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Forums - Sales Discussion - When will PS4 reach 10 million sold? - ioi comments on undertracking

Lastgengamer on 19 August 2014
BeElite said:
Lastgengamer said:

Sure we now know that PS4 sold over ten million to customers, but moving forward can we expect to keep receiving these updates from the game companies? There is an advantage to tracking numbers the VGC way, as at least we will continue to have estimates of were everything stands in terms of sales at regular weekly intervals.


What good is an estimate if you know its wrong casue you have the correct numbers ???

In this case we do, although who but Sony knows when we get the next official update?



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GamechaserBE on 19 August 2014

The moderators are way to kind in this thread =p.

Can't put the numbers into some 'rest of the world' chartz?



legend92(3) on 19 August 2014
BeElite said:
shikamaru317 said:

Yeah, I have to wonder about that as well. How could Sony possibly know how many they sold through to consumers? It's not like they can ring up every game retailer in every country where the PS4 is available and ask them how many PS4's they've sold. Now obviously Sony knows how much they've shipped to retailers, but how could they possibly know how many they've sold to consumers except from compiling the exact same numbers from NPD, GFK, and Media Create that ioi also uses, numbers that don't add up to 10m? It seems to me like they must be making guesses for the remaining regions that don't get tracked by a firm, the same exact thing that ioi is doing, except for some reason Sony is guessing about 600k higher for those regions than ioi is, presumably because they've shipped proportionally more PS4's than PS3's to those regions, which would explain why ioi is off since he's guessing sales for those untracked regions based on PS3 trends.

Stock burn through.

If you sale your shipment the same week it arrives its easy as hell to know how much you have sold, the vgc ioi apolagists trying to pretand sony is wrong are hilarious.  

Sony is not guessing vgc are, they know every freaking market and ther demend there, its really that simple.  If im getting requests for more stock on the daily its selling X.  If i get it every week its selling Y if every months its Z.  

Vg is using 360/PS3 data to guess PS4, no surprise its not working well.  Then factor in growth in emerging markets and its easy to see why they are confused and numbers not inline with legit sony ones.

This. Sony knows how many they sold beacuse retailers order more and every retailer would relay info back to sony as they would work together to ensure stock meets demand. I work in retail and suppliers don't just send stock out and keep sending it. They know how much of what they sell in every market and keep track of it. I don't get why people don't understand this.



Alby_da_Wolf on 19 August 2014
ioi said:

On the subject of Sony's 10m announcement and adjustments and in an attempt to be fully transparent - until we can figure out where the "missing" 600k units have been sold then we obviously can't adjust the figures since they certainly aren't in the USA, Canada, Mexico and South America, UK, France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Benelux, Scandinavia, Eastern Europe, Russia, Australia, New Zealand or Japan in which our data is very accurate and lines up well with other data providers. Our estimates for the other regions (Middle East, Africa, Asia) are rough estimates based on trends seen with PS2 / PS3.

Our data for the regions we track as listed above for PS4 adds up to around 9.0m which should be accurate to +/- 100k. We estimate a further 140k in the Middle East and Africa and 290k in the remainder of Asia taking us to the 9.4m you can see on the homepage.

If Sony's numbers are to be believed as being accurate sell-through then clearly they have sold an enormously disproportional amount in one of those regions and once we know which one we can make the necessary adjustments. We can't just add 600k units to the total - we need to know which regions to adjust so we can ensure that we are on track moving forwards. This is why adjustments don't always happen straight away or sometimes not at all - we can't just randomly add sales here and there to make things add up!

The same goes for complaints about PS3 and 360 sales - until we can get hard data for regions such as the Middle East, Africa, Korea, Singapore, Hong Kong, India, China and so on then the best we can do is extrapolate based on general market trends and make best estimates for specific platform sales in those regions. If you wish to help and know of any reports or research in those regions then let me know and we can compare to our estimates and make adjustments as necessary.


I'm perfectly fine with the explanation, but hey, this is a site that has in numbers one of its strongest points, so you'll have to accept you can't avoid attracting people that have an obsessive-compulsive attitude with numbers themselves.   



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Conegamer on 19 August 2014
GamechaserBE said:
The moderators are way to kind in this thread =p.

Can't put the numbers into some 'rest of the world' chartz?

It's not being kind, it's more being reasonable. If you aren't willing to listen to ioi's reasoning, then there's not an awful lot more you can do.



 

Here lies the dearly departed Nintendomination Thread.

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Norris2k on 19 August 2014

ioi's explanations make a lot of sense. I always wondered why it was so long to adjust the sales, and he makes clear they can't just get the number as a fact and randomly distribute such a difference across territories. They need details and checks.



Conegamer on 19 August 2014

Can't remember if I ever said it explicitly, but I really appreciate the explanation and the clarity you're providing here. Keep up the good work!



 

Here lies the dearly departed Nintendomination Thread.

DonFerrari on 19 August 2014

We complain a lot because we want Always better numbers but the site is good as is and ioi will keep adjusting the methodology.
For anyone with half a brain we know that right now vgc tracking is quite equivalent for USA+JP+Some of Europe and 30% of WW so just do as you should. Ioi can't correct without knowing where (but could have a tab of cumulative error that when discovered where to put could be zeroed), we can Just assume weekly sales around 30% more for Ps4 and stop bitching at ioi.
But I was under the impression that the leaked numbers for Germany were all current my bad on this. And on psn account, a lot of countries don't have theirs and some users have several accounts elsewhere (I have Canadá, Usa, Uk and Brazil) and I know several people have multiple accounts for Jp, Eu and Usa because of psnstore.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

squibbfire on 19 August 2014

Vg charts might be slow to post newest data....The last of us I'm sure sold quite a few consoles...



Locknuts on 19 August 2014

I can't believe what I've read so far in this thread. Could we get a link on the front page of VGChartz to the policy on hardware numbers and how they're calculated? The ignorance amongst members here is astounding.

If they just create numbers 'because Sony said so', there goes their credibility and consistency. Sony's numbers would be estimates too.

As others have said, I also can't believe how polite the mods have been. VGChartz have their methods. If you don't like them, then that's your problem, not theirs.