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Forums - Politics Discussion - Trump Announces Ban on Transgender People in US Military

 

You support this?

No. 206 29.68%
 
Yes. 311 44.81%
 
^ What the hell is wrong ... 177 25.50%
 
Total:694
Green098 said:
Aeolus451 said:
I think this more of a pragmatic choice than anything else. Trump has openly supported gay/trans rights before.

I didn't know that saying that you would strongly consider getting rid of same sex marriage was supporting gay rights. Learn something new everyday I guess.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/nov/03/hillary-clinton/hillary-clinton-says-donald-trump-wants-undo-marri/

You're using what Hillary said as a source during a campaign?  That's just fear mongering for the most part. She was caught lying trying to pander towards blacks when she was on a black radio show (I think).

 

Has he done anything to suggest he'll get rid of same sex marriage? No.



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d21lewis said:

There's a lot to consider and quite frankly, I haven't done the research. I have served in the military, though. I'll give my two cents:

The military has a standard of discipline, physical appearance, physical ability, and mental sharpness. The men and women who enlist have to be capable of accomplishing and supporting a variety of tasks. When a mission must be executed, they choose the best and most capable. The ones conditioned for the job at hand.

If, for example, a female who identifies as a male goes through basic training with other males, will that person be able to live up to the physical standards? Will they be the "weak link"? Will they distract from the vital lessons being taught by instructors?

I've read that many in the LGBT community are more likely to be depressed, suicidal, or have other mental issues. I'm not doctor and I'm not trying to be disrespectful. Would hormone treatments play into this?

I'm not a fan of President Trump. I have no issues with Donald Trump but President Trump is a whole other beast. I rarely agree with his decisions but this time, I can see his point of view.

And that's what I think he's counting on. The majority uniting behind him against a few. At one point in time, the idea of women in the military was preposterous. At one time, the idea of blacks in the military was madness. There was a lot of "pushback" before that became the norm. Maybe this will be, too. Right now, I'm seeing the potential downsides that could effect our military's effectiveness.

My mind is open so my stance could change. Educate me.

I feel like I need a hell of a lot more than just some Tweets to explain this decision, though.  What kind of information did he get from his Generals that indicated this wasn't working?  

The one point I do agree with is that the government should not be paying for medical treatment related to gender transition.

I'm willing to consider this from a logical standpoint but that's going to require supporting information.  Trump is going to have to explain this with clear language, statistics, and facts.

Edit:  Damn right, Mr. McCain.

“The president’s tweet this morning regarding transgender Americans in the military is yet another example of why major policy announcements should not be made via Twitter,” said Mr. McCain, the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee.  https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/26/us/politics/trump-transgender-military.html



Aeolus451 said:
I think this more of a pragmatic choice than anything else. Trump has openly supported gay/trans rights before.

I would expect better mental gymnastics from the guy with an imaginary view of oppression, trans rights and social justice.

At least this will get those SJWs riled up, and that's all that matters, right?



Aeolus451 said:
Green098 said:

I didn't know that saying that you would strongly consider getting rid of same sex marriage was supporting gay rights. Learn something new everyday I guess.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/nov/03/hillary-clinton/hillary-clinton-says-donald-trump-wants-undo-marri/

You're using what Hillary said as a source during a campaign?  That's just fear mongering for the most part. She was caught lying trying to pander towards blacks when she was on a black radio show (I think).

Has he done anything to suggest he'll get rid of same sex marriage? No.

I mean other than him saying it no. But I mean what else is there than that?

Btw, saying that just because Hillary said makes it not true shows just how petty you are being about this subject. Especially when countering her creditablily by her lying when we are litterally talking about Trump lol. Hillary wasn't the point here, it was just the statement she made that lead it to be fact checked by politifact.



Tulipanzo said:
Superman4 said:

You can call it discrimination but really its about selecting the most able bodied. Not allowing someone with a disability is discrimination as well however you cant exactly fight if you are disabled. Having a man dressed as a women in the womens barracks and a women dressed as a man in the mens barracks is just not something troops should have to deal with. They need to be focused on fighting the enemy and accomplishing whatever goal is in front of them. It is a distraction they dont need and doesnt help anyone.

Hey, nice job commenting on an issue you have no knowledge of, you'd make Trump proud

"It's not discrimination if I'm thick as mince!"

I have plenty of knowledge regarding this topic. How much do you have? Having been in the military I would not want someone with mental instability anywhere near myself or my men. If you want to cut off your dick because you identify as a women then so be it, if you want to become a man then so be it, it doesnt mean you are actually a man or have become a women. It means that you have altered your body to become what you think you should be. Kind of like a women with no tits getting some monsters put in because she should have been born with them. Keep your crazy away from the weapons and the battle field.



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jason1637 said:
Tulipanzo said:

Would me being kind stop you from being an uncivilized bigot?

I thought so

Well I'm not a bigot and I'm civilized.

Also BTW isn't saying fuck you to those that support this making you the bigot?

There was no need to insult people anyone that's an uncivilized way to have a conversation

Destroying people's lives is an uncivilized way to start a conversation. 

Showing your support for destroying people's lives is an uncivilized way to have a conversation.

Considering people's worth exclusively in terms of "how much they cost" is an uncivilized way to have a conversation.

You had your chance to have my patience, you had your chance to have my civility. You wasted it. 



Tulipanzo said:
Aeolus451 said:
I think this more of a pragmatic choice than anything else. Trump has openly supported gay/trans rights before.

I would expect better mental gymnastics from the guy with an imaginary view of oppression, trans rights and social justice.

At least this will get those SJWs riled up, and that's all that matters, right?

 

What matters is what is better for everyone living in the states. I don't have to try to rile up SJWs, they always are by default because they're snowflakes and they have a unrealistic take on the world. 



pokoko said:
d21lewis said:

There's a lot to consider and quite frankly, I haven't done the research. I have served in the military, though. I'll give my two cents:

The military has a standard of discipline, physical appearance, physical ability, and mental sharpness. The men and women who enlist have to be capable of accomplishing and supporting a variety of tasks. When a mission must be executed, they choose the best and most capable. The ones conditioned for the job at hand.

If, for example, a female who identifies as a male goes through basic training with other males, will that person be able to live up to the physical standards? Will they be the "weak link"? Will they distract from the vital lessons being taught by instructors?

I've read that many in the LGBT community are more likely to be depressed, suicidal, or have other mental issues. I'm not doctor and I'm not trying to be disrespectful. Would hormone treatments play into this?

I'm not a fan of President Trump. I have no issues with Donald Trump but President Trump is a whole other beast. I rarely agree with his decisions but this time, I can see his point of view.

And that's what I think he's counting on. The majority uniting behind him against a few. At one point in time, the idea of women in the military was preposterous. At one time, the idea of blacks in the military was madness. There was a lot of "pushback" before that became the norm. Maybe this will be, too. Right now, I'm seeing the potential downsides that could effect our military's effectiveness.

My mind is open so my stance could change. Educate me.

I feel like I need a hell of a lot more than just some Tweets to explain this decision, though.  What kind of information did he get from his Generals that indicated this wasn't working?  

The one point I do agree with is that the government should not be paying for medical treatment related to gender transition.

I'm willing to consider this from a logical standpoint but that's going to require supporting information.  Trump is going to have to explain this with clear language, statistics, and facts.

Edit:  Damn right, Mr. McCain.

“The president’s tweet this morning regarding transgender Americans in the military is yet another example of why major policy announcements should not be made via Twitter,” said Mr. McCain, the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee.  https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/26/us/politics/trump-transgender-military.html

100% agree. He always does this shit and leaves it up to our imaginations to fill in the blanks. People say anything from "He's using this to distract us from ____" to " He's a genius fixing Obama's mess". For once, I'd love for him to go in depth and explain something! It's aggravating, really.



Ka-pi96 said:
Tulipanzo said:

I would expect better mental gymnastics from the guy with an imaginary view of oppression, trans rights and social justice.

At least this will get those SJWs riled up, and that's all that matters, right?

As if they need this to get riled up. I bet the sun rising is all it takes for some of them

Exactly. 



Tulipanzo said:
jason1637 said:

Well I'm not a bigot and I'm civilized.

Also BTW isn't saying fuck you to those that support this making you the bigot?

There was no need to insult people anyone that's an uncivilized way to have a conversation

Destroying people's lives is an uncivilized way to start a conversation. 

Showing your support for destroying people's lives is an uncivilized way to have a conversation.

Considering people's worth exclusively in terms of "how much they cost" is an uncivilized way to have a conversation.

You had your chance to have my patience, you had your chance to have my civility. You wasted it. 

You're the one not being civil. You're acting a like a poster child for SJWs acting like this.