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Forums - Gaming - Sony Tries to Downplay Microsoft’s Project Scorpio Hardware Power

Well you know this is gonna end well when the person writing the piece refers of the geforce 980 as the same thing as the geforce 1080, Then even using NVIDIA "tflops" as à reference... 

They obviously mean something, but compare the r9 290 (4.8tflops) to the r9 390x (5.9tflops) ... neither is exactly the rumored specs (4.4 v.s. 6) but if you search you can see the potential difference between those two cards... now, sometimes it's significant, while others it's in the 8 to 10% range... 

The truth is we don't know for sure what the exact final specs will be, what's the fill rate of both systems, their CPUs (well, we have zero idea of Scorios's CPU at least) and if scorpio will have more than 8GB of RAM... and their respective prices too...

If the Scorpio is more powerful (it seems it will be) AND much more expensive than the Neo it could go either way as to who will come out on top, if they both cost the same (it would be surprising) then the Scorpio has a definite advantage, assuming it's going to be more powerful... however there is one thing to take into account that has never been an issue before, full forward AND backward compatibility, which means that when you make a purchase and want to keep playing CoD with your friends you can now, as most people are on PS4 that could make their decision harder, especially if the prices are aligned with the console's respective power enveloppes.

and there is the whole PC thing, I have an HTPC and was never a fan of the xbox "exclusives" to begin with, but if I was I would not have to buy the machine (and my gaming PC is almost a 1-to-1 what scorpio could end up being).



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Naufraguito said:
Swordmasterman said:

There already is Crossplay between PC and consoles on Several games you don't need to release your exclusives for the PC to get this feature, the Crossbuy only works if you have a PC and an Xbox One and by some reason you want 2 copies of the same game, this will not make someone who already have a PC purchase a Xbox One or someone with a PS4/Wii U, People  would purchase Sony or Nintendo's console and upgrade their computer later because this would  make their game library wider than it is, Why someone would purchase a console to play the same and even less games that they would be able to play on PC ?.

Xbox Scorpio is designed for Hardcore users and for 4K television market this means that Microsoft don't intend to make it popular they instead intend to make much profit from it and make the other Xbox One consoles popular.

PS4 Neo and Scorpio will be much expensive, Neo would still have the PS4's exclusives to make it sell, Xbox One would cost pretty much the same as a good PC and would not  have the games that PC have neither the freedom of the PC market.

The real point in crossplay is not really having an XBO and a PC, is keeping your library of games beyond platforms and beyond generations. The point is that you now have a XBO but then in 2 or 3 years switch to a PC, but in 8 years Scorpio 2 really seduces you, but you are going to be capable of play your games ever.

What MS is doing is increasing the value of their software, and also their platforms. When you buy a digital game to MS you will be able to play on PC or Xbox, and you will in the future, and forever. I don't know if 

Maybe that will be a selling point, maybe people will ignore it, or don't get it, but this is what Microsoft propose, and I think is great.

This sounds like Backwards compatibility like a lot of the other consoles had this far throught the Generations, and as we saw last year Backwards will not sell consoles, and this thing of Xbox + PC cross-everything will only work for the ones who have a PC and purchased a Xbox One, this will not work for the ones that plan to purchase a Console, or for the ones that  have a PC and plan to purchase a Console.



CGI-Quality said:
Angelus said:
And suddenly everyone switches viewpoints from the start of the gen and develops amnesia about how each console was marketed.

Shall I pretend to be shocked?

While I have a suspicision of where you're going with this, humor me.

Well if you look at both consoles' first E3s and the build up, Sony was constantly on about it being the most powerful console ever, and the fans were all gloating about it. Meanwhile MS was like ya that's nice but we got blockbuster games actually releasing soon, and the fans were all ya guys Sony has no games guys, so who cares about your power.

 

Now it looks like MS is gonna end up with the more powerful system, and suddenly Xbox fans wanna gloat, and Sony fans are all like whatever....who needs it....

 

Not really going after one side or the other here, just amused at the very typical console war flip flopping.



Angelus said:
CGI-Quality said:

While I have a suspicision of where you're going with this, humor me.

Well if you look at both consoles' first E3s and the build up, Sony was constantly on about it being the most powerful console ever, and the fans were all gloating about it. Meanwhile MS was like ya that's nice but we got blockbuster games actually releasing soon, and the fans were all ya guys Sony has no games guys, so who cares about your power.

 

Now it looks like MS is gonna end up with the more powerful system, and suddenly Xbox fans wanna gloat, and Sony fans are all like whatever....who needs it....

 

Not really going after one side or the other here, just amused at the very typical console war flip flopping.

It is very easy for someone like Phill Spencer to dictate what people comment in the forums with just a indirect statement, like PS4 has no games (Because of Microsoft's strong push in the Holidays), or now that you cannot announce games without release date at E3.



Swordmasterman said:
Naufraguito said:

The real point in crossplay is not really having an XBO and a PC, is keeping your library of games beyond platforms and beyond generations. The point is that you now have a XBO but then in 2 or 3 years switch to a PC, but in 8 years Scorpio 2 really seduces you, but you are going to be capable of play your games ever.

What MS is doing is increasing the value of their software, and also their platforms. When you buy a digital game to MS you will be able to play on PC or Xbox, and you will in the future, and forever. I don't know if 

Maybe that will be a selling point, maybe people will ignore it, or don't get it, but this is what Microsoft propose, and I think is great.

This sounds like Backwards compatibility like a lot of the other consoles had this far throught the Generations, and as we saw last year Backwards will not sell consoles, and this thing of Xbox + PC cross-everything will only work for the ones who have a PC and purchased a Xbox One, this will not work for the ones that plan to purchase a Console, or for the ones that  have a PC and plan to purchase a Console.

The absence of full BC on consoles, is the reason why a lot of people never gonna have any consola as a primary gaming platform. The absence of BC is inexcusable with the hardware we have today, and will have tomorrow, and adquires a new dimension with the digital market. You say BC doesn't sell hardware, but it sells software.

What Microsoft is trying to do is bringing some of the benefits of PC platforms to the consoles. BC maybe doesn't sell hardware (we will see when BC means tons of games of past generations and not only the last one) but Microsoft is focusing primarily in selling software. 

Like I've said in the past days, I wouldn't be surprised if MS allows another stores on Xbox, and hardware Xbox compatible from another companies. The future of the Xbox Brand is the Surface model.



Tim and The Princes...

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Naufraguito said:
Swordmasterman said:

This sounds like Backwards compatibility like a lot of the other consoles had this far throught the Generations, and as we saw last year Backwards will not sell consoles, and this thing of Xbox + PC cross-everything will only work for the ones who have a PC and purchased a Xbox One, this will not work for the ones that plan to purchase a Console, or for the ones that  have a PC and plan to purchase a Console.

The absence of full BC on consoles, is the reason why a lot of people never gonna have any consola as a primary gaming platform. The absence of BC is inexcusable with the hardware we have today, and will have tomorrow, and adquires a new dimension with the digital market. You say BC doesn't sell hardware, but it sells software.

What Microsoft is trying to do is bringing some of the benefits of PC platforms to the consoles. BC maybe doesn't sell hardware (we will see when BC means tons of games of past generations and not only the last one) but Microsoft is focusing primarily in selling software. 

Like I've said in the past days, I wouldn't be surprised if MS allows another stores on Xbox, and hardware Xbox compatible from another companies. The future of the Xbox Brand is the Surface model.

I don't think that releasing games from generations prior to the 7th will be a Factor for anything since every toast can run 6th gen backwards with a emulator.

For Microsoft to have success with the Xbox Scorpio they need to have a big install base and now you are talking about Software sales ?, how they will have good software sales without install base ?, and Windows 10 purchases via PC will not count as a Xbox version and there is no reason  for Microsoft to invest in the Scorpio if majority of their revenue is coming from the PC, and there is no reason to not go Third Party like Steam, Steam even with their own store on the PC they release their games for the consoles.

If Microsoft don't want to go third party so they indeed care about Hardware sales but it seems that they need the Brand more profitable in order to continue with the Hardware.



Pemalite said:
Azuren said:

Right, but what happens when a console has NO exclusives? Well, I can either get a PC and a PS4 to get roughly 90% of the games released within 8th Gen, or I can get a PC and an XB1 and have a fairly redundant library. It's an even more extreme scenerio of PS3 vs XB360; most of their libraries were shared to the point that unless you just HAD to have Halo and God of War it was almost a bad decision to buy both.

The only way I can see the crossbuy thing working out in the end is if you have an XB1 and a Gaming Laptop, allowing you to take your games on the go. And even then: why not just get a laptop $300 more powerful instead?

Valid point.

With that said.. The Original Xbox didn't really have any exclusives, they were all on PC (Halo, Fable etc') and they still managed to beat Nintendo's Gamecube which had a ton more exclusives (StarFox, Mario, Zelda, Metroid etc'.)

I do own an Xbox One and Multiple PC's though, the value I find is that they are platforms that don't really compete with each other in the traditional sense... But they are platforms that augment each other.
Being able to buy a game on my Xbox One and play it in the loungeroom on a 65" screen... And then jump into bed and play that same game on my Laptop... Or having someone play on my Xbox One and I am on my high-end Desktop and playing that exact same game together... That's a big sell for me.

Most people are more interested in what their friends own, what games they are playing and rather play with them, that was one of the draw cards for the Xbox 360 and Call of Duty over the Playstation 3 for tons of people.

I don't feel comparing anything to Nintendo home consoles is a relevant argument anymore. With the exception of Wii's casual demographic, Nintendo home consoles have made less and less every generation. A better way to look at it is "OG Xbox was more powerful than PS2, but was outsold 10:1." In addition to that, the PC crowd was only a fraction back then of what it is now. Being on PC meant you could say "Yeah, this game is exclusive" and everyone would agree.

 

Losing exclusives altogether has simply turned Xbox into Microsoft's very own steam machine.



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Swordmasterman said:
Naufraguito said:

The absence of full BC on consoles, is the reason why a lot of people never gonna have any consola as a primary gaming platform. The absence of BC is inexcusable with the hardware we have today, and will have tomorrow, and adquires a new dimension with the digital market. You say BC doesn't sell hardware, but it sells software.

What Microsoft is trying to do is bringing some of the benefits of PC platforms to the consoles. BC maybe doesn't sell hardware (we will see when BC means tons of games of past generations and not only the last one) but Microsoft is focusing primarily in selling software. 

Like I've said in the past days, I wouldn't be surprised if MS allows another stores on Xbox, and hardware Xbox compatible from another companies. The future of the Xbox Brand is the Surface model.

I don't think that releasing games from generations prior to the 7th will be a Factor for anything since every toast can run 6th gen backwards with a emulator.

For Microsoft to have success with the Xbox Scorpio they need to have a big install base and now you are talking about Software sales ?, how they will have good software sales without install base ?, and Windows 10 purchases via PC will not count as a Xbox version and there is no reason  for Microsoft to invest in the Scorpio if majority of their revenue is coming from the PC, and there is no reason to not go Third Party like Steam, Steam even with their own store on the PC they release their games for the consoles.

If Microsoft don't want to go third party so they indeed care about Hardware sales but it seems that they need the Brand more profitable in order to continue with the Hardware.

I'm not talking about releasing older software, I'm talking about that MS is telling you that you can play the software you buy now in their platforms beyond generations. They are telling you that if you buy their software for Xbone, you will play it in Scorpio, and Xbox Two, and in Scorpio 3, and if in the future you join the PC master race, you'll be able to play your games also, and viceversa. That's something that only MS can offer you, at least right now (if MS succeed and make money, one day we'll see Playstation Store for PC for sure).

In the other hand, of course they want to sell hardware, but they're trying a different aproach, they're releasing dirty cheap hardware, and more expensive more powerful of the same, and let you choose between one, or the other, or PC. They are not trying to sell hardware with exclusive games, they're trying to sell hardware by the hardware itself, and letting you know that later you can choose to switch between their platforms knowing that your game library is going to follow you. And that is something that today only MS are offering you.

Of course that model can fail, maybe the consumers don't like it, or don't get it, but is not a nonsense, is very clever already, and if suceed it's gonna be good, not only for microsoft but for the gaming industry, and the players in general. All console should be BC and letting you play your software on the platform you choose. Playing your games on a console must be a choice, not an imposition.

If PS5 is fully BC, and let you play their exclusives on PC give thanks to Microsoft.



Tim and The Princes...

Naufraguito said:
Swordmasterman said:

I don't think that releasing games from generations prior to the 7th will be a Factor for anything since every toast can run 6th gen backwards with a emulator.

For Microsoft to have success with the Xbox Scorpio they need to have a big install base and now you are talking about Software sales ?, how they will have good software sales without install base ?, and Windows 10 purchases via PC will not count as a Xbox version and there is no reason  for Microsoft to invest in the Scorpio if majority of their revenue is coming from the PC, and there is no reason to not go Third Party like Steam, Steam even with their own store on the PC they release their games for the consoles.

If Microsoft don't want to go third party so they indeed care about Hardware sales but it seems that they need the Brand more profitable in order to continue with the Hardware.

I'm not talking about releasing older software, I'm talking about that MS is telling you that you can play the software you buy now in their platforms beyond generations. They are telling you that if you buy their software for Xbone, you will play it in Scorpio, and Xbox Two, and in Scorpio 3, and if in the future you join the PC master race, you'll be able to play your games also, and viceversa. That's something that only MS can offer you, at least right now (if MS succeed and make money, one day we'll see Playstation Store for PC for sure).

In the other hand, of course they want to sell hardware, but they're trying a different aproach, they're releasing dirty cheap hardware, and more expensive more powerful of the same, and let you choose between one, or the other, or PC. They are not trying to sell hardware with exclusive games, they're trying to sell hardware by the hardware itself, and letting you know that later you can choose to switch between their platforms knowing that your game library is going to follow you. And that is something that today only MS are offering you.

Of course that model can fail, maybe the consumers don't like it, or don't get it, but is not a nonsense, is very clever already, and if suceed it's gonna be good, not only for microsoft but for the gaming industry, and the players in general. All console should be BC and letting you play your software on the platform you choose. Playing your games on a console must be a choice, not an imposition.

If PS5 is fully BC, and you can play their exclusives on PC give thanks to Microsoft.

Would be harmful for the industrie to have no exclusive because this would mean the end of the Consoles, Microsoft don't get nothing from PC hardwares sold unless it is their PC that is being sold, 98% of Windows's users are normal people who don't play games and majority are not interested in playing games so Releasing all their exclusives for the PC isn't a  push for the Windows 10 because it would be meaningless because they would get the same number of users anyway.

Microsoft isn't the only in the industrie that can offer backwards compatibility it isn't exclusive for them and this also isn't a selling factor since even with Backwards Microsoft was unable to raise the sales of the Xbox One, and I also don't think that people will purchase a console now because they will be able to play the same games 3 generations after that, So if people were able to play PS1 games on the PS4 this would sell more Hardware for Sony ?, I think that Nintendo let you play games from Snes/Nintendo 64 and other systems in their consoles and even so they are not selling well.

 

Microsoft will not suceed without exclusives because they are making their product obsolete, Microsoft have a big follow up in the USA but this move would make the Xbox One even weaker out-side of the USA.



The way I see it, games will be 4K 30 FPS on medium settings and not all games will pull this off... Most devs will simply create the best version for the XSC and eventually it will become just another 360 vs PS3 like in the good old times...