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Forums - Sports Discussion - The Pro Wrasslin' Thread (WWE, WWF, WCW, TNA, ROH, NWA, NJPW, etc)

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What match are you excited for at WWE Payback 2017?

Neville vs. Austin Aries ... 1 6.67%
 
Randy Orton vs. Bray Wyat... 3 20.00%
 
The Hardy Boyz vs. Cesaro... 2 13.33%
 
Kevin Owens vs. Chris Jer... 3 20.00%
 
Bayley vs. Alexa Bliss (Raw Women's Title) 3 20.00%
 
Seth Rollins vs. Samoa Joe 1 6.67%
 
Roman Reigns vs. Braun Strowman 2 13.33%
 
Total:15

Yeah that Shawn Spears vs CM Punk match was mind boggling.

Made him look as much of a joke as he was in WWE...



    

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ironmanDX said:

Yup.

I think they've almost overloaded on talent.

Need a proper "B" show when they get a consistent enough audience to accommodate for it.

Brand split is very wwe, I know but it works really well when done right.

I don't think they need a second brand. They need to establish AEW as a brand before they can worry about establishing Rampage or Dynamite on their own. They just need to hire less people and have someone who knows how to book booking them. Throwing everyone into a stable isn't the way. And prioritizing the right people. Daniel Garcia shouldn't be getting more time than Powerhouse Hobbes. And I can't figure out for the life of me why Riho is getting screen time at all.

BasilZero said:

Yeah that Shawn Spears vs CM Punk match was mind boggling.

Made him look as much of a joke as he was in WWE...

It was more confusing because last time we saw Punk, he got powerbombed like 20 times by Wardlow... So, if ever there was a time for Spears to look competitive, it was then. Have him immediately go for Punk's back. Having Punk come out looking fresh as a Daisy and beating Spears in 10 seconds not only makes Spears look like shit, but takes away from what Wardlow did. Not sure what it accomplished.



JWeinCom said:

With all the talk about AEW letting wrestlers shine, it's a bit confusing to see Shawn Spears lose in about 10 seconds (at least he's progressed from getting beat by double amputees in his debut), Jay Lethal being MIA for 30 days after his signing, Andrade doing nothing of note (although is he having Visa issues or something?), Christian Cage being third banana to Jungle Boy, and Jake Haggar doing nothing but standing behind Jericho looking mean for about three years, and hottest free agent in Wrestling Tony Nese going from being on WWE's third tier show nobody watched to being on AEW's third rate show nobody watches. The track record of people who hadn't been used well elsewhere being stars in AEW is mixed, at best. Some people who were already big names elsewhere (Danielson, Moxley, Sting, Jericho), are arguably being used better in AEW but in terms of people who were not being pushed as stars in other places being pushed as stars in AEW, it seems like a case of counting the hits (Ruby Soho, maybe Malakai Black, Pac) and ignoring the misses (mostly everyone else).

I just sorta see it as growing pains. They've done remarkably well overall and are growing their roster faster than their 3ish hours a week (not including Dark) can accommodate. I say give it some time, let them balance things out, and see where we end up. I'm sure once they've figured stuff out they'll do a nice even distribution. 



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Runa216 said:
JWeinCom said:

With all the talk about AEW letting wrestlers shine, it's a bit confusing to see Shawn Spears lose in about 10 seconds (at least he's progressed from getting beat by double amputees in his debut), Jay Lethal being MIA for 30 days after his signing, Andrade doing nothing of note (although is he having Visa issues or something?), Christian Cage being third banana to Jungle Boy, and Jake Haggar doing nothing but standing behind Jericho looking mean for about three years, and hottest free agent in Wrestling Tony Nese going from being on WWE's third tier show nobody watched to being on AEW's third rate show nobody watches. The track record of people who hadn't been used well elsewhere being stars in AEW is mixed, at best. Some people who were already big names elsewhere (Danielson, Moxley, Sting, Jericho), are arguably being used better in AEW but in terms of people who were not being pushed as stars in other places being pushed as stars in AEW, it seems like a case of counting the hits (Ruby Soho, maybe Malakai Black, Pac) and ignoring the misses (mostly everyone else).

I just sorta see it as growing pains. They've done remarkably well overall and are growing their roster faster than their 3ish hours a week (not including Dark) can accommodate. I say give it some time, let them balance things out, and see where we end up. I'm sure once they've figured stuff out they'll do a nice even distribution. 

What they're doing now does not speak positively towards their management. These are rookie mistakes happening in a company that has a lot of veteran experience. 


If there are some people within the company who are not that experienced, people whose name may rhyme with Sony Han for instance, then they should be in the back seat learning from the people in the company who have booked wrestling shows and managed wrestling companies. I'm sure if you can see these growing pains, someone like JR, who headed talent relations for WWE during a large swath of their most profitable period, could have seen them coming from a mile away. Which begs the question of why such things are happening.



JWeinCom said:
ironmanDX said:

Yup.

I think they've almost overloaded on talent.

Need a proper "B" show when they get a consistent enough audience to accommodate for it.

Brand split is very wwe, I know but it works really well when done right.

I don't think they need a second brand. They need to establish AEW as a brand before they can worry about establishing Rampage or Dynamite on their own. They just need to hire less people and have someone who knows how to book booking them. Throwing everyone into a stable isn't the way. And prioritizing the right people. Daniel Garcia shouldn't be getting more time than Powerhouse Hobbes. And I can't figure out for the life of me why Riho is getting screen time at all.

BasilZero said:

Yeah that Shawn Spears vs CM Punk match was mind boggling.

Made him look as much of a joke as he was in WWE...

It was more confusing because last time we saw Punk, he got powerbombed like 20 times by Wardlow... So, if ever there was a time for Spears to look competitive, it was then. Have him immediately go for Punk's back. Having Punk come out looking fresh as a Daisy and beating Spears in 10 seconds not only makes Spears look like shit, but takes away from what Wardlow did. Not sure what it accomplished.

Oh wow, didnt catch that since I dont watch AEW continually.


But damn, all to show how OP Punk is I guess.

Sucks it undermines two others.



    

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BasilZero said:
JWeinCom said:

I don't think they need a second brand. They need to establish AEW as a brand before they can worry about establishing Rampage or Dynamite on their own. They just need to hire less people and have someone who knows how to book booking them. Throwing everyone into a stable isn't the way. And prioritizing the right people. Daniel Garcia shouldn't be getting more time than Powerhouse Hobbes. And I can't figure out for the life of me why Riho is getting screen time at all.

BasilZero said:

Yeah that Shawn Spears vs CM Punk match was mind boggling.

Made him look as much of a joke as he was in WWE...

It was more confusing because last time we saw Punk, he got powerbombed like 20 times by Wardlow... So, if ever there was a time for Spears to look competitive, it was then. Have him immediately go for Punk's back. Having Punk come out looking fresh as a Daisy and beating Spears in 10 seconds not only makes Spears look like shit, but takes away from what Wardlow did. Not sure what it accomplished.

Oh wow, didnt catch that since I dont watch AEW continually.


But damn, all to show how OP Punk is I guess.

Sucks it undermines two others.

If I were to play Devil's advocate, I could argue that they're essentially booking Punk like Cena to play into a storyline where he's holding everyone back like he accused WWE of... But I think that's giving them a bit too much credit.

Punk's booking has been a bit weird since coming back. Feels almost like a different show within the show. Booked way different (and generally better) than everything else on the show. And where other storylines tend to bleed into eachother, his are compartmentalized and away from any titles. But, it hasn't really been doing favors for anyone else on the roster. I get after 7 years you don't want Punk to come in and lose (although that would have been interesting wouldn't it?), but at the same time, you don't need to spend time convincing people Punk is a big deal, since they've been chanting his name for nearly a decade. Feels like MJF will probably beat him, but who knows. It could also just be a case of power corrupting, and when Punk has the power to book himself as he pleases, this is how he does it.



JWeinCom said:

If I were to play Devil's advocate, I could argue that they're essentially booking Punk like Cena to play into a storyline where he's holding everyone back like he accused WWE of... But I think that's giving them a bit too much credit.

Punk's booking has been a bit weird since coming back. Feels almost like a different show within the show. Booked way different (and generally better) than everything else on the show. And where other storylines tend to bleed into eachother, his are compartmentalized and away from any titles. But, it hasn't really been doing favors for anyone else on the roster. I get after 7 years you don't want Punk to come in and lose (although that would have been interesting wouldn't it?), but at the same time, you don't need to spend time convincing people Punk is a big deal, since they've been chanting his name for nearly a decade. Feels like MJF will probably beat him, but who knows. It could also just be a case of power corrupting, and when Punk has the power to book himself as he pleases, this is how he does it.

I just hope it leads to a Danielson vs Punk match.



    

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Hmm... Idk.

Punk has been working with MID and lower card talent.

You'd expect him to win and he generally makes them look reasonably good in the process. Also puts tonnes of eyes on them they usually wouldn't have.

The Spears "match" was a I joke though.



ironmanDX said:

Hmm... Idk.

Punk has been working with MID and lower card talent.

You'd expect him to win and he generally makes them look reasonably good in the process. Also puts tonnes of eyes on them they usually wouldn't have.

The Spears "match" was a I joke though.

Don't think the people he has been working with have generally been getting much of a boost out of it. Maybe Kingston but I think he got injured after or during the match? That may be more due to overall inconsistency than Punk, but also maybe because of the booking. Generally, it's very hard for a midcarder to really get over on a random losing match against a top guy with no real build. I feel like the main point is to just get Punk on a show to try and pop a rating. Like stupid me who thought "Oh Shawn Spears and CM Punk, that will be good". It's still fairly early in his AEW run, but after the last couple of weeks, you definitely start wondering.



AEW Beach break sounds good from what I read.

This Sun is Royal Rumble - we know the Impact Knockouts champion is coming.

I wonder what other surprises we will see.


WWE's roster was so bloated that the past two years I cant think of any memorable surprise entrant for the Rumble PPV - think they just used everyone that they had actively.


Now that the roster is gutted - sure to get some surprises.



    

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