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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - SMD64: AMD confirms 1 unannounced gaming semi-custom design win. Surely it must be NX

 

What is NX?

Nvidia handheld only 39 17.41%
 
AMD handheld only 10 4.46%
 
AMD console only 41 18.30%
 
Nvidia handheld + AMD console 71 31.70%
 
Other 37 16.52%
 
NA/Undecided 26 11.61%
 
Total:224
fatslob-:O on 18 September 2016
Pemalite said:

AMD will always be behind Intel on fabrication. Always.

I don't know if that'll be true for much longer when we'll eventually transition from 193nm immersion lithography to 13.5nm EUV lithography so by that point everyone is even in terms of density when you start over with a smaller wavelength ...

Pemalite said:

HSA is not a game changer.

nVidia also has Denver 2. nVidia like all other ARM licensee's also has access to HSA.

HSA is definitely not a game changer since nobody but AAA console developers use it and I don't think Nintendo are too interested in the hardcore programming side if the WII U could be easily emulated with OpenGL ... 

Nvidia is probably more useful to Nintendo's use case than AMD is since their software ecosystem is very good. Nintendo could really leverage a robust physics library like PhysX or the tons of GameWorks samples they have on Github ... 



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Darc Requiem on 19 September 2016
archbrix said:
Soundwave said:

Talking about design wins ahead of the fact of unveil is unusual in the first place. AMD does it because they are desperate to give their stockholders something to chew on because they are not doing very well financially. 

Unusual or not, they never actually mentioned any of their wins by name until they had been officially announced, upon which they weren't shy about revealing what they were.  XB1 Slim has been revealed for some time now.

Exactly. In fact it was revealed before the PS4 Pro and PS4 Slim.



Pemalite on 19 September 2016
fatslob-:O said:
Pemalite said:

AMD will always be behind Intel on fabrication. Always.

I don't know if that'll be true for much longer when we'll eventually transition from 193nm immersion lithography to 13.5nm EUV lithography so by that point everyone is even in terms of density when you start over with a smaller wavelength ...

Even so, Intel will have the advantage, here is sram density for example:
TSMC 10nm = 0,0364µm²F (high density)
Intel 10nm = 0.0312µm²F / 0,0272µm²F

Logic Density = Contacted Gate Pitch x Minimum Metal Pitch:

TSMC 16FF+ - 90 x 70 = 6300
Intel 14nm - 70 x 52 = 3640
TSMC 10nm - 6300 /2.1 = 3000
TSMC 7nm - 3000/1.63 = 1840
Intel 10nm - 3640 / 2 = 1820

Would probably help if we made the shift to 450mm wafers already, ARM SoC's being driven by Apple and Samsung are the driving force between TSMC's fab development these days.
AMD even stated it might stick to 14nm for up-to 5 years.

Intel is going to still have the edge at 10nm and lower processes, the advantage of course will shrink.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Game_God on 25 September 2016
Soundwave said:
archbrix said:

Exactly.  Not that I necessarily believe one rumor over the other, but for consistency's sake, it's either both slims or neither, meaning there would still be one design win left to claim.

Not neccssarily, it's possible the XBox One redesign required so much work and R&D and perhaps even a new contract agreement that it's effectively a new semi-custom design because of one huge difference between the two devices -- that huge chunk of eSRAM on the GPU. There are also other changes to the XBox One S like an internal integrated power supply that would require probably a completely new type of cooling system. 

It's likely much simpler to die-shrink the PS4. There's no eSRAM, the power supply was already internal, etc. etc. etc. 

Die shrinks are not all equivalent. 

Though I suspect the third AMD design win is outside a gaming console. There are lots of rumors of Apple and AMD working together on something. 

I guess not after all, Nvidia are the ones working with Apple:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-09-23/nvidia-job-postings-suggest-an-nvidia-chip-return-to-apple-macs



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n29CicBxZuw

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EricHiggin on 25 September 2016

With all the talk of how AMD had Keller and his team work on both Zen(x86) and K12(ARM) together at the same time, which Keller said is not normal, and how K12 apparently has some Zen baked into its architecture, I gotta believe its AMD. Having the ARM handheld and x86 console with compatibility between them would be a dream come true for NIN. Even if its just a handheld and dock with ARM, that x86 baked in should be the bridge for 3rd party games to run on it fairly easily.

The timeline of how Zen and K12 will be ready by early 2017 and NX launches March 2017 seems suspicious. The fact that NIN has worked with AMD(ATI) since Gamecube, and now for 4 years straight, PS4, Pro, XOne, and Scorpio all have AMD APU's in them, and for good reason, how can't NIN be using AMD?

If it is only a hybrid handheld dock and not a replacement for the mobile handheld space, then NIN shouldn't be to worried about the power draw and battery. If that's what you want there's the 3DS. Play on the go will be the gimmick. You wont be able to play for near as long as you could on a 3DS, but it'll be an new option. (Unless maybe NIN sells one of those backpacks with a li-on battery in it that you can connect the handheld to for extended battery life)
If they do want to replace both, than the handheld just automatically scales down the settings overall when your on the go, saving power on the battery. Drop it in the dock and its got a constant power source and it scales everything up to max settings. (Add the SCD to the dock and overall performance is boosted even more so. Just throwing that out there as a possibility)



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Soundwave on 26 September 2016
EricHiggin said:
With all the talk of how AMD had Keller and his team work on both Zen(x86) and K12(ARM) together at the same time, which Keller said is not normal, and how K12 apparently has some Zen baked into its architecture, I gotta believe its AMD. Having the ARM handheld and x86 console with compatibility between them would be a dream come true for NIN. Even if its just a handheld and dock with ARM, that x86 baked in should be the bridge for 3rd party games to run on it fairly easily.

The timeline of how Zen and K12 will be ready by early 2017 and NX launches March 2017 seems suspicious. The fact that NIN has worked with AMD(ATI) since Gamecube, and now for 4 years straight, PS4, Pro, XOne, and Scorpio all have AMD APU's in them, and for good reason, how can't NIN be using AMD?

If it is only a hybrid handheld dock and not a replacement for the mobile handheld space, then NIN shouldn't be to worried about the power draw and battery. If that's what you want there's the 3DS. Play on the go will be the gimmick. You wont be able to play for near as long as you could on a 3DS, but it'll be an new option. (Unless maybe NIN sells one of those backpacks with a li-on battery in it that you can connect the handheld to for extended battery life)
If they do want to replace both, than the handheld just automatically scales down the settings overall when your on the go, saving power on the battery. Drop it in the dock and its got a constant power source and it scales everything up to max settings. (Add the SCD to the dock and overall performance is boosted even more so. Just throwing that out there as a possibility)

When people say "Nintendo can't do this" and "Nintendo can't do that" .... Nintendo does whatever the fuck they please. 

No one was expecting the Wii/Revolution to be literally a GameCube overclocked. In fact I remember Nintendo fans on the internet at that time getting very angry at Perrin Kaplan (NOA rep) for saying Wii was only "three times" the power of the GameCube (which actually it wasn't even that). And people started calling her all types of horrible names and saying she didn't know what she was talking about. 

Everyone thought for sure Wii U would be close to 1 TFLOP at least, with the AMD 4850 GPU being sighted as the "can't miss" option for Nintendo. The actual Wii U GPU wasn't even close (nor was the CPU, which was supposed to be some super-duper IBM chip). 

Just because Nintendo worked with AMD for a while doesn't mean it was going to last forever either. Nintendo worked with Sony (SNES sound chip provider) once upon a time too, they've worked with RAMBUS, IBM, SGI, Sharp, Toshiba, NEC, Matsushita/Panasonic, DMP, etc. etc. over the year, there's not a whole lot of consistency.



Game_God on 26 September 2016
Soundwave said:
EricHiggin said:
With all the talk of how AMD had Keller and his team work on both Zen(x86) and K12(ARM) together at the same time, which Keller said is not normal, and how K12 apparently has some Zen baked into its architecture, I gotta believe its AMD. Having the ARM handheld and x86 console with compatibility between them would be a dream come true for NIN. Even if its just a handheld and dock with ARM, that x86 baked in should be the bridge for 3rd party games to run on it fairly easily.

The timeline of how Zen and K12 will be ready by early 2017 and NX launches March 2017 seems suspicious. The fact that NIN has worked with AMD(ATI) since Gamecube, and now for 4 years straight, PS4, Pro, XOne, and Scorpio all have AMD APU's in them, and for good reason, how can't NIN be using AMD?

If it is only a hybrid handheld dock and not a replacement for the mobile handheld space, then NIN shouldn't be to worried about the power draw and battery. If that's what you want there's the 3DS. Play on the go will be the gimmick. You wont be able to play for near as long as you could on a 3DS, but it'll be an new option. (Unless maybe NIN sells one of those backpacks with a li-on battery in it that you can connect the handheld to for extended battery life)
If they do want to replace both, than the handheld just automatically scales down the settings overall when your on the go, saving power on the battery. Drop it in the dock and its got a constant power source and it scales everything up to max settings. (Add the SCD to the dock and overall performance is boosted even more so. Just throwing that out there as a possibility)

When people say "Nintendo can't do this" and "Nintendo can't do that" .... Nintendo does whatever the fuck they please. 

No one was expecting the Wii/Revolution to be literally a GameCube overclocked. In fact I remember Nintendo fans on the internet at that time getting very angry at Perrin Kaplan (NOA rep) for saying Wii was only "three times" the power of the GameCube (which actually it wasn't even that). And people started calling her all types of horrible names and saying she didn't know what she was talking about. 

Everyone thought for sure Wii U would be close to 1 TFLOP at least, with the AMD 4850 GPU being sighted as the "can't miss" option for Nintendo. The actual Wii U GPU wasn't even close (nor was the CPU, which was supposed to be some super-duper IBM chip). 

Just because Nintendo worked with AMD for a while doesn't mean it was going to last forever either. Nintendo worked with Sony (SNES sound chip provider) once upon a time too, they've worked with RAMBUS, IBM, SGI, Sharp, Toshiba, NEC, Matsushita/Panasonic, DMP, etc. etc. over the year, there's not a whole lot of consistency.

Yet it leaves that 3rd mistery SOC from AMD in the open... for someting launching in 2017, that they can't speak of... you gotta admit that the probability is it being for NX is looking better at least!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n29CicBxZuw

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craighopkins on 26 September 2016

Do you guys think they will announce somethin soon or not till next year



Soundwave on 26 September 2016
Game_God said:
Soundwave said:

When people say "Nintendo can't do this" and "Nintendo can't do that" .... Nintendo does whatever the fuck they please. 

No one was expecting the Wii/Revolution to be literally a GameCube overclocked. In fact I remember Nintendo fans on the internet at that time getting very angry at Perrin Kaplan (NOA rep) for saying Wii was only "three times" the power of the GameCube (which actually it wasn't even that). And people started calling her all types of horrible names and saying she didn't know what she was talking about. 

Everyone thought for sure Wii U would be close to 1 TFLOP at least, with the AMD 4850 GPU being sighted as the "can't miss" option for Nintendo. The actual Wii U GPU wasn't even close (nor was the CPU, which was supposed to be some super-duper IBM chip). 

Just because Nintendo worked with AMD for a while doesn't mean it was going to last forever either. Nintendo worked with Sony (SNES sound chip provider) once upon a time too, they've worked with RAMBUS, IBM, SGI, Sharp, Toshiba, NEC, Matsushita/Panasonic, DMP, etc. etc. over the year, there's not a whole lot of consistency.

Yet it leaves that 3rd mistery SOC from AMD in the open... for someting launchingin 2017, that they can't speak of... you gotta admit that the probability is it being for NX is looking better at least!

The probability is low IMO. They also specifically cited that one of those chips is for beyond gaming and have been linked to working with something with Apple. 

I trust Peer from IGN, he's said they cross referenced the Eurogamer leak with several of their own sources, I'm going with that until I see a legit source say AMD. 



craighopkins on 26 September 2016

I have to say Soundwave makes some good points. Nvidia maybe caved in and gave a good deal so amd didn't have all 3 console companys with amd