formula for the next Zelda, but now that I think about it I actually forgot to make the thread so it was pretty pointless to not mention that stuff straight up, my bad lol. Here's a "proper" list of things I'd change (@bold are the small things I've already mentioned):

- Bring back traditional dungeons (At least 8 of them).
Less shrines (50-60 at most), but they're bigger and don't share the same visuals anymore.
- Make exploration more rewarding, because tbh once you realize that all you'll find are either Koroks or Shrines (Or repetitive enemy camps), it becomes rather boring. It did to me, at least.
- Make voice acting optional. I think Zelda worked better without it, I liked reading the story at my own pace and it was part of the charm for me. The flower lady cutscene in BotW wouldn't be as funny if it was voice acted, the exaggerated reactions are what made it special.
- More enemy variety. Each area of the map should have it's own "exclusive" enemies (Like Skulltulas in dense forest areas, for example).
- Less "copy-paste" (What I mean by this is that I want more unique content in the overworld. Finding a labyrinth doesn't feel special when you discover that there are 2 more of them at the other corners of the map that aren't even that different from one another).
- Main menu: Bring back the title screen, music (Fairy's Theme) and more save slots.
- Give back the green tunic at the start of the game, since armor is likely staying for the next game and those who don't want it can just wear whatever instead.
- Put music everywhere again. To avoid music getting annoying/repetitive, just make longer and/or dynamic themes (Kinda like how Mario music changes on the fly when going underwater). For example, if you have a theme for Hyrule Field, make it change depending on the weather/enemies/time of the day/riding a horse/etc. Add a proper ending theme.
- Make the map smaller, but add tons of caves and underwater sections to the game.
- Ditch weapon durability or vastly improve it (Shields aren't damaged when shield surfing, swords aren't damaged from cutting grass, weapons last longer in general, make it possible for us to repair them with certain items, etc).

Edit: Also, I'm not suggesting they bring back the old healing system and replace cooking, I want it back in addition to cooking. No reason to not have both, they could just be a rare drop or something (Grass with a sparkle effect could drop rupees when cut, for example).

Last edited by Vini256 - on 01 February 2018

Vini256 said:

- Make voice acting optional. I think Zelda worked better without it, I liked reading the story at my own pace and it was part of the charm for me. The flower lady cutscene in BotW wouldn't be as funny if it was voice acted, the exaggerated reactions are what made it special.
- Put music everywhere again. To avoid music getting annoying/repetitive, just make longer and/or dynamic themes (Kinda like how Mario music changes on the fly when going underwater). For example, if you have a theme for Hyrule Field, make it change depending on the weather/enemies/time of the day/riding a horse/etc.
- Ditch weapon durability or vastly improve it (Shields aren't damaged when shield surfing, swords aren't damaged from cutting grass, weapons last longer in general, make it possible for us to repair them with certain items, etc).

About voice acting, personally I always wanted them to have it in a made up language (Hylian). It's a shame it didn't happen and now it likely never will, but as it is, yeah I guess having the option to turn it off would be fine.

The music part is the most annoying argument for me, specifically because people always talk about how "Breath of the Wild doesn't have overworld themes because they'd get repetitive", which isn't the case at all. Not having an overworld theme isn't down to just the music potentially getting repetitive, it's a completely different approach altogether. The idea wasn't "let's not have music because people are gonna get tired of it", it was "let's focus on a more subdued sound design where you hear the environment rather than some epic fanfare". It fits the game because of several reasons, such as 1. it creates a stronger feeling of desolation when bits of old themes pop up rather distorted (Temple of Time), fitting the game's post-apocalyptic world, 2. it allows more freedom of mind for the player, as epic fanfare would be always an incentive to just keep carrying with your adventure, 3. it just allows you to soak in the wild and truly feel immersed in the world. It also doesn't get repetitive.

I'm not saying this should be the approach forever, but I think the "repetitive" argument is incredibly shallow. If anything, Nintendo has shown over 30 years that if anyone can make music looping endlessly and never getting old, it's them (I don't know about other people, but I find myself listening to some videogame music on loop for dozens of minutes sometimes and I don't get bored at all). I don't think having music everywhere would be a good thing to be honest, but they could integrate it a little bit more into the overworld - for example, I really like the theme that plays when you ride a horse at night, but it's a really subtle song. Maybe they could have something as equally subtle as the main overworld themes, and then when you do get on a horse it gets more bombastic? I think it could be the case, sure. I just don't think this is anywhere near as big of a problem as some make it out to be, and personally, I actually think Breath of the Wild has one of the best Zelda soundtracks ever.

Weapon durability definitely doesn't need to go. It's the best solution to having everything on an open world game feel meaningful - you did say you haven't played open world games, and I think it shows, otherwise you'd know how much they struggle with having enough meaningful content. Since in BotW you're constantly looking for more weapons, every encounter has a purpose. That said, I would like it (and I was thinking about this earlier today) if they incorporated oldschool Zelda items into the new system, having them as permanent weapons that are multi-functional. I think there could be one per dungeon or something (I always liked finding items inside dungeons, wasn't a fan of the ALBW approach though it wasn't as bad in BotW because of how different the dungeons were), and then maybe they could allow for different movement options and open up shortcuts in other places - for example if they still wanna make the game as open as "you can go straight to the end!", they could have several different paths within the final dungeon, most of which require specific items for you to move faster or ignore certain enemies or whatever. Overall I just want the game, and especially the dungeons, to be a bit more linear. I like how BotW is all about allowing the player to do anything they want however they want whenever they want, but I'd rather have that extreme approach as this game's particular gimmick rather than something every game will do from now on.

Not tackling your other points because they're either fair criticisms or just stuff I've nothing to add.



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mZuzek said:
Vini256 said:

- Make voice acting optional. I think Zelda worked better without it, I liked reading the story at my own pace and it was part of the charm for me. The flower lady cutscene in BotW wouldn't be as funny if it was voice acted, the exaggerated reactions are what made it special.
- Put music everywhere again. To avoid music getting annoying/repetitive, just make longer and/or dynamic themes (Kinda like how Mario music changes on the fly when going underwater). For example, if you have a theme for Hyrule Field, make it change depending on the weather/enemies/time of the day/riding a horse/etc.
- Ditch weapon durability or vastly improve it (Shields aren't damaged when shield surfing, swords aren't damaged from cutting grass, weapons last longer in general, make it possible for us to repair them with certain items, etc).

About voice acting, personally I always wanted them to have it in a made up language (Hylian). It's a shame it didn't happen and now it likely never will, but as it is, yeah I guess having the option to turn it off would be fine.

The music part is the most annoying argument for me, specifically because people always talk about how "Breath of the Wild doesn't have overworld themes because they'd get repetitive", which isn't the case at all. Not having an overworld theme isn't down to just the music potentially getting repetitive, it's a completely different approach altogether. The idea wasn't "let's not have music because people are gonna get tired of it", it was "let's focus on a more subdued sound design where you hear the environment rather than some epic fanfare". It fits the game because of several reasons, such as 1. it creates a stronger feeling of desolation when bits of old themes pop up rather distorted (Temple of Time), fitting the game's post-apocalyptic world, 2. it allows more freedom of mind for the player, as epic fanfare would be always an incentive to just keep carrying with your adventure, 3. it just allows you to soak in the wild and truly feel immersed in the world. It also doesn't get repetitive.

I'm not saying this should be the approach forever, but I think the "repetitive" argument is incredibly shallow. If anything, Nintendo has shown over 30 years that if anyone can make music looping endlessly and never getting old, it's them (I don't know about other people, but I find myself listening to some videogame music on loop for dozens of minutes sometimes and I don't get bored at all). I don't think having music everywhere would be a good thing to be honest, but they could integrate it a little bit more into the overworld - for example, I really like the theme that plays when you ride a horse at night, but it's a really subtle song. Maybe they could have something as equally subtle as the main overworld themes, and then when you do get on a horse it gets more bombastic? I think it could be the case, sure. I just don't think this is anywhere near as big of a problem as some make it out to be, and personally, I actually think Breath of the Wild has one of the best Zelda soundtracks ever.

Weapon durability definitely doesn't need to go. It's the best solution to having everything on an open world game feel meaningful - you did say you haven't played open world games, and I think it shows, otherwise you'd know how much they struggle with having enough meaningful content. Since in BotW you're constantly looking for more weapons, every encounter has a purpose. That said, I would like it (and I was thinking about this earlier today) if they incorporated oldschool Zelda items into the new system, having them as permanent weapons that are multi-functional. I think there could be one per dungeon or something (I always liked finding items inside dungeons, wasn't a fan of the ALBW approach though it wasn't as bad in BotW because of how different the dungeons were), and then maybe they could allow for different movement options and open up shortcuts in other places - for example if they still wanna make the game as open as "you can go straight to the end!", they could have several different paths within the final dungeon, most of which require specific items for you to move faster or ignore certain enemies or whatever. Overall I just want the game, and especially the dungeons, to be a bit more linear. I like how BotW is all about allowing the player to do anything they want however they want whenever they want, but I'd rather have that extreme approach as this game's particular gimmick rather than something every game will do from now on.

Not tackling your other points because they're either fair criticisms or just stuff I've nothing to add.

That would be amazing!



mZuzek said:

About voice acting, personally I always wanted them to have it in a made up language (Hylian). It's a shame it didn't happen and now it likely never will, but as it is, yeah I guess having the option to turn it off would be fine.

That's exactly why I didn't like the VA in BotW, for me I'd much rather have either what you described (Basically when Zelda sings in SS, but for everything) or nothing at all, like the previous games. It just feels off to me when the in-game lore of a game tells us that the characters have their own language and writing system, and then those characters are suddenly speaking perfectly clear english (Or whatever language you played the game in - Japanese in my case).

Last edited by Vini256 - on 01 February 2018

Breath of the Wild is a divine beast



Vini256 said:

and then those characters are suddenly speaking perfectly clear english (Or whatever language you played the game in - Japanese in my case).

Oh, no wonder you didn't like the voice acting. Zelda in Japanese is so incredibly annoying, it's impossible to appreciate any of it.



mZuzek said:
Vini256 said:

and then those characters are suddenly speaking perfectly clear english (Or whatever language you played the game in - Japanese in my case).

Oh, no wonder you didn't like the voice acting. Zelda in Japanese is so incredibly annoying, it's impossible to appreciate any of it.

Actually, I played it in japanese specifically to avoid the english acting which I already didn't like from the trailers before the game released. Those "young people trying to sound like old people" voices are simply terrible, and Zelda's fake british also sounded bad to me. I honestly didn't mind Zelda's JP voice at all, it just sounds like anime.