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Forums - Sony - Mobile Gaming Didn't Kill The Vita -- Sony Did

pokoko said:
People who think the Vita died because Sony didn't support it really, really need to take a look at what really happened. Sony supported the Vita. Sony STOPPED supporting the Vita because the Vita failed, not the other way around. It just simply was not working.


Very much this. It had an exclusive Assassin's Creed, Uncharted, Wipeout, Call of Duty, Little Big Planet, along with many major multi platform titles including FIFA, Need for Speed, Sonic Allstars Racing: Transformed (a long with a load of other decent software) all in it's first holiday. If the biggest franchises in gaming couldn't shift it, not much else was going to...

I also find it doubtful that memory cards were a deal breaker for millions and millions of consumers. The logical conclusion is just that the Vita is a product that nobody really wants outside a minority.

Reason the Vita failed? Pretty much exactly the emmergence of mobile gaming/smartphones.

Look at the big marketing points of the PSP. Yes, it had "console quality" gaming... kind of. However, it was also a cheap MP3 player, and portable movie player. It was an all in one entertainment device.

Fast Forward to 2012 and the iPhone and it's rivals have pretty much taken every single additional appeal of the PSP and bettered it. (not only can you play mp3s, you can stream them directly to your phone. Want the latest movie? Yep it's on iTunes or the Play Store to buy or rent) it's much easier to carry around than a PSP was too. Fits in most people's pockets, far more practical and with far more uses.

On the gaming front. Portable consoles used to be the only way to be able to play games on the go. Yes the quality takes a hit on mobiles, but it's "good enough" for a 10 minute wait at the bus stop or whatever. So the casual end of the handheld market has completely evaporated.

On top of this, Nintendo were incredibly aggressive in the run up to the Vita launch having significantly reduced the retail price of the 3DS and rushed it's biggest games to market for the Holiday prior to Vita's launch grabbing the floating consumer who was until then undecided between the two.

Yes Nintendo's decline isn't as severe, but it's audience bought a DS purely for gaming, not for multimedia functionality. In reality though, the fact that Western Publishers have all but abandoned even the 3DS, it's quite clear that the entire market is in serious trouble. You only need to look at NPD's findings that 60% of kids are now gaming on a phone/tablet rather than a dedicated system to demonstrate this. And people growing up with mobile gaming, will likely always stick with it and the market will only decline further from here.

/Doom.

Sony's repositioning of the system as one for Indies and lower budget games has paid dividends however. I'm extremely impressed at the huge catalogue such a bomba of a system has managed to gain and it goes to show that there is a lot of active gamers on the Vita.



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AbbathTheGrim said:

- a reaction to Shuhei Yoshida statement that there is no climate for a successor of the Vita, thread:

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=208574&page=1

- Nintendo has sold over 50 million 3DSes without Minecraft

- in spite of the huge impact of mobile on the traditional videogame industry Sony is responsible for the performance of the Vita

- Here is a partial list of reasons the Vita has failed:

  • Sony decided to gouge customers by forcing them to use proprietary memory cards, then jacking up the prices to obscene levels. (A 32GB Vita memory card retails for $100; standard 32GB SDHC memory cards cost $18.)
  • Sony marketed the Vita as a portable system with “console-quality gaming,” then went on to pack it with shoddy spinoffs like Uncharted: Golden Abyss, Call of Duty: Declassified, and Resistance: Burning Skies.
  • Despite all this, a subset of hardcore gamers quickly realized that the Vita was a fantastic machine for indies and niche Japanese games. So what did Sony do? They decided to pivot it as a portable accessory to the PS4—as if anyone would dish out an extra $250 to play Destiny on the toilet.
  • Vita owners also realized that the machine is fantastic for playing old PS1 and PSP games. Sony saw how much money they could make there, and they immediately filled out the PlayStation Store, pleasing fans with truckloads of classic new games every week. Just kidding. They ignored it. Even today you need to use a silly shortcut just to get some old games working on your Vita.
  • Remember the PS2? One of the most successful video game consoles in history? Chock full of great games that could be ported to the Vita in various ways? Someone should remind Sony.
  • Remember BioShock Vita? lmao
  • Sony has pretty much spent the past two years pretending the Vita doesn’t exist, ignoring it at every major trade show and convention. It’s embarrassing.
  • Sony has publicly admitted that they are no longer making Vita games.

http://kotaku.com/mobile-gaming-didnt-kill-the-vita-sony-did-1733350950?

How much do you think it is Sony's responsibility for Vita underperforming?

You're dead wrong and I don't need to write up 10 page research paper with sources to prove it either. It's really quite simple and it boils down to demographs. 

The 3DS, regardless of whether people in these forums wants to admit it or not, sells to kids. The majority of it's sales are to the under 10 demograph. The Vita was marketed towards teens and adults. The problem is, that demograph uses their iPhones to play games. So basically, what Yoshida said is correct. As far as making and selling a teen/adult dedicated handheld, there isn't a market anymore because iPhones and other smart phones have taken that audience away.



I don't think the article is very accurate because when something happens, it almost never is caused solely by one reason

Mobile and the switch to more casual gaming impacted the handheld market a lot. It's really obvious with the 3DS, selling a lot less than the NDS. Why buy a system when you can get a game on your phone that you already had for free? Likewise, the Vita faced the same problem and sales number dropped



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@pokoko

What a defensive, ignorant and outright hostile response. You're a lousy member of this community if this is any indication of how you conduct yourself here. I don't know why but I'm going to waste my time spelling things out for you.

"Seriously, your "triple the units" theory is nothing but head-in-the-sand bullshit from someone who clearly does not understand that the market has changed to a massive degree."

If the Vita was between double and triple its current popularity it would end up about half as popular as the PSP which would be a similar contraction in popularity that the 3DS is facing. What is so hard to believe about this scenario exactly?

"THE AVERAGE ADULT IS NOT GOING TO BUY A DEDICATED HANDHELD GAMING SYSTEM.  The interest is NOT THERE.  It is no longer a necessary device.  Most adults can play games on a device THEY ALREADY OWN."


Just because you say that there is no market for dedicated handhelds outside of Nintendo does not make that a fact, understood? As a huge PSP fan I am telling you that I, and other individuals I know were very interested in a proper successor to the PSP when the Vita released. Just because the market has largely moved on right now does not mean that Sony could not have launched a successful handheld five years ago and that they could not have retained more of their former users. Also, I don't see the games that I enjoyed on my PSP making their way to smartphones, that market is not satisfying my needs.

"Nintendo is getting around that ONLY because they have legacy software what was PREVIOUSLY a massive hit, giving it instant brand recognition with millions of people.  What does Sony have to counter that in the handheld space?"

Believe it or not but Sony has popular legacy games that were previously massive hits and brand recognition with millions of people. There is no reason why they could not have released new Jak & Dexter, Ratchet & Clank, Gran Turismo and God of War games for the Vita. Before you respond with some bloviating nonsense about how these are not as popular as Nintendo games I'm going to cut you off and state that's not what I'm implying here. I'm saying that these games would make the Vita more popular than it currently is by attracting PSP owners.

"New IPs will do nothing."

Again, you are doing literally nothing to support your comment and what you assert without evidence I will dismiss without evidence. Although, just to double down I'm going to point out Nintendogs and Brain Age. There is no reason why Sony shouldn't have attempted to create new franchises that appealed to new audiences, especially during the Vita's launch. It's not like it's impossible to create a new market with original concepts if you execute them well.

"The failure of the Vita is directly linked to the failures of the PSP."

The PSP sold over 80 million units and was a very profitable venture for Sony and no amount of burying your head in the sand can change these facts. The PSP was a success despite Sony's failures later in its lifespan such as the PSP Go.

"The Vita was never going to be a hit."

Again, simply stating something as if it were a fact does not make it so. The Vita certainly could have been a modest success if they had handled the launch, price, memory cards and first party support better.

"Tell me what these games are that would have made the system triple its sales?  What does Sony have that would have pushed those kinds of numbers?  I'd love to know and I bet Sony would, as well."

Jak & Dexter, Ratchet & Clank and God of War were all successful on the PSP and Uncharted, Resistance and Gran Turismo could have been if Sony had handled them better. Additionally, if the Vita weren't such a spectacular failure maybe they could have successfully lobbied for popular third party titles such as Grand Theft Auto or Monster Hunter. How is the very concept of a PlayStation handheld selling 35 million units so hard to grasp for you?

Before you respond again grow up and show a shred of respect kid. Stop dismissing anybody who disagrees with you and stop acting like an obnoxious brat. I never treated you in such a fashion despite the fact that you did absolutely nothing to back up your absurd claims that correcting the Vita's launch date, price, memory card and first party support would have done virtually nothing to increase its popularity. Again, I'm not dispting the fact that smartphones have had the greatest impact on the Vita's success (or lack thereof) but let's not pretend that Sony could not have done anything to retain a far greater percentage of their users with a more well thought out and supported system. The Vita could have reached 30-35 million units by now if they had played their cards right, that scenario is not literally impossible and you can snarl and CAPSLOCK all you want. Stop throwing a fit, calm down and accept the fact that people disagree (and actually backup their claims unlike you).



Sony are responsible but there is a reason why 3DS is getting trounced by the DS.



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MikeRox said:


Very much this. It had an exclusive Assassin's Creed, Uncharted, Wipeout, Call of Duty, Little Big Planet, along with many major multi platform titles including FIFA, Need for Speed, Sonic Allstars Racing: Transformed (a long with a load of other decent software) all in it's first holiday. If the biggest franchises in gaming couldn't shift it, not much else was going to...

I also find it doubtful that memory cards were a deal breaker for millions and millions of consumers. The logical conclusion is just that the Vita is a product that nobody really wants outside a minority.

Reason the Vita failed? Pretty much exactly the emmergence of mobile gaming/smartphones.

Look at the big marketing points of the PSP. Yes, it had "console quality" gaming... kind of. However, it was also a cheap MP3 player, and portable movie player. It was an all in one entertainment device.

Fast Forward to 2012 and the iPhone and it's rivals have pretty much taken every single additional appeal of the PSP and bettered it. (not only can you play mp3s, you can stream them directly to your phone. Want the latest movie? Yep it's on iTunes or the Play Store to buy or rent) it's much easier to carry around than a PSP was too. Fits in most people's pockets, far more practical and with far more uses.

On the gaming front. Portable consoles used to be the only way to be able to play games on the go. Yes the quality takes a hit on mobiles, but it's "good enough" for a 10 minute wait at the bus stop or whatever. So the casual end of the handheld market has completely evaporated.

On top of this, Nintendo were incredibly aggressive in the run up to the Vita launch having significantly reduced the retail price of the 3DS and rushed it's biggest games to market for the Holiday prior to Vita's launch grabbing the floating consumer who was until then undecided between the two.

Yes Nintendo's decline isn't as severe, but it's audience bought a DS purely for gaming, not for multimedia functionality. In reality though, the fact that Western Publishers have all but abandoned even the 3DS, it's quite clear that the entire market is in serious trouble. You only need to look at NPD's findings that 60% of kids are now gaming on a phone/tablet rather than a dedicated system to demonstrate this. And people growing up with mobile gaming, will likely always stick with it and the market will only decline further from here.

/Doom.

Sony's repositioning of the system as one for Indies and lower budget games has paid dividends however. I'm extremely impressed at the huge catalogue such a bomba of a system has managed to gain and it goes to show that there is a lot of active gamers on the Vita.

Such a fine post which covers many viewpoints.



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ArchangelMadzz said:
Sony are responsible but there is a reason why 3DS is getting trounced by the DS.

Smart phones and tablets?



Vita had better chance to keep its Asian audience than 3DS ever did. People who bought PSP were mostly attracted to games DS couldn't provide.

Interest were there. its just that no one expected Sony to just abandon games that demanded players to purchase Vita. So called 'Whales' who would buy the game regardless of quality if they can get what they wanted.

Then Sony failed to market, they failed to catch Capcom, they failed to support developers that defined PSP's success, then they ditched them altogether.

One of the most drastic example of this happening was South Korean market, where Vita was trouncing 3DS, until people realized Persona 4 Golden was going to be the last major title that appeals to former PSP users in that year.

They are doing that now, but with life cycle of console nearing its end, I don't think it will bounce back large enough.



Teeqoz said:
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:

Sony is not Nintendo. Sony makes money from software, Nintendo makes it from hardware.


Nintendo makes way way waaaaaay waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more money from software than they do from hardware.

Fair enough, but PS4's the first PS console sold at a profit from the start. So Nintendo makes way way very more money from hardware than Sony.



In this day and age, with the Internet, ignorance is a choice! And they're still choosing Ignorance! - Dr. Filthy Frank

Ko Ta Ku, Enough said as to how good that article is really. Should someone be allowed to write for a gaming website who uses LMAO in bullet points?

Regardless of how badly.... wait... no Sony's fault of Bioshock Vita not happening? when Bioshock 2 nearly ended the franchise with it's bad decisions? I wasn't aware that Sony owned the Bioshock (first game exclusive to the 360 for a year or so) Franchise that is news to me.

But outside of how bad the.... Wait... Sony put bad ports of games like Call of Duty:Declassified on the Vita, Well damn, People really do forget some of these huge IP's that Sony own and control when it comes to list wars on here, I had completely forgotten that Activision were first party to Sony.


as for the other points
- http://www.amazon.com/PlayStation-Vita-Memory-Card-64GB-PCH-Z641J/dp/B00F27JGVA/ref=sr_1_3?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1443478349&sr=1-3&keywords=ps+vita
a 64gb mem card for $20 less than they suggest the 32gb stick is.

- Suggesting people wouldn't pay 250 to play destiny on the toilet? I mean... it's not just destiny, it's having access to your PS4 remotely from anywhere you can connect to the internet for streaming some files from and it can be used as an extra controller when in range of the system as well as offering the off screen play that the wii-u tablet offers for some of its titles.

"Remember the PS2? One of the most successful video game consoles in history? Chock full of great games that could be ported to the Vita in various ways? Someone should remind Sony."
http://www.amazon.com/Metal-Gear-Solid-Collection-playstation-vita/dp/B007FQUEZ8/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1443478573&sr=8-1&keywords=ps+vita+mgs
http://www.amazon.com/Ratchet-Clank-Trilogy-Sony-Playstation-Vita/dp/B00KQDVTLA/ref=sr_1_4?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1443478580&sr=8-4&keywords=ps+vita+ratchet
http://www.amazon.com/FINAL-FANTASY-X-2-HD-Remaster-PlayStation/dp/B00HD4R5RW/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1443478594&sr=8-1&keywords=ps+vita+final+fantasy
http://www.amazon.com/Sly-Collection-PlayStation-Vita/dp/B00ICWO2CA/ref=sr_1_2?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1443478604&sr=8-2&keywords=ps+vita+sly+cooper
http://www.amazon.com/God-War-Collection-PlayStation-Vita/dp/B00G237L7Y/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1443478615&sr=8-1&keywords=ps+vita+god+of+war
http://www.amazon.com/Jak-Daxter-Collection-PlayStation-Vita/dp/B00CMD7574/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1443478627&sr=8-1&keywords=ps+vita+jak

I mean.... other than all those ps2 classics remastered for the Vita there is almost no proof of Sony (or other companies) bringing Ps2 love to the Vita (as well as obviously things like the psp GTA 3/Vice city spin offs) Final Fantasy 1-9 from the psone/psp area on the store.

I mean I'm not sure there is a single word of that Kotaku article that isn't click bait bullshit tbh, wait that first word isn't too bad if it's taken on it's own. "A" anything beyond that is too much.



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