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Forums - Sports Discussion - NBA Playoffs 2015 NBA FINALS. Warriors win Series 4-2!

 

WHO WILL WIN THE NBA FINALS?

Golden State Warriors 53 66.25%
 
Cleveland Cavaliers 27 33.75%
 
Total:80
Rpruett said:
AlfredoTurkey said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTI0Cdh-MwQ

Game 1 of the NBA finals, 1997, Jordan at the end of regulation. Exact same situation, totally different outcome. 

Yeah 'exact' same situation.  Like piss poor defense, yielding to an open shot for Jordan.   LeBron is a different player.   He's a better all-around player and it's not even close. Jordan was a better shooter.  LeBron makes teams signifnicantly better.  Jordan was able to stick a dagger into people.   Different players, different games. 

Jordan's  team was still a deep playoff contender when he left the Bulls. The Cavaliers immediately turned into one of the worst franchises in the NBA the moment LeBron left.  The Cavaliers immediately turned into favorites to go to the Finals the moment he returned.  LeBron's impact is immeasurably better than Jordan. 

If the Cavaliers supporting cast lifted a finger last night,  the Cavs win this game easily.  (In Golden State).   With Irving hurt, their chances are significantly down, potentially robbing us of a good series.   I wouldn't quite count the Cavs out yet though, if their supporting cast can actually step up -- LeBron and crew will give them a run for their money.

Well when it comes to shooting guards Michael Jordan is the greatest of all time and no one else comes even close Kobe Bryant is probably a distant second.  That being said once LeBron wins one more title I would put him ahead of Larry Bird as the greatest small forward of all time.



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Was hoping the series would go at least six which is highly unlikely to happen a sweep by the Warriors is much more likely now. Oh well at least the Stanley Cup playoffs will have at least five games.



I don't think we're giving the Warriors defense enough credit. Iguodala's defense on LeBron in OT and that last shot in regulation. And their team defense in general. Aside from LeBron and Kyrie, nobody else did jack for Cleveland, because the Warriors got back in time, closed out on their shooters. Plus, they have 3-4 different guys who can guard LeBron. And with Kyrie gone now, LeBron is the only person on that team that matters.

Think about it for a second, he had 44 pts, 8 rebs, and 7 assists... and the Cavaliers STILL lost.
And it took 38 shots attempts for him to get those 44 points.
LeBron can get 40 or even 50 points all he wants, if I'm Steve Kerr, I'd just play him one on one, and leave my other guys on their assignments, defensively.
Because what makes LeBron great, and the way he beats you are for entirely different reasons as to how Kobe Bryant, Larry Bird, or Michael Jordan would beat you.
Kobe, Larry, and Michael could beat you by scoring, seemingly at will, not only could they drive to the rim and finish almost at the way LeBron can (well maybe not so much Larry), they were also very good shooters as well. Kobe had the best mid range jumper in the game at one point, same with Michael. If you gave Bird a little bit of space, he was automatic. They could shoot, drive, post up, hit runners, fade aways, shoot off the dribble, in traffic. Those three guys could do it all offensively on offense.
LeBron is VERY good at getting to the rim at will and finishing strong, being 6'8" and 250 lbs, and the most physically gifted athlete in basketball history would help with that. But he doesn't have the complete offesnive package like Kobe, Larry, and MJ had. More specifically the jumpshot. Just look at how he's shot the ball this postseason, ESPECIALLY from 3 pt range.
So Kobe, Larry, and Michael beat there opponents with their ability to score, which forced teams to double team them, which would create shots and plays for guys like Pau Gasol, Kevin McHale, or Scottie Pippen, Derek Fisher, Robert Parish, or Steve Kerr.
LeBron beats you by driving to the rim, forcing the defense to collapse, and then dishing it out to the open man. LeBron's a PLAYMAKER, he's to Magic Johnson, as Kobe was to Michael.
LeBron beats you by making plays for everyone else, and getting the others in a rhythm FIRST, which forces the opposing team to stick to their assignments, and that = open season in the paint for LeBron to drive to the rim.
LeBron James the Playmaker, is the best player on the planet.
LeBron James the scorer, LeBron James the shooter, is above average at best.
If the Warriors defense just stays with their guys, then yes LeBron will drive to the rim a lot, get hot and drop 44, 8, and 7 again. But it's not gonna mean anything if he's the only one getting off.
He's gonna have to AVERAGE 44 points, 8 rebounds, and 7 assists, AT LEAST, for the Cavs to even have a chance against a healthy and deep Warriors team.
And that is just too much to ask from a guy who is already at 30 years old, even if that guy is LeBron James. Eventually, the weight of carrying the load and doing everything offensively is going to wear him out, to the point where you will see him settling more for jumpshots. A tired LeBron taking contested jumpshots = The End of of the Cavaliers
Best case scenario, I can see the Cavs getting one win, maybe two at home, and pushing it to 5 or 6 games.
And that's if the other guys show up and play good to help LeBron.
But if they play like they did in Game 1, now that the Warriors have their juices flowing... Then we're in for a quick and painful sweep.



Rpruett said:

Yeah 'exact' same situation.  Like piss poor defense, yielding to an open shot for Jordan.   LeBron is a different player.   He's a better all-around player and it's not even close. Jordan was a better shooter.  LeBron makes teams signifnicantly better.  Jordan was able to stick a dagger into people.   Different players, different games. 

Jordan's  team was still a deep playoff contender when he left the Bulls. The Cavaliers immediately turned into one of the worst franchises in the NBA the moment LeBron left.  The Cavaliers immediately turned into favorites to go to the Finals the moment he returned.  LeBron's impact is immeasurably better than Jordan. 

If the Cavaliers supporting cast lifted a finger last night,  the Cavs win this game easily.  (In Golden State).   With Irving hurt, their chances are significantly down, potentially robbing us of a good series.   I wouldn't quite count the Cavs out yet though, if their supporting cast can actually step up -- LeBron and crew will give them a run for their money.

If I remember correctly the Cavs weren't favorite when LBJ came back. I think it was the Bulls and Wizards that were the favorite.

The Cavs were playing awful Basketball early on too until the trades happened and they acquired Mozgov, Smith and Shumpert.

Jordan also had to go with a subpar Chicago team until they drafted Pippen and Horace Grant. So I think both men are equal in their impact for their respective generation.



tiffac said:
Rpruett said:

Yeah 'exact' same situation.  Like piss poor defense, yielding to an open shot for Jordan.   LeBron is a different player.   He's a better all-around player and it's not even close. Jordan was a better shooter.  LeBron makes teams signifnicantly better.  Jordan was able to stick a dagger into people.   Different players, different games. 

Jordan's  team was still a deep playoff contender when he left the Bulls. The Cavaliers immediately turned into one of the worst franchises in the NBA the moment LeBron left.  The Cavaliers immediately turned into favorites to go to the Finals the moment he returned.  LeBron's impact is immeasurably better than Jordan. 

If the Cavaliers supporting cast lifted a finger last night,  the Cavs win this game easily.  (In Golden State).   With Irving hurt, their chances are significantly down, potentially robbing us of a good series.   I wouldn't quite count the Cavs out yet though, if their supporting cast can actually step up -- LeBron and crew will give them a run for their money.

If I remember correctly the Cavs weren't favorite when LBJ came back. I think it was the Bulls and Wizards that were the favorite.

The Cavs were playing awful Basketball early on too until the trades happened and they acquired Mozgov, Smith and Shumpert.

Jordan also had to go with a subpar Chicago team until they drafted Pippen and Horace Grant. So I think both men are equal in their impact for their respective generation.

Yea maybe a few fans were spouting off how they were title favorites but you are correct most every expert had the Bulls in the East and the Wizards a close 2nd. The Cavs they said just didn't have enough pieces in place... obviously some trades later down the road helped.. LBJ got in a zone and went on a tear. Before all that happened the Cavs were pretty bad over a month into the NBA season. Either way, I totally agree. They are pretty equal in their impact for their teams in the generation they play. Michael would go into these zones where he was unguardable... James seems to do the same. 

If the Cavs lose this series that will give LeBron how many Finals losses? 4? That is A LOT of losing in very big games. MJ didn't do much of that. 



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Chasesdaddy84 said:
tiffac said:

If I remember correctly the Cavs weren't favorite when LBJ came back. I think it was the Bulls and Wizards that were the favorite.

The Cavs were playing awful Basketball early on too until the trades happened and they acquired Mozgov, Smith and Shumpert.

Jordan also had to go with a subpar Chicago team until they drafted Pippen and Horace Grant. So I think both men are equal in their impact for their respective generation.

Yea maybe a few fans were spouting off how they were title favorites but you are correct most every expert had the Bulls in the East and the Wizards a close 2nd. The Cavs they said just didn't have enough pieces in place... obviously some trades later down the road helped.. LBJ got in a zone and went on a tear. Before all that happened the Cavs were pretty bad over a month into the NBA season. Either way, I totally agree. They are pretty equal in their impact for their teams in the generation they play. Michael would go into these zones where he was unguardable... James seems to do the same. 

If the Cavs lose this series that will give LeBron how many Finals losses? 4? That is A LOT of losing in very big games. MJ didn't do much of that. 

The Bulls team had a lot more talent and chemestry you need both of those to win 72 regular season games like the 96 Bulls did.  The only team LeBron was on that comes close to being somewhat great was the 2013 Heat they dominated the east had a great regular season and a long regular season winning streak but even with all that they where barely better then the Spurs since it took them seven games to win the title and they needed some luck to win that series.  You got to give LeBron some credit for getting three completly different teams to the finals though the pre Heat Cavs, The Heat and the current Cavs team which has no remaing players from the previous finals team no other key player has done that although there been a couple of role players that done it like Robert Horrry with the Rockets the Lakers and the Spurs.



Chris Hu said:
Chasesdaddy84 said:
tiffac said:

If I remember correctly the Cavs weren't favorite when LBJ came back. I think it was the Bulls and Wizards that were the favorite.

The Cavs were playing awful Basketball early on too until the trades happened and they acquired Mozgov, Smith and Shumpert.

Jordan also had to go with a subpar Chicago team until they drafted Pippen and Horace Grant. So I think both men are equal in their impact for their respective generation.

Yea maybe a few fans were spouting off how they were title favorites but you are correct most every expert had the Bulls in the East and the Wizards a close 2nd. The Cavs they said just didn't have enough pieces in place... obviously some trades later down the road helped.. LBJ got in a zone and went on a tear. Before all that happened the Cavs were pretty bad over a month into the NBA season. Either way, I totally agree. They are pretty equal in their impact for their teams in the generation they play. Michael would go into these zones where he was unguardable... James seems to do the same. 

If the Cavs lose this series that will give LeBron how many Finals losses? 4? That is A LOT of losing in very big games. MJ didn't do much of that. 

The Bulls team had a lot more talent and chemestry you need both of those to win 72 regular season games like the 96 Bulls did.  The only team LeBron was on that comes close to being somewhat great was the 2013 Heat they dominated the east had a great regular season and a long regular season winning streak but even with all that they where barely better then the Spurs since it took them seven games to win the title and they needed some luck to win that series.  You got to give LeBron some credit for getting three completly different teams to the finals though the pre Heat Cavs, The Heat and the current Cavs team which has no remaing players from the previous finals team no other key player has done that although there been a couple of role players that done it like Robert Horrry with the Rockets the Lakers and the Spurs.

I can totally see where you're coming from and it is impossible to refute what you've said. LeBron has literally taken 3 entirely different teams (Cavs/Heat/Cavs) to the Finals... Though that team in Miami had D Wade who has shown he can win one without LeBron. Bosh was no joke. Ray Allen the list goes on and on. Some of those Heat teams were stacked. He still lost in the Finals to older slower Spurs team last year, and aging Dallas team, and IF he loses this series that will be his 4th Finals loss, and let's be real.. He will have lost them with some pretty stacked teams. Ok this years Cavs team was loaded but is now unloaded for the playoffs with every star BUT LBJ out. But those Heat teams were riddled with all stars and defensive super stars not to mention experience and clutch shooting. All of the same things MJ had. But MJ has done better with the same. It's all subjective and thus it is up for debate!! I totally see you're point of view though and it's easy to argue both ways. 



Well for me he only needs one more title to surpass Larry Bird as the greatest small forward of all time despite his sub par record in the Finals.  Getting another title will probably be pretty though if he stays in Clevland since Irving will probably never be close to 100% again and Love will more then likely leave for another team next season. 



Chris Hu said:

Well for me he only needs one more title to surpass Larry Bird as the greatest small forward of all time despite his sub par record in the Finals.  Getting another title will probably be pretty though if he stays in Clevland since Irving will probably never be close to 100% again and Love will more then likely leave for another team next season. 

I don't think he can leave Cleveland. His public image will forever be tarnished if he does again.



Chris Hu said:

Well for me he only needs one more title to surpass Larry Bird as the greatest small forward of all time despite his sub par record in the Finals.  Getting another title will probably be pretty though if he stays in Clevland since Irving will probably never be close to 100% again and Love will more then likely leave for another team next season. 

Sorry, but I can't agree with this.  Sure, he would have won more titles than Larry, but LeBron isn't going up against Magic's Lakers in the Finals.  Also, Larry is quite possibly the greatest clutch shooter in history and we know that LeBron isn't even close to that.



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