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Forums - Sales - Oct 25th Hardware UP

Mummelmann said:
These figures make zero sense, why was the PS4 adjusted down of all things? I wonder how on earth anyone could reach that conclusion given the latest batch of shipment numbers.

Predictably, Bayo 2 did virtually nothing for the Wii U hardware sales, all hardware saw a sales increase and with a low baseline to begin with, the percentage is bound to be higher, just like the 1800% (I think it was that) increase in Japan last October when people went bonkers. That said; the software sale themselves are a bit higher than I expected, I figured Bayo 2 would sell somewhere between half and 2/3 of that after the Japan release. Still; the 1 million lifetime crowd have got to get down to earth again very soon, it's just not going to happen and won't even be close seeing as how it was out of the Japanese top 40 after a month and dropped from a 6th place debut in the UK and straight out of the top 50 in the second week, it is safe to say that this title won't have any kind of legs.


Are the low sales just due to being on the Wii U? Would Bayonetta 2 and Wonderful 101 do a lot better on Xbox and Playstation - Platinum makes some of the best games out there yet their sales rarely reflect that

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re adjustments, perhaps at this time of year, and considering likely holiday demand, ioi believes >2 million and 1.7 million respectively for PS4 and Xb one is realistic head room for these consoles. Sony will certainly want to be able to meet demand with room to spare this holidays, so maybe stuffing the channels early is a way to make sure the chance of supply problems is minimised.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

Dunban67 said:
Mummelmann said:
These figures make zero sense, why was the PS4 adjusted down of all things? I wonder how on earth anyone could reach that conclusion given the latest batch of shipment numbers.

Predictably, Bayo 2 did virtually nothing for the Wii U hardware sales, all hardware saw a sales increase and with a low baseline to begin with, the percentage is bound to be higher, just like the 1800% (I think it was that) increase in Japan last October when people went bonkers. That said; the software sale themselves are a bit higher than I expected, I figured Bayo 2 would sell somewhere between half and 2/3 of that after the Japan release. Still; the 1 million lifetime crowd have got to get down to earth again very soon, it's just not going to happen and won't even be close seeing as how it was out of the Japanese top 40 after a month and dropped from a 6th place debut in the UK and straight out of the top 50 in the second week, it is safe to say that this title won't have any kind of legs.


Are the low sales just due to being on the Wii U? Would Bayonetta 2 and Wonderful 101 do a lot better on Xbox and Playstation - Platinum makes some of the best games out there yet their sales rarely reflect that

guaranteed Bayo 2 would have done better as a multiplat. Do you doubt this? The fanbase was there, and Ninty and Platinum were fools if they thought a majority of those fans would jump to Wii U.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

Aj_habfan said:
Can somebody explain to me why Microsoft only cut the Xbox One price in USA ?? I know the importance of the American market, but can they really afford to "give up" on Europe?

Its about picking your battles. All of last gen the PS3 was the by far more expensive console in EU and that didn't stop it outselling the 360 in every EU territory except the UK. With MS losing in NA, the one place they have a chance of at least competing with the PS4, it makes no sense fighting sony on 4 fronts when they can consolidate their efforts on the One (pun intended).

If MS can sell anywhere between 20M to 25M consoles in NA then they have redeemed their brand. So that way even if they lose this gen, they don't lose too much and can still make a profit. If they lose heavily in NA though, then its pretty much all over till the XB2.



Dunban67 said:
Mummelmann said:
These figures make zero sense, why was the PS4 adjusted down of all things? I wonder how on earth anyone could reach that conclusion given the latest batch of shipment numbers.

Predictably, Bayo 2 did virtually nothing for the Wii U hardware sales, all hardware saw a sales increase and with a low baseline to begin with, the percentage is bound to be higher, just like the 1800% (I think it was that) increase in Japan last October when people went bonkers. That said; the software sale themselves are a bit higher than I expected, I figured Bayo 2 would sell somewhere between half and 2/3 of that after the Japan release. Still; the 1 million lifetime crowd have got to get down to earth again very soon, it's just not going to happen and won't even be close seeing as how it was out of the Japanese top 40 after a month and dropped from a 6th place debut in the UK and straight out of the top 50 in the second week, it is safe to say that this title won't have any kind of legs.


Are the low sales just due to being on the Wii U? Would Bayonetta 2 and Wonderful 101 do a lot better on Xbox and Playstation - Platinum makes some of the best games out there yet their sales rarely reflect that


There's a reason I have always resented sales as a metric for quality, you'd be amazed at how many subscribe to that idea.

There are many games of high quality that sold very poorly, like Beyond Good & Evil, GTA Chinatown Wars on DS (sold very poorly compared to the mainline games on home consoles, especially considering the massive installed base), Psychonauts sold practically nothing, Grim Fandango, Okami, for a few examples. I think, in many cases, the low sales can attributed to the environment they release in, perhaps they are of a unique flavour in visuals and gameplay that get overshadowed by simpler and more mainstream alternatives in the genre on a given platform or perhaps (as in the Wii U's case, in my opinion) the title is presented in a platform environment that has little else bearing any resemblance to the title and few other titles that are likely to appeal to the same customer, greatly reducing the purchasing incentive for the hardware itself.

I do think that Bayo 2 would have performed better on PS, for instance, given that this is a platform that is more likely to appeal to what I imagine is the core audience of such a title but I'm not so sure about W101; it is a quirky title that fits the Wii U's image better than Xbox or PS, in my opinion, and I believe that this odd but fantastic little title was destined for obscurity simply due the nature of the product itself and its presentation. Lots of great music and good quality movies get ignored all the time. Quality =/= appeal, as it stands in today's consumer minds and the modern entertainment arena.

Look at the PSP and DS' top 20 bestsellers; it illustrates perfectly the point I'm making on appealing to the core audience of any given platform. For instance; GTA: Chinatown wars (as mentioned above) is at spot #100 on the DS (and the only GTA released there at that, leaving it entirely without competition) list while spots 1 and 3 on the PSP lists are GTA titles (the two of them also likely stole most of the customers away from Chinatown Wars on the PSP since they were more traditional in their gameplay and followed a more similar narrative as well, which ties into my point of games being outshone by more mainstream alternatives in the same genre, or same franchise even, as is the case here).

In short; yes, I do believe that being on the Wii U will ultimately cause lifetime sales to be lower than they could have been on a platform with a different core customer but I also think that this title is quirky and unique enough in certain aspects to be outdone by other, more mainstream alternatives on said platforms (basically, I'm saying that Bayo 2 was likely never destined for epic sales regardless due to the nature of the product). Like I mentioned; quality =/= appeal.



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I have two options for the downgrade on PS4/X1 sales number. Either ioi didn't want WiiU to fell lonely getting sized down and then put the others down as well.

The second seem more likely in the light of the rumours of returned consoles of the Destiny bundle bombing... Ioi cut 500k from PS4 and some couple 100ks from X1 because of the returned consoles.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Where do you guys think PS4 and X1 are suppose to be?



Mummelmann said:
Dunban67 said:
Mummelmann said:
These figures make zero sense, why was the PS4 adjusted down of all things? I wonder how on earth anyone could reach that conclusion given the latest batch of shipment numbers.

Predictably, Bayo 2 did virtually nothing for the Wii U hardware sales, all hardware saw a sales increase and with a low baseline to begin with, the percentage is bound to be higher, just like the 1800% (I think it was that) increase in Japan last October when people went bonkers. That said; the software sale themselves are a bit higher than I expected, I figured Bayo 2 would sell somewhere between half and 2/3 of that after the Japan release. Still; the 1 million lifetime crowd have got to get down to earth again very soon, it's just not going to happen and won't even be close seeing as how it was out of the Japanese top 40 after a month and dropped from a 6th place debut in the UK and straight out of the top 50 in the second week, it is safe to say that this title won't have any kind of legs.


Are the low sales just due to being on the Wii U? Would Bayonetta 2 and Wonderful 101 do a lot better on Xbox and Playstation - Platinum makes some of the best games out there yet their sales rarely reflect that


There's a reason I have always resented sales as a metric for quality, you'd be amazed at how many subscribe to that idea.

There are many games of high quality that sold very poorly, like Beyond Good & Evil, GTA Chinatown Wars on DS (sold very poorly compared to the mainline games on home consoles, especially considering the massive installed base), Psychonauts sold practically nothing, Grim Fandango, Okami, for a few examples. I think, in many cases, the low sales can attributed to the environment they release in, perhaps they are of a unique flavour in visuals and gameplay that get overshadowed by simpler and more mainstream alternatives in the genre on a given platform or perhaps (as in the Wii U's case, in my opinion) the title is presented in a platform environment that has little else bearing any resemblance to the title and few other titles that are likely to appeal to the same customer, greatly reducing the purchasing incentive for the hardware itself.

I do think that Bayo 2 would have performed better on PS, for instance, given that this is a platform that is more likely to appeal to what I imagine is the core audience of such a title but I'm not so sure about W101; it is a quirky title that fits the Wii U's image better than Xbox or PS, in my opinion, and I believe that this odd but fantastic little title was destined for obscurity simply due the nature of the product itself and its presentation. Lots of great music and good quality movies get ignored all the time. Quality =/= appeal, as it stands in today's consumer minds and the modern entertainment arena.

Look at the PSP and DS' top 20 bestsellers; it illustrates perfectly the point I'm making on appealing to the core audience of any given platform. For instance; GTA: Chinatown wars (as mentioned above) is at spot #100 on the DS (and the only GTA released there at that, leaving it entirely without competition) list while spots 1 and 3 on the PSP lists are GTA titles (the two of them also likely stole most of the customers away from Chinatown Wars on the PSP since they were more traditional in their gameplay and followed a more similar narrative as well, which ties into my point of games being outshone by more mainstream alternatives in the same genre, or same franchise even, as is the case here).

In short; yes, I do believe that being on the Wii U will ultimately cause lifetime sales to be lower than they could have been on a platform with a different core customer but I also think that this title is quirky and unique enough in certain aspects to be outdone by other, more mainstream alternatives on said platforms (basically, I'm saying that Bayo 2 was likely never destined for epic sales regardless due to the nature of the product). Like I mentioned; quality =/= appeal.



Well said - You mentioned Okami, a great game I have played and could not understand between high ratings and word of mouth why more people would not pick it up sooner or later - I played it in the Wii but I think it was on PS3?? Too maybe - Due to the super hero look of the Wonderful 101, I think with the right marketing and lots of it, it could have sold much better. It has the initial visual appeal to attract the younger market but the game play to attract more experienced gamers - and it looks harmless enough for parents to pick it up for their kids if the kids told them they wanted it- but W 101 marketing was practically non existent so we will prob never know what could have been For now at least it seems any non 1st party Nintendo game will struggle in the Wii u as well- particularly niche titles -

Xxain said:
Where do you guys think PS4 and X1 are suppose to be?

Minimum 6.5m and 13m



Ka-pi96 said:
Xxain said:
Where do you guys think PS4 and X1 are suppose to be?

PS4 hovering around about 28 million and Xbox One just below 19 million


More credible and in line with VGC sold through and shipments going by WiiU metrics.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."