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Forums - Nintendo - It is Much Too Early to Worry About Switch 3rd Party Support

 

Are you worried about 3rd party support 4 Switch?

Yes 82 32.28%
 
No 53 20.87%
 
Check back in 6 months 35 13.78%
 
Check back in a year 45 17.72%
 
It doesn't need 3rd Party Support 14 5.51%
 
Switch be doomed yo 25 9.84%
 
Total:254
Johnw1104 on 18 April 2017
Hiku said:
Yomieeee said:

That's because it was too much trouble to downgrade games enough so they could run on the Wii. But because of it's sales it got a lot of exclusive third party games too.

Madworld, Red Steel 1/2, No More Heroes 1/2, Deadly Creatures, Conduit 1/2, Dead Space Extraction, House of the Dead: Overkill, de Blob, etc.

If the sales are there the potential can't be ignored.

No More Heroes (under the name No More Heroes: Paradise) and House of the Dead: Overkill were released for PS3 as well. The rest of the games you mentioned are not Japanese games, except for Madworld.

But my point cannot be dimissed by mentioning a few examples, because the difference when it came to AAA third party support for quality games was astronomical.
If Capcom wanted to, they could have designed Resident Evil 5 or 6 with Wii in mind from the start of development.

For the majority of polpular Japanese franchises, Wii's sales were majorly ignored. And the exceptions are few.

As I said above, I mentioned Wii mainly to show that 3rd parties will find ways to supply a console with games if it sells well even if the console is weak.

I think we'll find that the Switch and Wii are otherwise very different; this is the first Nintendo console in a few generations where there is a unique benefit to buying a port of a AAA game on it instead of elsewhere, as it can be taken with you. In my experience for instance, I really had no reason to buy 3rd party games on the Wii and Wii U, but I'd happily do so for the Switch.



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Johnw1104 on 18 April 2017
Hiku said:
Johnw1104 said:

As I said above, I mentioned Wii mainly to show that 3rd parties will find ways to supply a console with games if it sells well even if the console is weak.

But they didn't...
Every popular Japanese franchise majorly ignored the Wii. And the exceptions were very very few.
If that's the future you hope for when it comes to Switch third party ports, then you're setting the bar extremely low and won't be disapointed. And instead of Resident Evil 7, we will get a Resident Evil 5 port.

There is a massive difference between the two, though, in that 3rd party ports from modern games are very much feasible for the Switch, whereas direct ports were almost impossible back in the Wii days. The Switch has been designed to be as easy to design for as any console you'll find, and modern game engines have made scaling faaar more possible than the very hardware-limited environment that existed back with the PS3/X360/Wii.

It's not that massive because engine compatibility is limited by hardware. I have an Intel Core i5 processor and an AVGA Geforce GTX graphics card. My computer architexture is properly equipped to handle the Unreal 4 engine. Except for one litle problem. They run like absolute garbage even when I scale things down to the lowest settings. Because my specs are below the minimum recommended specs.

Yes, Wii had other issues as well, such as the controlls. But I've mentioned how WiiU handled the Unreal Engine 3 as well.

The Japanese certainly avoided the Wii, but they're the least of the Switch's concerns in regards to 3rd party support in my opinion. We're already seeing some ports coming in and, given the decline of consoles in Japan and the surprisingly strong launch in said country (along with the fading off of the Vita and 3DS), it's very possible that the Switch will become the main platform for many of those devs going forward.

Engine compatibility is indeed limited by hardware, but the Switch is capable of running engines like Unreal Engine 4 and Frostbite and so far seems to be doing a decent job with the former. How badly a game is effected from scaling down would certainly vary from game to game, but most of the issues could be ironed out if a Dev wanted to provide a port for the Switch unless it is something that directly affects gameplay (such as AI, physics and so forth).

Here's a video I thought was pretty cool that shows Nintendo really reached out a lot more than with previous consoles to take advice from 3rd party devs... Capcom actually convinced them to improve the hardware (thank god for capcom lol) so that they could port their new RE 7 engine to it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87y-otUWsBs

They really did take advice from other 3rd party developers (Capcom wasn't the only one to offer hardware suggestions), and that reaching out will certainly help when it comes to receiving ports.



Green098 on 18 April 2017
Hiku said:
Johnw1104 said:

 

The ports we're seeing coming in already are mostly games that are also on PS3 or WiiU, like Dragon Quest Heroes 2, Lego City Undercover, and Fast RMX. The former also ran terribly on Switch. Around 20 frames per second, compared to 60fps on PS4, among other things like different textures.
And while that can probably be attributed to DQ Heroes 2 being a lazy port, it's at least not a positive sign.
I Am Setusuna, while it is a PS4 game, looks like it could run on a PS3 to put it mildly. And as for Skyrim, a remaster of a Gen 7 game, the Switch version does not have the word "Remaster" in it's title, probably because there will be some notable graphical differences in the Switch version.

While these things aren't neccesarily a bad sign, they're not examples of a good sign either. If there is something that could be called that, I think we're still waiting to see it.

Engine compatibility is indeed limited by hardware, but the Switch is capable of running engines like Unreal Engine 4 and Frostbite and so far seems to be doing a decent job with the former. How badly a game is effected from scaling down would certainly vary from game to game, but most of the issues could be ironed out if a Dev wanted to provide a port for the Switch unless it is something that directly affects gameplay (such as AI, physics and so forth).

What do you mean here? There's no Switch game out yet that runs on Unreal Engine 4. There's the upcoming Rime, and Dragon Quest XI that we know of. And regarding the latter, the fact that they haven't shown any footage of the Switch version yet, and that it will come out half a year later on Switch is hardly what I'd call a good sign. Especially considering that this game was one of, if not the, first potential Switch game to be announced from a third party, back in early 2015.

For all we know, the other UE4 games in development for Switch could all be lower budget indie games.

But yes, if devs want an Unreal Engine 4 or Frostbite game to scale down properly to Switch, they can easily do that if they design the game like that from scratch. The question is if they will, and I've gone into detail explaining why I have my doubts that they will this time, with certain, if not most, games.

Snake Pass

 



Green098 on 18 April 2017
Hiku said:
Green098 said:

Snake Pass

Sorry, it was not on this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Unreal_Engine_games

Now I read that it said "notable" Unreal Engine games.

Is there anything else I may have missed that you know of?

This all we know so far from an interview from an Epic Games rep Takayuki Kawasaki;

“Unfortunately, there were not any Unreal Engine titles at launch, but in late March, Snake Pass, which was one of the titles playable at GDC, launched in America and Europe. And at the Nintendo Switch Presentation, there were titles such as Shin Megami Tensei,” Kawasaki said. “In Japan, there are about 20 titles being developed that use Unreal Engine, so I think that they’ll be announced gradually from here on.”

At the moment, there are only a few confirmed Japanese Switch titles that use Unreal Engine 4, including Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night, Shin Megami Tensei, and Dragon Quest XI.

Source: https://pvplive.net/c/20-unreal-engine-4-games-nintendo-switch-japan

So far we know there are at least 20 Japanese unreal engine 4 games currently in development, of which are confirmed are stated above.



Johnw1104 on 18 April 2017
Hiku said:
Johnw1104 said:

The Japanese certainly avoided the Wii, but they're the least of the Switch's concerns in regards to 3rd party support in my opinion. We're already seeing some ports coming in and, given the decline of consoles in Japan and the surprisingly strong launch in said country (along with the fading off of the Vita and 3DS), it's very possible that the Switch will become the main platform for many of those devs going forward.

Engine compatibility is indeed limited by hardware, but the Switch is capable of running engines like Unreal Engine 4 and Frostbite and so far seems to be doing a decent job with the former. How badly a game is effected from scaling down would certainly vary from game to game, but most of the issues could be ironed out if a Dev wanted to provide a port for the Switch unless it is something that directly affects gameplay (such as AI, physics and so forth).

Here's a video I thought was pretty cool that shows Nintendo really reached out a lot more than with previous consoles to take advice from 3rd party devs... Capcom actually convinced them to improve the hardware (thank god for capcom lol) so that they could port their new RE 7 engine to it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87y-otUWsBs

They really did take advice from other 3rd party developers (Capcom wasn't the only one to offer hardware suggestions), and that reaching out will certainly help when it comes to receiving ports.

The ports we're seeing coming in already are mostly games that are also on PS3 or WiiU, like Dragon Quest Heroes 2, Lego City Undercover, and Fast RMX. The former also ran terribly on Switch. Around 15 frames per second undocked, and 20-25 frames docked, compared to 60fps on PS4, among other things like different textures.
And while that can probably be attributed to DQ Heroes 2 being a lazy port, it's at least not a positive sign.
I Am Setusuna, while it is a PS4 game, looks like it could run on a PS3 to put it mildly. And as for Skyrim, a remaster of a Gen 7 game, the Switch version does not have the word "Remaster" in it's title, probably because there will be some notable graphical differences in the Switch version.

While these things aren't neccesarily a bad sign, they're not examples of a good sign either. If there is something that could be called that, I think we're still waiting to see it.

Engine compatibility is indeed limited by hardware, but the Switch is capable of running engines like Unreal Engine 4 and Frostbite and so far seems to be doing a decent job with the former. How badly a game is effected from scaling down would certainly vary from game to game, but most of the issues could be ironed out if a Dev wanted to provide a port for the Switch unless it is something that directly affects gameplay (such as AI, physics and so forth).

What do you mean here? I don't think there are any Switch game out yet that runs on Unreal Engine 4. (~Edit~ I missed Snake Pass apparently. Is that what you're refering to?) There's the upcoming Rime, and Dragon Quest XI that we know of. And regarding the latter, the fact that they haven't shown any footage of the Switch version yet, and that it will come out half a year later on Switch is hardly what I'd call a good sign. Especially considering that this game was one of, if not the, first potential Switch game to be announced from a third party, back in early 2015.

For all we know, the other UE4 games in development for Switch could all be lower budget indie games.

But yes, if devs want an Unreal Engine 4 or Frostbite game to scale down properly to Switch, they can easily do that if they design the game like that from scratch. The question is if they will, and I've gone into detail explaining why I have my doubts that they will this time, with certain, if not most, games.

As for the video, I've actually seen it before. And let me make it clear that I don't think Nintendo could have done much more regarding specs with the formfactor they chose. Not without overheating the system. It is a very powerful system considering it's design. But the fact that it's like a 7th the size of a PS4 Slim also comes with it's drawbacks.

DQXI was definitely a lazy port. Not sure what happened there, but it probably won't be the last lol

Otherwise, yeah, I was referring to Snake Pass, watched Digital Foundry's videos on it and was really encouraged by how well it was able to run the game given the port only took them one month to make.

The thing as, as I said in the OP I certainly wouldn't say that you're wrong because we really just don't know yet whether the motive will be there or not for devs to make the effort. For more recent AAA titles I certainly wouldn't expect to see any for a good year or two in the best of circumstances, but in the mean time I imagine we'll start seeing older games (like Skyrim) ported over at lower cost in an effort to feel out the market for such things on the Switch.

If the Switch continues to sell well and 3rd party games are well received, I strongly suspect we'll see more 3rd party AAA ports making their way over. That's not to say all of them will and others may come out months later, but the portable aspect of the Switch makes said ports worth buying, unlike on the previous two consoles.

Really, if I have a main concern for the Switch it's not so much the docked mode or even if it could run ports, but rather the battery life in portable mode. Hopefully they find some means of increasing battery life in the future.



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AZWification on 18 April 2017

I think the Switch will be fine with mostly Japanese 3rd party support, I think.



                
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theARTIST0017 on 18 April 2017

I want to read the OP but I also want to relax so I'm just going to answer the topic question, yes. The Switch just came out.



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